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> Going into an Apple store and asking for (and buying) the computer that comes in the smallest box, which I had a good reason to want at the time This is such

by WA 5y ago

> Going into an Apple store and asking for (and buying) the computer that comes in the smallest box, which I had a good reason to want at the time This is such an odd example. Because OP makes an uncommon request, the sales person can't parse what this request is about, and neither can I for that matter, and OP doesn't give a reason. So the sales person thinks: What an odd request, which in turn is parsed by the OP as sales person thinks I'm stupid for asking something that the sales person doesn't understand. In the end, OP might want to feel superior by asking stupid-looking questions on purpose and feeling above the sales person for not being able to get to why this question is asked. Maybe just explain WHY you ask this or that and nobody thinks you're stupid anymore.

frumiousirc 5y ago
Perhaps this example is intentionally ambiguous in order to illicit an informal survey of how internet conversations deal with ambiguous tales of social interactions. Taking OP's thesis about the origin of "stupid questions" at face value, this small meta lift seems fitting.
- WA 5y ago
  Ok, if we want to have a meta discussion, let me ask two stupid questions: Why did OP not tell the store clerk why a small box mattered? Why did OP not tell the reader why he didn't tell the clerk?
  - Zababa 5y ago
    Why would the clerk need to know that, and why would the reader need to know that? Do you need a justification for buying something from a store? I think that's the lesson here. If you think he needed to give justification, you may still consider him stupid in a way.
    - ritchiea 5y ago
      Why does the reader need to read this blog post? We don’t but we think we might learn something or be entertained. Withholding a piece of information that lots of readers are naturally curious about is odd. I like the post & Dan Luu’s writing in general but I’m dying to know the why behind the computer in the smallest box request.
    - WA 5y ago
      > Why would the clerk need to know that Because most average users ask for one thing, but actually need something else and it is the job of a service person to get down to what the customer actually wants. Disclosing intent of unusual requests helps to find a solution in a faster way. It's also respectful to the clerk. Furthermore, people are more willing to cooperate if they know a reason. > why would the reader need to know that? Because it stands out as an odd story and it is quite important to establish context if the reader wants to evaluate if OP asks objectively stupid questions, has a way of phrasing questions in a stupid way, or if the person asked truly thinks OP is stupid. That's what this post is about with a strong tendency that OP wants the reader to think that everybody judging him is stupid. In a way, the post is a humble-brag. > Do you need a justification for buying something from a store? No, but if I make people run around for me, I'd rather give them a reason. > I think that's the lesson here. If you think he needed to give justification, you may still consider him stupid in a way. I don't think he's stupid, but I think if someone is being judged as stupid all the time, it might not always be the other people (what OP makes us want to believe), but the way how OP interacts with his environment.
      - bena 5y ago
        > > Why would the clerk need to know that > Because most average users ask for one thing, but actually need something else and it is the job of a service person to get down to what the customer actually wants. Disclosing intent of unusual requests helps to find a solution in a faster way. It's also respectful to the clerk. Furthermore, people are more willing to cooperate if they know a reason. Which is hilarious because as software developers, we run into this all the time. People who request things or ask how to do things and it turns out what they needed was something else entirely. Why wouldn't this apply to other areas.
      - Zababa 5y ago
        > Because most average users ask for one thing, but actually need something else and it is the job of a service person to get down to what the customer actually wants. Disclosing intent of unusual requests helps to find a solution in a faster way. As I said elsewhere, I think it's an instance of the XY problem and we agree here, but I think the response of the clerk could have been something like "I have a lot of clients that ask for X when they need Y. If I give them X, they may come back and complain, and it will be a mistake on my part. So I'm sorry if I'm being too insistent with it, but I really need to be sure that you want X and not Y, especially since your request sounds a lot like what people say when they want Y", to which you could reply "Oh I perfectly understand, I work in software and we have this all the time with clients, I would do the same thing in your place. I assure you, I really need X and not Y." or something. > It's also respectful to the clerk. It may be more respectful than what happened the way the thing was narrated, but I think there is nothing "respectful" about disclosing information you may not want to disclose, which seem to be the case here (or the author is being obtuse). > That's what this post is about with a strong tendency that OP wants the reader to think that everybody judging him is stupid. I don't agree about the intentions of the author here. My interpretation is that he found something cool, efficient, somewhat counterintuive and want to share it. That seems to be in line with his other posts. > I don't think he's stupid, but I think if someone is being judged as stupid all the time, it might not always be the other people (what OP makes us want to believe), but the way how OP interacts with his environment. That's very true too. We only have his version so that's a possibility.
strken 5y ago
You don't even need to explain why. Just say "I need the computer that comes in the smallest box. I know this is weird, right? I need it for reasons that would take a long time to explain, but I promise they make sense." A bit of empathy for the baffled Apple store employee on the other side of the conversation and nobody has to waste time or feel stupid. Maybe there's additional context we're missing.
- sethammons 5y ago
  Key word: empathy. I'm not seeing it in the examples in the post.
JJMcJ 5y ago
I know nothing about the products involved, but I assume it was along the lines of "I want a Mac Foo 342, which happens to come in the smallest box, so you can't miss it".
- rossvor 5y ago
  But surely the "I want a Mac Foo 342" is sufficient? The latter part of sentence just adds unnecessary confusion. I worked selling laptops before, and I honestly wouldn't remember which one came in the smallest box (and they usually came in very similar sized boxes anyway, so likely there would be several different models matching "smallest box" criteria). I think Apple employee was fully justified in their bafflement at the request.
  - JJMcJ 5y ago
    I think we are in agreement. Author was just trying to be clever at the expense of retail employees. Generally trying to be clever is ordinary life is not a good idea.

by WA 5y ago

frumiousirc 5y ago

Perhaps this example is intentionally ambiguous in order to illicit an informal survey of how internet conversations deal with ambiguous tales of social interactions. Taking OP's thesis about the origin of "stupid questions" at face value, this small meta lift seems fitting.

