4 ms·

Gtk-rs is still pretty bare bone. I tried to do my part by removing boilerplate using macros [1] [2], but it is still complicated to design GTK apps. Even more

Gtk-rs is still pretty bare bone. I tried to do my part by removing boilerplate using macros [1] [2], but it is still complicated to design GTK apps. Even more now, because Glade has been deprecated for GTK4 and no visual editor is available to replace it for now, making developers manually write XML while exploring the sparse documentation. This is a regression for developers' experience. I am really trying to like GTK after using Qt a lot in the past, but there is just too much effort. Things should be as simple as VB6/WinForms. With no visual GUI editor, I find myself to just write CLI tools in Rust instead of going the extra mile and creating GUIs. [1] https://github.com/MicroJoe/gladis https://github.com/MicroJoe/gladis [2] https://github.com/MicroJoe/gtk_liststore_item https://github.com/MicroJoe/gtk_liststore_item

curioussavage 5y ago
I haven’t tried it yet myself but there is https://gitlab.gnome.org/jpu/cambalache https://gitlab.gnome.org/jpu/cambalache which supports both gtk3 and 4
- deaddabe 5y ago
  I downloaded and tried it just now. When creating a project, I get an empty .ui file with no possibility to add any widget. This project still seems in its infancy, or I am doing something wrong. It also seems to enforce a "framework" instead of just being a graphical .ui file editor. How I am supposed to use this if I am using Rust instead of Python, and Relm instead of their MVC framework? I miss Glade (and it had issues!).
  - phoneperson 5y ago
    Try writing the name of the widget in the search bar in the top left. Something like GtkWindow.
    - deaddabe 5y ago
      Thanks, it works. However adding a GtkApplicationWindow and a GtkButton inside of the component tree is not updating the preview area. Adding a know valid GTK3 .ui file [0] does not update the preview area either. Seems like the "preview" button is also missing from Glade. Oh well, let's edit XML files afterall. :) [0] https://github.com/MicroJoe/gtk_liststore_item/blob/master/gtk_liststore_item/examples/simple/simple.ui https://github.com/MicroJoe/gtk_liststore_item/blob/master/g...
      - phoneperson 5y ago
        Yeah, it is still very early on in development. I am personally a fan of QtCreator, it is very similar to how visual studio used to work regarding ui creation.
  - md8z 5y ago
    The UI is a bit rough and still unstable, I think you have to press the search button and then type the name of the widget in the search box and double click. It's just a .ui file editor, so unfortunately you can't use it with Relm. Maybe someone could write a tool that converts .ui files to Relm code. Although I guess it would be a one-way transition, so perhaps not so useful.
    - deaddabe 5y ago
      You do not have to convert .ui files to Relm code, see gladis's relm example [0]. [0] https://github.com/MicroJoe/gladis/blob/master/gladis/examples/relm/main.rs https://github.com/MicroJoe/gladis/blob/master/gladis/exampl...
      - md8z 5y ago
        Sorry, I thought you meant if you wanted to save it in the style of those Relm declarative macros.
- smoldesu 5y ago
  Thanks for sharing, it seems to be in heavy development right now though. I'll admit though, forcing you to choose from 5 stylesheets before implementing basic design features did get a chuckle out of me. What's GNOME may never change, I suppose.
nyanpasu64 5y ago
Personally I am philosophically opposed to hard-coded widget positions like Win32, and Qt's graphical layout editing system is awkward to edit, so I mostly write code. :(
md8z 5y ago
That "gladis" crate seems to be redundant since it does the same thing as template widgets [1]. I would say you can probably drop that one. The "gtk_liststore_item" crate seems useful, have you thought about starting a conversation with the gtk-rs developers to try to upstream something like that? [1]: https://gtk-rs.org/gtk4-rs/stable/latest/book/interface_builder.html#composite-templates https://gtk-rs.org/gtk4-rs/stable/latest/book/interface_buil...
- deaddabe 5y ago
  I cannot find any relevant documentation while searching "gtk template widgets" in my favorite search engines. Do you have a link? Maybe this crate is still needed because of discoverability issues, if one cannot find an alternative easily. I have not started to discuss with gtk_rs team for the moment. Since this second crate has less "stars", I guess the gladis crate should be figured out first: incorporated, or documented in gtk-rs so that it is made obsolete. EDIT: here is the feature request to merge gtk_liststore_item into gtk-rs: https://github.com/gtk-rs/gtk-rs-core/issues/297 https://github.com/gtk-rs/gtk-rs-core/issues/297
  - md8z 5y ago
    Sorry, I edited my comment. Check that for the link about templates. This tutorial also has a C example: https://github.com/ToshioCP/Gtk4-tutorial/blob/main/gfm/sec21.md https://github.com/ToshioCP/Gtk4-tutorial/blob/main/gfm/sec2...
  - jms55 5y ago
    The term to look up is "gtk composite templates". The gtk4-rs book has a tutorial on them: https://gtk-rs.org/gtk4-rs/stable/latest/book/interface_builder.html#composite-templates https://gtk-rs.org/gtk4-rs/stable/latest/book/interface_buil... Gladis seems to wrap the child widgets in a regular Rust struct. The composite template stuff in GTK uses subclassing to make a new widget wrapping the child widgets. GTK has a better approach imo - the issue is that the macros for subclassing in gtk4-rs are _really_ verbose and confusing. You need two different structs, with several trait impls on them. Adding GObject properties is verbose and tedious. Adding methods on the widget is confusing - it's confusing which struct the method goes on and how to access the widget in each part. Overall I liked GTK for the end result it produces, but not the API. I've been meaning to give Relm4 a try - it seems like a much better way to handle state and widget composition in Rust than the vanilla GTK stuff.
smoldesu 5y ago
Oh, I haven't written much with the 4.0 version yet (I'll cling to 3.38 till I die), so that's news to me. I'll just toss that in the pile of "user/developer regressions introduced with GTK4/Gnome 40", I suppose.

