7 ms·

This is not going to help. You have to be 21. Also, California's AB5 law has outlawed owner operators, which is a very large chunk of how trucking has worked

This is not going to help. You have to be 21. Also, California's AB5 law has outlawed owner operators, which is a very large chunk of how trucking has worked for decades, making trucking a less desirable career. This is also one of the big reasons for the large backlog at the CA ports.

scohesc 5y ago
I find it hard to believe that a single state is able to cause such large supply problems nationally (and internationally) because of a law barring independent trucking companies from doing business in their state. But then again, it _is_ California so I'm not surprised. I just hope that maybe whoever is making the laws comes to their senses, because they're not just hurting California with this legislation.
tomschlick 5y ago
Is there anything that CA hasn't over-regulated to stupid levels yet?
Invictus0 5y ago
I thought the longshoremen were the bottleneck; you're saying they can't get enough trucks to the docks either?
germinalphrase 5y ago
AB5 did not outlaw owner-operators; however, some owner-operator fleets have decided not to operate in California due to possible driver reclassification from contractors to employees due to AB5.
- tomohawk 5y ago
  Sure it did. That's why there's been a big lawsuit by the trucking industry to get it overturned, as it outlaws a longstanding business practice. https://www.caltrux.org/ab-5-faq/ https://www.caltrux.org/ab-5-faq/
  - germinalphrase 5y ago
    An owner-operator making a haul for Costco is not at all prevented from operating in California as they can satisfy the ABC test for contracting. Large logistic companies that hire owner-operators on a contract basis are impacted as their restrictions on the contracts bump the owner-operator into the employee rather than contractor bucket. This increases costs, so they are pushing back. Seems likely that there will eventually be a care out for trucking since that industry was not really the target of AB5 in the first place.
    - dragonwriter 5y ago
      > Seems likely that there will eventually be a care out for trucking since that industry was not really the target of AB5 in the first place. AB5 which codified the existing ABC test, made it consistent so that people in one working relationship with an employer wouldn't be employees for some purposes and contractors for others, and carved out industry specific exceptions to the test—those exceptions were the specific “targets”, not every other industry in the state where the existing judicially-applied ABC test was merely codified. Trucking already got some exceptions in AB5 (so they kind of were a “target”); they might get more. The gig-economy firm propaganda that they were targets of AB5, rather than just a particular moneyed interest that was out of compliance with the law before AB5, is inaccurate.
      - germinalphrase 5y ago
        Fair enough. That you for expanding the conversation.
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    > Sure it did. No, it didn't. One because as the FAQ you link notes, owner-operators of trucks are not categorically banned. Second, as your FAQ also obliquely indicates but fails to clearly and directly state, to the extent ant existing business process was banned, it was banned by the California Supreme Court decision in Dynamex applying the ABC test to determine employee vs. contractor status, which is why the lawsuit it refers to against the application of the ABC test was before AB5 was passed, and later amended to include claims challenging AB5, which codified the rule of Dynamex, added exceptions, and made some consistency changes in other law so that relationships that were employment for some purposes under Dynamex would not still be contractor relationships for purposes of other law.
dragonwriter 5y ago
> Also, California's AB5 law has outlawed owner operators No, it didn't. To the extent anything did, the application by the California Supreme Court of the ABC test in Dynamex (prior to AB5) did (which also isn't entirely true, owner-operators usually meet 2 of the 3 prongs of the test, and the third prong depends on the core business of the employing firm; some will pass and some won’t.) AB5 actually created an explicit time-limited exemption to the ABC test for certain owner-operators of trucks (notably, in construction.)

scohesc 5y ago

I find it hard to believe that a single state is able to cause such large supply problems nationally (and internationally) because of a law barring independent trucking companies from doing business in their state. But then again, it _is_ California so I'm not surprised. I just hope that maybe whoever is making the laws comes to their senses, because they're not just hurting California with this legislation.

tomschlick 5y ago

Is there anything that CA hasn't over-regulated to stupid levels yet?

Invictus0 5y ago

I thought the longshoremen were the bottleneck; you're saying they can't get enough trucks to the docks either?

germinalphrase 5y ago

AB5 did not outlaw owner-operators; however, some owner-operator fleets have decided not to operate in California due to possible driver reclassification from contractors to employees due to AB5.

tomohawk 5y ago
Sure it did. That's why there's been a big lawsuit by the trucking industry to get it overturned, as it outlaws a longstanding business practice. https://www.caltrux.org/ab-5-faq/ https://www.caltrux.org/ab-5-faq/
- germinalphrase 5y ago
  An owner-operator making a haul for Costco is not at all prevented from operating in California as they can satisfy the ABC test for contracting. Large logistic companies that hire owner-operators on a contract basis are impacted as their restrictions on the contracts bump the owner-operator into the employee rather than contractor bucket. This increases costs, so they are pushing back. Seems likely that there will eventually be a care out for trucking since that industry was not really the target of AB5 in the first place.
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    > Seems likely that there will eventually be a care out for trucking since that industry was not really the target of AB5 in the first place. AB5 which codified the existing ABC test, made it consistent so that people in one working relationship with an employer wouldn't be employees for some purposes and contractors for others, and carved out industry specific exceptions to the test—those exceptions were the specific “targets”, not every other industry in the state where the existing judicially-applied ABC test was merely codified. Trucking already got some exceptions in AB5 (so they kind of were a “target”); they might get more. The gig-economy firm propaganda that they were targets of AB5, rather than just a particular moneyed interest that was out of compliance with the law before AB5, is inaccurate.
    - germinalphrase 5y ago
      Fair enough. That you for expanding the conversation.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > Sure it did. No, it didn't. One because as the FAQ you link notes, owner-operators of trucks are not categorically banned. Second, as your FAQ also obliquely indicates but fails to clearly and directly state, to the extent ant existing business process was banned, it was banned by the California Supreme Court decision in Dynamex applying the ABC test to determine employee vs. contractor status, which is why the lawsuit it refers to against the application of the ABC test was before AB5 was passed, and later amended to include claims challenging AB5, which codified the rule of Dynamex, added exceptions, and made some consistency changes in other law so that relationships that were employment for some purposes under Dynamex would not still be contractor relationships for purposes of other law.

dragonwriter 5y ago

> Also, California's AB5 law has outlawed owner operators No, it didn't. To the extent anything did, the application by the California Supreme Court of the ABC test in Dynamex (prior to AB5) did (which also isn't entirely true, owner-operators usually meet 2 of the 3 prongs of the test, and the third prong depends on the core business of the employing firm; some will pass and some won’t.) AB5 actually created an explicit time-limited exemption to the ABC test for certain owner-operators of trucks (notably, in construction.)