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Everything they’ve said about the new MacBook Pros is extremely promising, but they had to add a notch to the screen. Just why? All for the sake of reducing th

Everything they’ve said about the new MacBook Pros is extremely promising, but they had to add a notch to the screen. Just why? All for the sake of reducing the top screen border by a couple of millimeters.

zepto 5y ago
The notch occupies otherwise wasted space in the menu bar - how is that not purely positive?
- eecc 5y ago
  Well, unless you’re only ever using text edit, the menubar is there for er, menus? It’s going to be interesting to see the gymnastics around this
  - ascagnel_ 5y ago
    There was at least one shot of it -- it'll be a gap in the menu, with top-level menus flowing around the notch if necessary.
  - zepto 5y ago
    It’s not really clear what your point is. There is plenty of room in the menu bar for the camera to be in the middle.
    - anonfunction 5y ago
      Is there? Photoshop has a bunch of menus, not sure what they're planning to do. See this screenshot for example: https://i.imgur.com/hHEl3cN.png https://i.imgur.com/hHEl3cN.png
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - banana_giraffe 5y ago
        I did notice Xcode used up all the space before the notch: https://imgur.com/a/Qlxr7t2 https://imgur.com/a/Qlxr7t2 And apps that don't have a traditional Mac menu just have a black bar hiding the notch: https://imgur.com/a/McNBTHY https://imgur.com/a/McNBTHY I actually don't know what Mac OS does today when it runs out of room for menu items.
      - zepto 5y ago
        Menus are positioned by the OS, presumably they won’t collide with the notch. There is no problem.
KarlKemp 5y ago
Top-Center is among the most useless screen real estate. It takes just about the same amount of space as the keyboard language selector a bit to the right, or any one of the menu items to the left. And those two interface never fill up to the point where they need that center spot (or I'd be cleaning out those mostly annoying gadgets top-left).
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- shantara 5y ago
  The vertical screen space they might have freed by adding a notch was immediately taken by increasing the top bar height. I don’t see a purpose for such a trade off.
  - pelmeni 5y ago
    You still end up with more usable space since now the menu bar isn't taking up those pixels.
- moonchrome 5y ago
  >Top-Center is among the most useless screen real estate. Especially on MacOS. 100% like this design - good camera, smaller bezels, useless space being cut out.
- java-man 5y ago
  More smudges on the camera, since this is where the user grabs to open the lid, and the camera seems to be closer to the edge.
  - m4rtink 5y ago
    Not to mention - how do you cover the camera to maintain privacy if its now part of the screen ?
    - 5y ago
MengerSponge 5y ago
Try this: Instead of thinking "Boo, they took away part of the screen with a notch" think "Yay! They extended the screen a few mm on either side of the camera" If you want to join us in the cult of Mac, learning little contortions like that will make you a lot happier.
- Nition 5y ago
  I remember naively asking on the Mac forums once, whether there was any way to have the laptop lid closed in Mac OS without putting the laptop to sleep. Of course not, I was told. Apple's laptops use a superior thermal design, which could damage the laptop if the lid is closed while it's left running. Who would want to do that anyway? Better to have good cooling. I didn't even bother to reply and mention the fact that my Windows install on the same laptop allowed it without complaint.
  - robertoandred 5y ago
    What? Of course you can run the laptop with the lid closed, it’s called clamshell mode.
    - Nition 5y ago
      This was in around 2012, maybe attitudes have changed. This isn't my thread, but shows what responses to the question were like at the time: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2805582 https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2805582
      - robertoandred 5y ago
        Mac laptops have supported clamshell since at least 2000.
      - wtallis 5y ago
        You only have to go a few responses into that thread to get an explanation that the action of closing the lid will trigger sleep, but an external keyboard and mouse will wake it back up, allowing for the machine to be used while closed. You may not have originally intended to make the distinction between having the lid closed vs. the process of closing the lid, but it's clearly the former you were worried about, and that use case has always been supported.
Ancapistani 5y ago
Why not? I hated the idea when it came around for the iPhone - but actually using one showed me that it just isn't an issue. There's a status bar at the top anyhow, and the center of it is unused. On a laptop, I see it as just extra pixels dedicated to the OS's status bar.
eknkc 5y ago
I bet there will be software adding a black line, hiding the notch tomorrow so no big deal. Those are additional pixels anyway.
- TheGRS 5y ago
  They basically showed that in some fullscreen images in the demo, so I think that's how it'll be.
jazzyjackson 5y ago
If I were to hazard a guess, it's more of a brand recognition thing - now you don't even have to see the apple on the back to know someone's using a macbook.
- mistersquid 5y ago
  > If I were to hazard a guess, it's more of a brand recognition thing - now you don't even have to see the apple on the back to know someone's using a macbook. The intuition driving your hazarded "guess" is unerring. A recent leaker called out the notch which brought renewed attention to a different leaker, ty98, who mentions notch (and other details) as early as August. [0] Coupled with confirmation of ty98's leak that there is "No "MacBook Pro" logo on the bottom bezel", the MacBook Pro notch may very well be a branding element. Instant visual recognition without using words. The notch is branding that transcends language. [0] https://www.macrumors.com/2021/10/17/apple-notch-design-obscured-marketing-materials/ https://www.macrumors.com/2021/10/17/apple-notch-design-obsc...
yepthatsreality 5y ago
I agree. I finally upgraded from a Iphone SE to a 12 Mini. The notch is horrible and I’m not sure why people wave it away with “I got used to it”. I’ve had it for months. No idea what lunatic at Apple thought it would be nice for a laptop. Can’t they come up with something a little more original than removing screen real estate to stand out? I will be switching back to an SE just based on how overall unwieldy the new phone is. The notch is just one of the nails in the coffin. The notch to me says, “now I know which products not to buy”.
asdff 5y ago
It's a macbook though. You can just write a program that moves your screen down a millimeter or however much and live your life notch free with peace of mind.
shantara 5y ago
Update: >macOS Hides the Notch on New MacBook Pro in Full-Screen Mode https://www.macrumors.com/2021/10/18/macos-hides-notch-on-new-macbook-pros/ https://www.macrumors.com/2021/10/18/macos-hides-notch-on-ne... I take back what I said about the notch. It is not as bad, as it initially seemed to be
throw03172019 5y ago
It sits where the menu bar is anyway. Similar to the status bar on iOS.