curioussavage 5y ago

I haven’t tried it yet myself but there is https://gitlab.gnome.org/jpu/cambalache https://gitlab.gnome.org/jpu/cambalache which supports both gtk3 and 4

deaddabe 5y ago
I downloaded and tried it just now. When creating a project, I get an empty .ui file with no possibility to add any widget. This project still seems in its infancy, or I am doing something wrong. It also seems to enforce a "framework" instead of just being a graphical .ui file editor. How I am supposed to use this if I am using Rust instead of Python, and Relm instead of their MVC framework? I miss Glade (and it had issues!).
- phoneperson 5y ago
  Try writing the name of the widget in the search bar in the top left. Something like GtkWindow.
  - deaddabe 5y ago
    Thanks, it works. However adding a GtkApplicationWindow and a GtkButton inside of the component tree is not updating the preview area. Adding a know valid GTK3 .ui file [0] does not update the preview area either. Seems like the "preview" button is also missing from Glade. Oh well, let's edit XML files afterall. :) [0] https://github.com/MicroJoe/gtk_liststore_item/blob/master/gtk_liststore_item/examples/simple/simple.ui https://github.com/MicroJoe/gtk_liststore_item/blob/master/g...
    - phoneperson 5y ago
      Yeah, it is still very early on in development. I am personally a fan of QtCreator, it is very similar to how visual studio used to work regarding ui creation.
- md8z 5y ago
  The UI is a bit rough and still unstable, I think you have to press the search button and then type the name of the widget in the search box and double click. It's just a .ui file editor, so unfortunately you can't use it with Relm. Maybe someone could write a tool that converts .ui files to Relm code. Although I guess it would be a one-way transition, so perhaps not so useful.
  - deaddabe 5y ago
    You do not have to convert .ui files to Relm code, see gladis's relm example [0]. [0] https://github.com/MicroJoe/gladis/blob/master/gladis/examples/relm/main.rs https://github.com/MicroJoe/gladis/blob/master/gladis/exampl...
    - md8z 5y ago
      Sorry, I thought you meant if you wanted to save it in the style of those Relm declarative macros.
smoldesu 5y ago
Thanks for sharing, it seems to be in heavy development right now though. I'll admit though, forcing you to choose from 5 stylesheets before implementing basic design features did get a chuckle out of me. What's GNOME may never change, I suppose.

nyanpasu64 5y ago

Personally I am philosophically opposed to hard-coded widget positions like Win32, and Qt's graphical layout editing system is awkward to edit, so I mostly write code. :(

md8z 5y ago

That "gladis" crate seems to be redundant since it does the same thing as template widgets [1]. I would say you can probably drop that one. The "gtk_liststore_item" crate seems useful, have you thought about starting a conversation with the gtk-rs developers to try to upstream something like that? [1]: https://gtk-rs.org/gtk4-rs/stable/latest/book/interface_builder.html#composite-templates https://gtk-rs.org/gtk4-rs/stable/latest/book/interface_buil...

deaddabe 5y ago
I cannot find any relevant documentation while searching "gtk template widgets" in my favorite search engines. Do you have a link? Maybe this crate is still needed because of discoverability issues, if one cannot find an alternative easily. I have not started to discuss with gtk_rs team for the moment. Since this second crate has less "stars", I guess the gladis crate should be figured out first: incorporated, or documented in gtk-rs so that it is made obsolete. EDIT: here is the feature request to merge gtk_liststore_item into gtk-rs: https://github.com/gtk-rs/gtk-rs-core/issues/297 https://github.com/gtk-rs/gtk-rs-core/issues/297
- md8z 5y ago
  Sorry, I edited my comment. Check that for the link about templates. This tutorial also has a C example: https://github.com/ToshioCP/Gtk4-tutorial/blob/main/gfm/sec21.md https://github.com/ToshioCP/Gtk4-tutorial/blob/main/gfm/sec2...
- jms55 5y ago
  The term to look up is "gtk composite templates". The gtk4-rs book has a tutorial on them: https://gtk-rs.org/gtk4-rs/stable/latest/book/interface_builder.html#composite-templates https://gtk-rs.org/gtk4-rs/stable/latest/book/interface_buil... Gladis seems to wrap the child widgets in a regular Rust struct. The composite template stuff in GTK uses subclassing to make a new widget wrapping the child widgets. GTK has a better approach imo - the issue is that the macros for subclassing in gtk4-rs are _really_ verbose and confusing. You need two different structs, with several trait impls on them. Adding GObject properties is verbose and tedious. Adding methods on the widget is confusing - it's confusing which struct the method goes on and how to access the widget in each part. Overall I liked GTK for the end result it produces, but not the API. I've been meaning to give Relm4 a try - it seems like a much better way to handle state and widget composition in Rust than the vanilla GTK stuff.

smoldesu 5y ago

Oh, I haven't written much with the 4.0 version yet (I'll cling to 3.38 till I die), so that's news to me. I'll just toss that in the pile of "user/developer regressions introduced with GTK4/Gnome 40", I suppose.