WA 5y ago
Ok, if we want to have a meta discussion, let me ask two stupid questions: Why did OP not tell the store clerk why a small box mattered? Why did OP not tell the reader why he didn't tell the clerk?
- Zababa 5y ago
  Why would the clerk need to know that, and why would the reader need to know that? Do you need a justification for buying something from a store? I think that's the lesson here. If you think he needed to give justification, you may still consider him stupid in a way.
  - ritchiea 5y ago
    Why does the reader need to read this blog post? We don’t but we think we might learn something or be entertained. Withholding a piece of information that lots of readers are naturally curious about is odd. I like the post & Dan Luu’s writing in general but I’m dying to know the why behind the computer in the smallest box request.
  - WA 5y ago
    > Why would the clerk need to know that Because most average users ask for one thing, but actually need something else and it is the job of a service person to get down to what the customer actually wants. Disclosing intent of unusual requests helps to find a solution in a faster way. It's also respectful to the clerk. Furthermore, people are more willing to cooperate if they know a reason. > why would the reader need to know that? Because it stands out as an odd story and it is quite important to establish context if the reader wants to evaluate if OP asks objectively stupid questions, has a way of phrasing questions in a stupid way, or if the person asked truly thinks OP is stupid. That's what this post is about with a strong tendency that OP wants the reader to think that everybody judging him is stupid. In a way, the post is a humble-brag. > Do you need a justification for buying something from a store? No, but if I make people run around for me, I'd rather give them a reason. > I think that's the lesson here. If you think he needed to give justification, you may still consider him stupid in a way. I don't think he's stupid, but I think if someone is being judged as stupid all the time, it might not always be the other people (what OP makes us want to believe), but the way how OP interacts with his environment.
    - bena 5y ago
      > > Why would the clerk need to know that > Because most average users ask for one thing, but actually need something else and it is the job of a service person to get down to what the customer actually wants. Disclosing intent of unusual requests helps to find a solution in a faster way. It's also respectful to the clerk. Furthermore, people are more willing to cooperate if they know a reason. Which is hilarious because as software developers, we run into this all the time. People who request things or ask how to do things and it turns out what they needed was something else entirely. Why wouldn't this apply to other areas.
    - Zababa 5y ago
      > Because most average users ask for one thing, but actually need something else and it is the job of a service person to get down to what the customer actually wants. Disclosing intent of unusual requests helps to find a solution in a faster way. As I said elsewhere, I think it's an instance of the XY problem and we agree here, but I think the response of the clerk could have been something like "I have a lot of clients that ask for X when they need Y. If I give them X, they may come back and complain, and it will be a mistake on my part. So I'm sorry if I'm being too insistent with it, but I really need to be sure that you want X and not Y, especially since your request sounds a lot like what people say when they want Y", to which you could reply "Oh I perfectly understand, I work in software and we have this all the time with clients, I would do the same thing in your place. I assure you, I really need X and not Y." or something. > It's also respectful to the clerk. It may be more respectful than what happened the way the thing was narrated, but I think there is nothing "respectful" about disclosing information you may not want to disclose, which seem to be the case here (or the author is being obtuse). > That's what this post is about with a strong tendency that OP wants the reader to think that everybody judging him is stupid. I don't agree about the intentions of the author here. My interpretation is that he found something cool, efficient, somewhat counterintuive and want to share it. That seems to be in line with his other posts. > I don't think he's stupid, but I think if someone is being judged as stupid all the time, it might not always be the other people (what OP makes us want to believe), but the way how OP interacts with his environment. That's very true too. We only have his version so that's a possibility.

strken 5y ago

You don't even need to explain why. Just say "I need the computer that comes in the smallest box. I know this is weird, right? I need it for reasons that would take a long time to explain, but I promise they make sense." A bit of empathy for the baffled Apple store employee on the other side of the conversation and nobody has to waste time or feel stupid. Maybe there's additional context we're missing.

sethammons 5y ago
Key word: empathy. I'm not seeing it in the examples in the post.

JJMcJ 5y ago

I know nothing about the products involved, but I assume it was along the lines of "I want a Mac Foo 342, which happens to come in the smallest box, so you can't miss it".

rossvor 5y ago
But surely the "I want a Mac Foo 342" is sufficient? The latter part of sentence just adds unnecessary confusion. I worked selling laptops before, and I honestly wouldn't remember which one came in the smallest box (and they usually came in very similar sized boxes anyway, so likely there would be several different models matching "smallest box" criteria). I think Apple employee was fully justified in their bafflement at the request.
- JJMcJ 5y ago
  I think we are in agreement. Author was just trying to be clever at the expense of retail employees. Generally trying to be clever is ordinary life is not a good idea.