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Controversial opinion, but I think adding Magsafe back (along with the other ports) was a step backward for the industry. Apple pushed the whole industry to st

by dntrkv 5y ago

Controversial opinion, but I think adding Magsafe back (along with the other ports) was a step backward for the industry. Apple pushed the whole industry to standardize on one connector for everything. If anyone really needed those other ports, a small $30 portable hub would add them all back. Magsafe 3 is just another connector that will add more e-waste and proprietary cables to the mix. It's nice that they kept the USB-C charging, but now non-2021+ Macbook users can't reuse the charging cables.

adam_arthur 5y ago
Agreed. I'm a fan of function over form, but Apple standardizing on a single port pushed a lot of accessories and other manufacturers towards USB-C. I use my (USB-C) mac charger for my phone all the time, simply because it's there and the cable is longer. I didn't really find Magsafe that useful anyway, as I'm pretty much always hooked up to a monitor via USB-C (which charges as well). I guess it's nice for those that miss it, but we were starting to finally get to a world with a one-size-fits-all cable. Remember back in the day when old-style cell phones/laptops all had proprietary chargers? But it seems the momentum for USB-C is there, so hopefully consolidation continues. Anyway, the EU and maybe others seem to be moving towards legislation to consolidate I/O types anyway. I'm guessing the HDMI is partially due to bandwidth limitations of USB-C, though I forget the specifics.
- Yaina 5y ago
  I would need to look it up and and of course it depends on the version, but afaik HDMI usually lags behind DisplayPort in terms of bandwidth and features. The SD-Card slot I can understand; for Magsafe I feels the same as you that I didn't really care for it, but HDMI... they might as well could have put a VGA port on there haha
  - ansgri 5y ago
    I guess it’s for TVs and conference room projectors, these never support the DP, and thus it’s very much a real ‘pro’ feature for office work. So, SD for pro photo/video (and they are very right about full-size SDs here), HDMI for pro office, USB3 for everything else, seems legit.
- plandis 5y ago
  > I didn't really find Magsafe that useful anyway, as I'm pretty much always hooked up to a monitor via USB-C (which charges as well). I’m the complete opposite. I have to buy USB-C cables solely for MacBook Pro since nothing else I have uses it. I have plenty of HDMI and DP cables but literally only use USB-C on my laptop because I was forced to. Reverting back is a welcome change. USB-C only works as the only standard if you’re only buying relatively new tech products otherwise its the XKCD meme about an 11th standard. My tv doesn’t have usbc, my monitors don’t have usbc, my headphones and microphone still use a jack, my phone is no usbc, etc…
  - adam_arthur 5y ago
    Yeah, but mac standardization was pushing all of those devices towards USB-C. I'm sure we'll get there eventually anyway, but it's a nice push towards standardization. It does create more friction in the short term though. I don't see any reason we shouldn't move towards a single standard for all I/O, whether it's USB-C or otherwise. Maybe there are technical limitations to supporting so many things in one spec, I'm not that deep into the weeds. Otherwise it's just incredibly wasteful to have all these different connectors, and it's anti-consumer. I mean I used to have a bag with 100 different cord types I'd have to rummage through every once in awhile to find what I needed. That shouldn't have to be a thing. Fortunately we're down to like 4-5 standards now...
- 8ytecoder 5y ago
  It is function over form though. The number of times I thought I plugged in the charger and didn't do it properly and the number of times I tripped on the cable when working on the couch alone makes it worth it. The simple indicator light on the magsafe makes it so much easier to see and confirm that it's charging or it's fully charged.
  - krrrh 5y ago
    It almost never gets commented on but you can sneeze on the usb-C ports on the MacBook Pro and they will unseat enough to stop charging. It’s a shame the standard didn’t get notches like lightning cable which can easily hold the weight of a dangling iPhone pro max.
- hellbannedguy 5y ago
