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Similar thoughts from Orwell from around the same time: https://www.orwellfoundation.com/the-orwell-foundation/orwell/essays-and-other-works/notes-on-nationalis

Similar thoughts from Orwell from around the same time: https://www.orwellfoundation.com/the-orwell-foundation/orwell/essays-and-other-works/notes-on-nationalism/ https://www.orwellfoundation.com/the-orwell-foundation/orwel... It's curious how these both name a phenomenon with words that seem off-target, "stupidity" or "nationalism"; they seem to mean something like reducing yourself to a soldier for an egregore. Anyone have a better word for the general pattern?

avitous 5y ago
Erich Fromm's "Escape From Freedom", written around the same time, also touches on similar ideas centered around why and in what situations people can be steered toward totalitarianism.
deleted 5y ago
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pugio 5y ago
In The Scout Mindset, Julia Galef calls a very related state "the soldier mindset" - this is similar enough to the term you proposed but I think you would enjoy reading the book.
- abecedarius 5y ago
  It's very good. I'd say she focuses more on people in a more reachable state; I can imagine the eaten-by-egregores reading the book going "Yeah! This is what's wrong with the outgroup!" or just angrily rejecting it all, but it's mainly about how/why to improve in this regard on the margin. She sees the soldier mindset as having its place. Orwell acknowledges we all have these tendencies but focuses on the people he sees as too far gone (I have no idea about all those 1940s folks).
robocat 5y ago
> nationalism Tribal is my best guess at his meaning, but ingroup is related, or perhaps partisanship when applied to American politics. Nationalism feels incorrect, especially when he chooses examples of beliefs that are against their own nation (skip to the heading “negative nationalism”), or examples that are not much to do with nationality (political Catholicism, Antisemitism, Pacifism). Another theme is blind loyalty (authority figures) versus freethinking. As a geek I try to avoid succumbing to geek groupthink, although HN doesn’t always help that goal.

avitous 5y ago

Erich Fromm's "Escape From Freedom", written around the same time, also touches on similar ideas centered around why and in what situations people can be steered toward totalitarianism.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

pugio 5y ago

In The Scout Mindset, Julia Galef calls a very related state "the soldier mindset" - this is similar enough to the term you proposed but I think you would enjoy reading the book.

abecedarius 5y ago
It's very good. I'd say she focuses more on people in a more reachable state; I can imagine the eaten-by-egregores reading the book going "Yeah! This is what's wrong with the outgroup!" or just angrily rejecting it all, but it's mainly about how/why to improve in this regard on the margin. She sees the soldier mindset as having its place. Orwell acknowledges we all have these tendencies but focuses on the people he sees as too far gone (I have no idea about all those 1940s folks).

robocat 5y ago

> nationalism Tribal is my best guess at his meaning, but ingroup is related, or perhaps partisanship when applied to American politics. Nationalism feels incorrect, especially when he chooses examples of beliefs that are against their own nation (skip to the heading “negative nationalism”), or examples that are not much to do with nationality (political Catholicism, Antisemitism, Pacifism). Another theme is blind loyalty (authority figures) versus freethinking. As a geek I try to avoid succumbing to geek groupthink, although HN doesn’t always help that goal.