zepto 5y ago

The notch occupies otherwise wasted space in the menu bar - how is that not purely positive?

eecc 5y ago
Well, unless you’re only ever using text edit, the menubar is there for er, menus? It’s going to be interesting to see the gymnastics around this
- ascagnel_ 5y ago
  There was at least one shot of it -- it'll be a gap in the menu, with top-level menus flowing around the notch if necessary.
- zepto 5y ago
  It’s not really clear what your point is. There is plenty of room in the menu bar for the camera to be in the middle.
  - anonfunction 5y ago
    Is there? Photoshop has a bunch of menus, not sure what they're planning to do. See this screenshot for example: https://i.imgur.com/hHEl3cN.png https://i.imgur.com/hHEl3cN.png
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - banana_giraffe 5y ago
      I did notice Xcode used up all the space before the notch: https://imgur.com/a/Qlxr7t2 https://imgur.com/a/Qlxr7t2 And apps that don't have a traditional Mac menu just have a black bar hiding the notch: https://imgur.com/a/McNBTHY https://imgur.com/a/McNBTHY I actually don't know what Mac OS does today when it runs out of room for menu items.
    - zepto 5y ago
      Menus are positioned by the OS, presumably they won’t collide with the notch. There is no problem.

KarlKemp 5y ago

Top-Center is among the most useless screen real estate. It takes just about the same amount of space as the keyboard language selector a bit to the right, or any one of the menu items to the left. And those two interface never fill up to the point where they need that center spot (or I'd be cleaning out those mostly annoying gadgets top-left).