  I'm pretty much done with buying any new Apple product, but the magsafe was brilliant years ago, and now. Plus--Apple senior citizens loved it, and probally saved many laptops from hitting the floor. (I will buy Apple used computers because their isn't much competition. There's a big part of me that would love a truly Hackers/Tinkerers computer. Jobs knew what the masses would buy. Wos knew what the tinkerers/inventors wanted. Wos wanted more ports, and so do I. Could anyone imagine a computer you could plug into your car, and it would delightful tell you what's wrong? (propriety issues aside) Or, a dvom. Or, having having a $50 accessory that would turn your computer into a oscilloscope. And yes--I know the market would be small now, but who knows what the future would bring. Or, adding a ham radio. Or, wifi chip that security professionals could use. And yes--I know their are third parties that make some I just mentioned, but we all know they usually come with hassels on Apple. This mythical computer would be only for the few true tinkerers out there. That is at first. It would be big bulky, but meant for repairability, and function would be it's only purpose, along with a reasonable price. I would happily pay $3000 for such a devise. Let Wos go crazy on a computer he really wanted, or wanted when he was in his 20's.)
- sumedh 5y ago
  > I didn't really find Magsafe that useful anyway Its like insurance, you dont need to for most part but then when luck is not on your side that is when you need it the most.
dymk 5y ago
The e-waste from chargers is a non-issue. Our oceans aren't filling up with dongles, nor are our landfills.
- Gigachad 5y ago
  Also the whole point of magsafe was to save laptops from smashing when someone trips on the cable. They likely reduce ewaste in total.
msie 5y ago
Reusing charging cables is only a big deal in online arguments.
wmeredith 5y ago
I agree with this. The mag connection should have been at the power brick and keep the USB-C on the device.
- jb1991 5y ago
  That doesn’t prevent the kind of accidents that mag on machine does.
ksec 5y ago
>Apple pushed the whole industry to standardize on one connector for everything. Because people actually want one cable for everything. USB-C only guarantee 60W charging. Instead of telling user to use USB-C PD 2.1 Cable with Thunderbolt 4 support and this logo with x. Apple now tells its user if you want it to work at maximum speed and charging please use Magsafe.
- slantyyz 5y ago
  > Because people actually want one cable for everything. The problem is that the "industry" gave us one port for everything while giving us a confusing mess of mixed capability cables that use that port.
- rx_tx 5y ago
  > USB-C only guarantee 60W charging. The original PD 1.0 spec went up to 100W (20V/5A). Newest PD spec (3.1) can do up to 240W. And I think apple's magsafe cable terminates in a male usb type C, so it still uses PD internally at least.
  - bloggie 5y ago
    More than 3A on PD requires tagged cables, I'm not even sure I have any 5A capable cables here. I do have tagged cables as tagging is required for USB3 over USBC which is negotiated with the aid of PD. Magsafe does make it rather somewhat simpler for the end user and I never really liked that the main cable for a portable could be so easily damaged, I liked magsafe and the magnetic connector on the Surface laptops quite a bit.
    - ksec 5y ago
      Precisely. Not all USB-C Cable are PD cable. Telling the story again. I was trying to help a lawyer out and trying to explain why the $5.00 USB-C cable he'd bought from Amazon wasn't delivering 4K video to his expensive monitor AND powering his laptop too. Me: OK: so its a USB-C cable, but its not a high data rate USB-C cable. Him: But, its a USB-C Cable. Me: but, no, not all USB-C cables are high speed cables. And some of them can't do high speed and power delivery Him: but... its a USB-C cable: it plugs into the port. Me: Um... just because it plugs in, doesn't mean its going to work. You can have USB-C cables that are actually slower than the old USB ports. Him: but.... shouldn't it just work? And so on. For... 15? more minutes? maybe 30? I finally got him to buy a "proper" belkin USB-C cable . Which was bought from a company that should be anonymous, but lets just say that a "refurbished" cable was shipped, which, surprise, surprise ,didn't work, for ANYTHING. This basically sums up everything that is wrong with Tech thinking vs User Thinking.
hbOY5ENiZloUfnZ 5y ago
At least it is a USB-C terminated on the charger end. That means you can reuse existing USB-PD chargers while only needing to replace the cable.
wslack 5y ago
> Controversial opinion, but I think adding Magsafe back (along with the other ports) was a step backward for the industry. It's too useful not to add back. Every laptop should have something like this; it prevents accidents and damage.
- 8ytecoder 5y ago
  And that tiny little light is so very useful when you're plugging it in just to charge it...
wetpaws 5y ago
You can still use your old type-c cable, I don't see any issues with it.
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by dntrkv 5y ago

