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Democracy is about democratic control over the government, not democratic control over all individuals or aspects of life. It's not injustice that people can't
by friedman23 5y ago
Democracy is about democratic control over the government, not democratic control over all individuals or aspects of life.
It's not injustice that people can't vote to control what you learn, read, eat, or do. If you write a book, our government isn't suddenly not a democracy because people can't vote on what you write even though you technically now have more power over other individuals since you can control what goes in your next book.
- guerrilla 5y agoCounterpoint: Those effected by decisions should be making them and those not effected by decisions should not be making them.
- friedman23 5y agoThat isn't a counterpoint, it's completely ancillary to what we are discussing. Whether someone is affected by something does not matter. The only thing that matters are rights. People have freedom and the freedom to live their life as they see fit as long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of others.
- onemoresoop 5y agoHow about the right to a decent life? You don't see the decimation of the middle class as a problem for a democracy? I'm not sure what you're getting at, technically you may have a point (I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt here) but at the end of the day when all resources are owned by a few, things start to break down.
- friedman23 5y ago>How about the right to a decent life? Everybody has the right to achieve a decent life. What you are actually asking for is the right to have material wealth. Which isn't a right. >technically you may have a point (I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt here) I don't want the benefit of the doubt from you. You advocate robbing people and spread hate against a group you don't like because you don't have enough toys to make you happy. You are just a part of a mob that has repeated the same mistake countless times in history, with your beliefs you are practically not an individual.
- nemothekid 5y ago>Everybody has the right to achieve a decent life. What you are actually asking for is the right to have material wealth. Which isn't a right. I don't see how you can so easily divorce the two. If I can't afford to send my kids to school - do I have a decent life? If I can't afford to see the doctor, do I have a decent life? I'm not arguing that everyone should be afforded to drive Lamborghini's, but that the American project of guaranteeing individual liberties and freedom is predicated on some wealth distribution; otherwise the working class are effectively slaves to their own existence. Democracy is a means on how that power is utilized in order to control the individual lives of others. You wouldn't reject that standard for any other law; you wouldn't allow rich people to openly commit murder because you didn't want to infringe in their individual liberty.
- onemoresoop 5y agoEverybody has the right to a achieve a decent life, yes, I'm not advocating giving a Mercedes Benz to any street bum. But the former is becoming harder and harder these days solely because all resources are in the hands of the few who do not contribute anything, risk nothing and take in more and more. And I advocate robbing anyone? No, I advocate pointing the finger to the robbers instead. I withdraw the benefit of the doubt I have given you earlier, you are very unreasonable and dogmatic in your views. Look around you from time to time, you're going to see a lot more people failing who should have not, hard working people with good work ethic.
- guerrilla 5y agoYes, I was suggesting a right: The right not to be effected by decisions you're not involved in making and the right to be involved in all decisions that effect you. I see that as necessary for freedom and thus any alternative infringing on that right.
- zaik 5y agoBy funding campaigns, lobbying, running think tanks, owning media reaching millions of people, having people of your company sit in government agencies (...) economic power quickly translates to political power.
- friedman23 5y agoIntelligence translates into political power, being extremely charismatic translates into political power too. Should we start giving lobotomies to people that are too smart and throwing acid on the faces of people that are too good looking so that they can't exert their political will on others?
- sudosysgen 5y agoI guess Trump and Bush must have missed the memo. I guess the Nobel Prize recepients missed the memo that they had a lot of political powers too.