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
shantara 5y ago
The vertical screen space they might have freed by adding a notch was immediately taken by increasing the top bar height. I don’t see a purpose for such a trade off.
- pelmeni 5y ago
  You still end up with more usable space since now the menu bar isn't taking up those pixels.
moonchrome 5y ago
>Top-Center is among the most useless screen real estate. Especially on MacOS. 100% like this design - good camera, smaller bezels, useless space being cut out.
java-man 5y ago
More smudges on the camera, since this is where the user grabs to open the lid, and the camera seems to be closer to the edge.
- m4rtink 5y ago
  Not to mention - how do you cover the camera to maintain privacy if its now part of the screen ?
  - 5y ago

MengerSponge 5y ago

Try this: Instead of thinking "Boo, they took away part of the screen with a notch" think "Yay! They extended the screen a few mm on either side of the camera" If you want to join us in the cult of Mac, learning little contortions like that will make you a lot happier.

Nition 5y ago
I remember naively asking on the Mac forums once, whether there was any way to have the laptop lid closed in Mac OS without putting the laptop to sleep. Of course not, I was told. Apple's laptops use a superior thermal design, which could damage the laptop if the lid is closed while it's left running. Who would want to do that anyway? Better to have good cooling. I didn't even bother to reply and mention the fact that my Windows install on the same laptop allowed it without complaint.
- robertoandred 5y ago
  What? Of course you can run the laptop with the lid closed, it’s called clamshell mode.
  - Nition 5y ago
    This was in around 2012, maybe attitudes have changed. This isn't my thread, but shows what responses to the question were like at the time: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2805582 https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2805582
    - robertoandred 5y ago
      Mac laptops have supported clamshell since at least 2000.
    - wtallis 5y ago
      You only have to go a few responses into that thread to get an explanation that the action of closing the lid will trigger sleep, but an external keyboard and mouse will wake it back up, allowing for the machine to be used while closed. You may not have originally intended to make the distinction between having the lid closed vs. the process of closing the lid, but it's clearly the former you were worried about, and that use case has always been supported.

Ancapistani 5y ago

Why not? I hated the idea when it came around for the iPhone - but actually using one showed me that it just isn't an issue. There's a status bar at the top anyhow, and the center of it is unused. On a laptop, I see it as just extra pixels dedicated to the OS's status bar.

eknkc 5y ago

I bet there will be software adding a black line, hiding the notch tomorrow so no big deal. Those are additional pixels anyway.

TheGRS 5y ago
They basically showed that in some fullscreen images in the demo, so I think that's how it'll be.

jazzyjackson 5y ago

If I were to hazard a guess, it's more of a brand recognition thing - now you don't even have to see the apple on the back to know someone's using a macbook.

mistersquid 5y ago
> If I were to hazard a guess, it's more of a brand recognition thing - now you don't even have to see the apple on the back to know someone's using a macbook. The intuition driving your hazarded "guess" is unerring. A recent leaker called out the notch which brought renewed attention to a different leaker, ty98, who mentions notch (and other details) as early as August. [0] Coupled with confirmation of ty98's leak that there is "No "MacBook Pro" logo on the bottom bezel", the MacBook Pro notch may very well be a branding element. Instant visual recognition without using words. The notch is branding that transcends language. [0] https://www.macrumors.com/2021/10/17/apple-notch-design-obscured-marketing-materials/ https://www.macrumors.com/2021/10/17/apple-notch-design-obsc...

yepthatsreality 5y ago

I agree. I finally upgraded from a Iphone SE to a 12 Mini. The notch is horrible and I’m not sure why people wave it away with “I got used to it”. I’ve had it for months. No idea what lunatic at Apple thought it would be nice for a laptop. Can’t they come up with something a little more original than removing screen real estate to stand out? I will be switching back to an SE just based on how overall unwieldy the new phone is. The notch is just one of the nails in the coffin. The notch to me says, “now I know which products not to buy”.

asdff 5y ago

It's a macbook though. You can just write a program that moves your screen down a millimeter or however much and live your life notch free with peace of mind.

shantara 5y ago

Update: >macOS Hides the Notch on New MacBook Pro in Full-Screen Mode https://www.macrumors.com/2021/10/18/macos-hides-notch-on-new-macbook-pros/ https://www.macrumors.com/2021/10/18/macos-hides-notch-on-ne... I take back what I said about the notch. It is not as bad, as it initially seemed to be

throw03172019 5y ago

It sits where the menu bar is anyway. Similar to the status bar on iOS.