adam_arthur 5y ago

Agreed. I'm a fan of function over form, but Apple standardizing on a single port pushed a lot of accessories and other manufacturers towards USB-C. I use my (USB-C) mac charger for my phone all the time, simply because it's there and the cable is longer. I didn't really find Magsafe that useful anyway, as I'm pretty much always hooked up to a monitor via USB-C (which charges as well). I guess it's nice for those that miss it, but we were starting to finally get to a world with a one-size-fits-all cable. Remember back in the day when old-style cell phones/laptops all had proprietary chargers? But it seems the momentum for USB-C is there, so hopefully consolidation continues. Anyway, the EU and maybe others seem to be moving towards legislation to consolidate I/O types anyway. I'm guessing the HDMI is partially due to bandwidth limitations of USB-C, though I forget the specifics.

Yaina 5y ago
I would need to look it up and and of course it depends on the version, but afaik HDMI usually lags behind DisplayPort in terms of bandwidth and features. The SD-Card slot I can understand; for Magsafe I feels the same as you that I didn't really care for it, but HDMI... they might as well could have put a VGA port on there haha
- ansgri 5y ago
  I guess it’s for TVs and conference room projectors, these never support the DP, and thus it’s very much a real ‘pro’ feature for office work. So, SD for pro photo/video (and they are very right about full-size SDs here), HDMI for pro office, USB3 for everything else, seems legit.
plandis 5y ago
> I didn't really find Magsafe that useful anyway, as I'm pretty much always hooked up to a monitor via USB-C (which charges as well). I’m the complete opposite. I have to buy USB-C cables solely for MacBook Pro since nothing else I have uses it. I have plenty of HDMI and DP cables but literally only use USB-C on my laptop because I was forced to. Reverting back is a welcome change. USB-C only works as the only standard if you’re only buying relatively new tech products otherwise its the XKCD meme about an 11th standard. My tv doesn’t have usbc, my monitors don’t have usbc, my headphones and microphone still use a jack, my phone is no usbc, etc…
- adam_arthur 5y ago
  Yeah, but mac standardization was pushing all of those devices towards USB-C. I'm sure we'll get there eventually anyway, but it's a nice push towards standardization. It does create more friction in the short term though. I don't see any reason we shouldn't move towards a single standard for all I/O, whether it's USB-C or otherwise. Maybe there are technical limitations to supporting so many things in one spec, I'm not that deep into the weeds. Otherwise it's just incredibly wasteful to have all these different connectors, and it's anti-consumer. I mean I used to have a bag with 100 different cord types I'd have to rummage through every once in awhile to find what I needed. That shouldn't have to be a thing. Fortunately we're down to like 4-5 standards now...
8ytecoder 5y ago
It is function over form though. The number of times I thought I plugged in the charger and didn't do it properly and the number of times I tripped on the cable when working on the couch alone makes it worth it. The simple indicator light on the magsafe makes it so much easier to see and confirm that it's charging or it's fully charged.
- krrrh 5y ago
  It almost never gets commented on but you can sneeze on the usb-C ports on the MacBook Pro and they will unseat enough to stop charging. It’s a shame the standard didn’t get notches like lightning cable which can easily hold the weight of a dangling iPhone pro max.
hellbannedguy 5y ago
I'm pretty much done with buying any new Apple product, but the magsafe was brilliant years ago, and now. Plus--Apple senior citizens loved it, and probally saved many laptops from hitting the floor. (I will buy Apple used computers because their isn't much competition. There's a big part of me that would love a truly Hackers/Tinkerers computer. Jobs knew what the masses would buy. Wos knew what the tinkerers/inventors wanted. Wos wanted more ports, and so do I. Could anyone imagine a computer you could plug into your car, and it would delightful tell you what's wrong? (propriety issues aside) Or, a dvom. Or, having having a $50 accessory that would turn your computer into a oscilloscope. And yes--I know the market would be small now, but who knows what the future would bring. Or, adding a ham radio. Or, wifi chip that security professionals could use. And yes--I know their are third parties that make some I just mentioned, but we all know they usually come with hassels on Apple. This mythical computer would be only for the few true tinkerers out there. That is at first. It would be big bulky, but meant for repairability, and function would be it's only purpose, along with a reasonable price. I would happily pay $3000 for such a devise. Let Wos go crazy on a computer he really wanted, or wanted when he was in his 20's.)
sumedh 5y ago
> I didn't really find Magsafe that useful anyway Its like insurance, you dont need to for most part but then when luck is not on your side that is when you need it the most.

