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> Note the lack of citations. Presumably referring to Southwest Airlines Delta gave in to the Freedom Fighters: https://mustreadalaska.com/delta-variant-airlin

> Note the lack of citations. Presumably referring to Southwest Airlines Delta gave in to the Freedom Fighters: https://mustreadalaska.com/delta-variant-airline-goes-its-own-way-wont-mandate-vaccines-in-employees/ https://mustreadalaska.com/delta-variant-airline-goes-its-ow... > > police officers > That's true. And they are dying at a higher rate than if they had gotten vaccinated. "COVID is the #1 killer of LEOs in 2020 and 2021" - https://www.odmp.org/ https://www.odmp.org/ . I know one of those LEO who died "from COVID". I think he probably would have survived if he hadn't been ventilated. This is my referenced -4 comment about him: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28890791 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28890791

eesmith 5y ago
Your source says nothing about "give in". Your source does not specifically mention airline pilots as having any impact. Your source does mention "any employee not fully vaccinated will need to take a Covid test weekly, as long as community case rates are high, and beginning in November, unvaccinated employees in the company’s healthcare plan will be subject to a $200 monthly surcharge because the average hospital stay for Covid-19 has cost the company $50,000 per person" - hardly some sort of complete capitulation or rejection of "vaccine passports."
- taxicabjesus 5y ago
  That was just the top of the links when I searched. I think the important point about Delta pilots is they won't have to join Southwest and American Airlines' pilot rebellions against forced medical treatments from which they believe they will receive no benefit. Some people don't like Mr. Berenson, but I think he's consistent: > [...] The pilots I’ve heard from don’t want [systemwide flight cancellations] - they didn’t become pilots NOT to fly. But they also recognize they are speaking for tens of millions of working Americans who are furious with the choice the Biden Administration is forcing on them: your right to make medical decisions for yourself, or your job. > So what happens next? The answer may come down to a delicate dance between the airlines - especially Southwest and American - and their employees. If the airlines signal that anyone who wants an exemption can get one, they may keep the anger to manageable levels. https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/the-not-so-friendly-skies/ https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/the-not-so-friendly-skie... Edit: Can't respond to the comment below. Don't care about Snopes, I think they mostly peddle whatever the consensus happens to be, even when provably wrong. Berenson's substack seems to support that there is a silent rebelion amongst airline pilots. See also: URGENT: A Southwest Airlines pilot explains why you will not hear anything about vaccine mandates from his union - and why Southwest has more flexibility than it admits to stand up to the White House - https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/urgent-a-southwest-airlines-pilot/ https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/urgent-a-southwest-airli...
  - eesmith 5y ago
    > to join Southwest ... pilot rebellions There was no "pilot rebellion" at SWA. I provide a link to Snopes. Don't trust Snopes? Here's SWA's press release: "On Friday evening, the airline ended the day with numerous cancellations, primarily created by weather and other external constraints, which left aircraft and Crews out of pre-planned positions to operate our schedule on Saturday. ... As a note, the operational challenges were not a result of Southwest Employee demonstrations." - from https://www.swamedia.com/releases/release-66d1c9ae7fd4aa2df09a33d586ef9b95-southwest-statement-regarding-recent-operational-disruptions https://www.swamedia.com/releases/release-66d1c9ae7fd4aa2df0... Don't trust corporate media or SWA management? Here's the pilot union: "Southwest pilots' union president blames airline for cancellations ... When asked by CBS News if there was any chance the disruption could have been caused by pilots calling out sick over the company's vaccine mandate, Capt. Casey Murray, president of the Southwest Airlines Pilots Association, said that was not the case and that the airline's pilot sick rate for this weekend was "right in line with what was occurring this summer." - from https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/southwest-pilots-union-president-blames-airline-for-cancellations/ar-AAPpZeX https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/southwest-pilots-u... . Still don't trust corporate media? Go to the union's web site, at https://www.swapa.org/ https://www.swapa.org/ , and follow the link under "SWAPA Twitter" to https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2021/10/16/southwest-airlines-delays-pilots-flight-cancellations/8468282002/ https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2021/10/16/sout... ] Recently, a national news narrative arose falsely implying that Southwest Airlines pilots walked out on their passengers, forcing them to cancel important family plans and leaving them stranded all over the country. And the untrue rumors indicated that pilots did this over a protest from the airline’s vaccine mandate policy. ] As a Southwest Airlines pilot myself, I can tell you the truth. And the truth is, Southwest Airlines pilots did not cause our airline’s recent operational problems, and the data definitively shows this. ] To have a walkout, you must have a significant increase in pilots failing to show up to work. But the reality is, that data doesn’t exist. There has not been a dramatic spike in pilot sick call rates anywhere in the month of October. What actually happened was Southwest Airlines pilots and flight attendants were stranded away from their homes and families, right alongside our passengers. Much like our passengers, many of our crews were unable to find hotel rooms. That only exacerbated Southwest’s problems as numerous pilots were not legally permitted to fly due to a lack of rest before getting behind the controls of an airliner. Quite pedaling your falsehoods. If you can't fact check something as simple as this - even after I linked you to the Snopes page - why should anyone trust you with something more complex?

