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> IMO the responsibility for those deaths does not fall on him specifically. While this is true, you're not allowed to criticize the flawlessly angelic Intelli

by caeril 5y ago

> IMO the responsibility for those deaths does not fall on him specifically. While this is true, you're not allowed to criticize the flawlessly angelic Intelligence Community on HN. Holding up the CIA as a bastion of virtue whilst denouncing the public faces of our war crimes is the best way to maintain your karma here. When Tony Blair passes, be sure to dance on his grave too, because the GCHQ puppetmasters did absolutely nothing wrong. It's always best for one's personal reputation to shoot the messenger, not the man behind the curtain.

bradlys 5y ago
> Holding up the CIA as a bastion of virtue whilst denouncing the public faces of our war crimes is the best way to maintain your karma here. You’re joking, right? The CIA is shit on all the time. It’s a fucking joke just like most other state run agencies that are all self-interested and don’t actually look out for the public good. The CIA is responsible for huge amounts of horrible shit across the entire world. Constantly instilling puppet dictators and destabilizing countries for generations now - all for the glory of US capitalism and imperialism. Doesn’t mean Colin Powell is absolved either. Everyone involved is to blame. Even the voters.
smolder 5y ago
I wouldn't hold CIA and other intel agencies up as a bastion of virtue, and I appreciate they've done a lot of terrible things. I can't really make broader moral judgements about how they handle their respective missions, though, since they mostly operate in the dark. All I can say about the CIA, for example, is they're somewhere between A: the most oppressive, lawless, brutal institution to exist post WW2, and B: flawed saviors of humanity from nuclear/other apocalypse. Who really knows? Those that do probably can't say much. Intel agencies do have the problem that if they go off the rails, there's not many paths to reform outside of direct involvement. I also strongly suspect that they're doing some terrible and unnecessary things to this day (e.g. still ruining lives in a protracted battle with Marx's ghost) and need reform, but that's really the strongest claim I can make.

by caeril 5y ago

bradlys 5y ago

> Holding up the CIA as a bastion of virtue whilst denouncing the public faces of our war crimes is the best way to maintain your karma here. You’re joking, right? The CIA is shit on all the time. It’s a fucking joke just like most other state run agencies that are all self-interested and don’t actually look out for the public good. The CIA is responsible for huge amounts of horrible shit across the entire world. Constantly instilling puppet dictators and destabilizing countries for generations now - all for the glory of US capitalism and imperialism. Doesn’t mean Colin Powell is absolved either. Everyone involved is to blame. Even the voters.

smolder 5y ago

I wouldn't hold CIA and other intel agencies up as a bastion of virtue, and I appreciate they've done a lot of terrible things. I can't really make broader moral judgements about how they handle their respective missions, though, since they mostly operate in the dark. All I can say about the CIA, for example, is they're somewhere between A: the most oppressive, lawless, brutal institution to exist post WW2, and B: flawed saviors of humanity from nuclear/other apocalypse. Who really knows? Those that do probably can't say much. Intel agencies do have the problem that if they go off the rails, there's not many paths to reform outside of direct involvement. I also strongly suspect that they're doing some terrible and unnecessary things to this day (e.g. still ruining lives in a protracted battle with Marx's ghost) and need reform, but that's really the strongest claim I can make.