dymk 5y ago

The e-waste from chargers is a non-issue. Our oceans aren't filling up with dongles, nor are our landfills.

Gigachad 5y ago
Also the whole point of magsafe was to save laptops from smashing when someone trips on the cable. They likely reduce ewaste in total.

msie 5y ago

Reusing charging cables is only a big deal in online arguments.

wmeredith 5y ago

I agree with this. The mag connection should have been at the power brick and keep the USB-C on the device.

jb1991 5y ago
That doesn’t prevent the kind of accidents that mag on machine does.

ksec 5y ago

>Apple pushed the whole industry to standardize on one connector for everything. Because people actually want one cable for everything. USB-C only guarantee 60W charging. Instead of telling user to use USB-C PD 2.1 Cable with Thunderbolt 4 support and this logo with x. Apple now tells its user if you want it to work at maximum speed and charging please use Magsafe.

slantyyz 5y ago
> Because people actually want one cable for everything. The problem is that the "industry" gave us one port for everything while giving us a confusing mess of mixed capability cables that use that port.
rx_tx 5y ago
> USB-C only guarantee 60W charging. The original PD 1.0 spec went up to 100W (20V/5A). Newest PD spec (3.1) can do up to 240W. And I think apple's magsafe cable terminates in a male usb type C, so it still uses PD internally at least.
- bloggie 5y ago
  More than 3A on PD requires tagged cables, I'm not even sure I have any 5A capable cables here. I do have tagged cables as tagging is required for USB3 over USBC which is negotiated with the aid of PD. Magsafe does make it rather somewhat simpler for the end user and I never really liked that the main cable for a portable could be so easily damaged, I liked magsafe and the magnetic connector on the Surface laptops quite a bit.
  - ksec 5y ago
    Precisely. Not all USB-C Cable are PD cable. Telling the story again. I was trying to help a lawyer out and trying to explain why the $5.00 USB-C cable he'd bought from Amazon wasn't delivering 4K video to his expensive monitor AND powering his laptop too. Me: OK: so its a USB-C cable, but its not a high data rate USB-C cable. Him: But, its a USB-C Cable. Me: but, no, not all USB-C cables are high speed cables. And some of them can't do high speed and power delivery Him: but... its a USB-C cable: it plugs into the port. Me: Um... just because it plugs in, doesn't mean its going to work. You can have USB-C cables that are actually slower than the old USB ports. Him: but.... shouldn't it just work? And so on. For... 15? more minutes? maybe 30? I finally got him to buy a "proper" belkin USB-C cable . Which was bought from a company that should be anonymous, but lets just say that a "refurbished" cable was shipped, which, surprise, surprise ,didn't work, for ANYTHING. This basically sums up everything that is wrong with Tech thinking vs User Thinking.

hbOY5ENiZloUfnZ 5y ago

At least it is a USB-C terminated on the charger end. That means you can reuse existing USB-PD chargers while only needing to replace the cable.

wslack 5y ago

> Controversial opinion, but I think adding Magsafe back (along with the other ports) was a step backward for the industry. It's too useful not to add back. Every laptop should have something like this; it prevents accidents and damage.

8ytecoder 5y ago
And that tiny little light is so very useful when you're plugging it in just to charge it...

wetpaws 5y ago

You can still use your old type-c cable, I don't see any issues with it.

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