eesmith 5y ago

Your source says nothing about "give in". Your source does not specifically mention airline pilots as having any impact. Your source does mention "any employee not fully vaccinated will need to take a Covid test weekly, as long as community case rates are high, and beginning in November, unvaccinated employees in the company’s healthcare plan will be subject to a $200 monthly surcharge because the average hospital stay for Covid-19 has cost the company $50,000 per person" - hardly some sort of complete capitulation or rejection of "vaccine passports."

taxicabjesus 5y ago
That was just the top of the links when I searched. I think the important point about Delta pilots is they won't have to join Southwest and American Airlines' pilot rebellions against forced medical treatments from which they believe they will receive no benefit. Some people don't like Mr. Berenson, but I think he's consistent: > [...] The pilots I’ve heard from don’t want [systemwide flight cancellations] - they didn’t become pilots NOT to fly. But they also recognize they are speaking for tens of millions of working Americans who are furious with the choice the Biden Administration is forcing on them: your right to make medical decisions for yourself, or your job. > So what happens next? The answer may come down to a delicate dance between the airlines - especially Southwest and American - and their employees. If the airlines signal that anyone who wants an exemption can get one, they may keep the anger to manageable levels. https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/the-not-so-friendly-skies/ https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/the-not-so-friendly-skie... Edit: Can't respond to the comment below. Don't care about Snopes, I think they mostly peddle whatever the consensus happens to be, even when provably wrong. Berenson's substack seems to support that there is a silent rebelion amongst airline pilots. See also: URGENT: A Southwest Airlines pilot explains why you will not hear anything about vaccine mandates from his union - and why Southwest has more flexibility than it admits to stand up to the White House - https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/urgent-a-southwest-airlines-pilot/ https://alexberenson.substack.com/p/urgent-a-southwest-airli...
- eesmith 5y ago
  > to join Southwest ... pilot rebellions There was no "pilot rebellion" at SWA. I provide a link to Snopes. Don't trust Snopes? Here's SWA's press release: "On Friday evening, the airline ended the day with numerous cancellations, primarily created by weather and other external constraints, which left aircraft and Crews out of pre-planned positions to operate our schedule on Saturday. ... As a note, the operational challenges were not a result of Southwest Employee demonstrations." - from https://www.swamedia.com/releases/release-66d1c9ae7fd4aa2df09a33d586ef9b95-southwest-statement-regarding-recent-operational-disruptions https://www.swamedia.com/releases/release-66d1c9ae7fd4aa2df0... Don't trust corporate media or SWA management? Here's the pilot union: "Southwest pilots' union president blames airline for cancellations ... When asked by CBS News if there was any chance the disruption could have been caused by pilots calling out sick over the company's vaccine mandate, Capt. Casey Murray, president of the Southwest Airlines Pilots Association, said that was not the case and that the airline's pilot sick rate for this weekend was "right in line with what was occurring this summer." - from https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/southwest-pilots-union-president-blames-airline-for-cancellations/ar-AAPpZeX https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/southwest-pilots-u... . Still don't trust corporate media? Go to the union's web site, at https://www.swapa.org/ https://www.swapa.org/ , and follow the link under "SWAPA Twitter" to https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2021/10/16/southwest-airlines-delays-pilots-flight-cancellations/8468282002/ https://eu.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2021/10/16/sout... ] Recently, a national news narrative arose falsely implying that Southwest Airlines pilots walked out on their passengers, forcing them to cancel important family plans and leaving them stranded all over the country. And the untrue rumors indicated that pilots did this over a protest from the airline’s vaccine mandate policy. ] As a Southwest Airlines pilot myself, I can tell you the truth. And the truth is, Southwest Airlines pilots did not cause our airline’s recent operational problems, and the data definitively shows this. ] To have a walkout, you must have a significant increase in pilots failing to show up to work. But the reality is, that data doesn’t exist. There has not been a dramatic spike in pilot sick call rates anywhere in the month of October. What actually happened was Southwest Airlines pilots and flight attendants were stranded away from their homes and families, right alongside our passengers. Much like our passengers, many of our crews were unable to find hotel rooms. That only exacerbated Southwest’s problems as numerous pilots were not legally permitted to fly due to a lack of rest before getting behind the controls of an airliner. Quite pedaling your falsehoods. If you can't fact check something as simple as this - even after I linked you to the Snopes page - why should anyone trust you with something more complex?