4 ms·

I still don't understand why CA is phasing out nuclear power.

by whalesalad 5y ago

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
ink404 5y ago
Incentive for other 'green' sources of electricity to come to market
- bufferoverflow 5y ago
  There's nothing greener than an already built nuclear reactor.
  - brandonmenc 5y ago
    > already built Therefore, ineligible for pocketing green subsidies to build new stuff.
    - SilasX 5y ago
      Yikes, that’s a perverse incentive they should fix.
  - minhazm 5y ago
    I think the concern with nuclear energy is around the possibility of a nuclear meltdown. The media portrayal of nuclear energy is that it's very dangerous, even if that's not really true.
koheripbal 5y ago
Because lobby groups for environmentalism/green energy are stuck in the Cold War mentality that anything nuclear is bringing forth the apocalypse.
- gedy 5y ago
  Nuclear is (one of) the new invisible demons flying around to be afraid of.
  - TrispusAttucks 5y ago
    It's an old demon. Ironically it's one of the few things that could have prevented our current climate crisis. A great tragedy of human hubris.
    - dehrmann 5y ago
      It's more throwing the baby out with the bathwater than hubris.
      - TrispusAttucks 5y ago
        hu·bris (noun) excessive pride or self-confidence -- I'd say it fits but yours [1] is a better known characterization. I was using it in the tradition of [2] Greek Tragedy Hubris. "The overbearing pride which leads humans to follow paths or projects which lead to certain self-destruction." [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don't_throw_the_baby_out_with_the_bathwater https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don't_throw_the_baby_out_wit... [2] http://theatreofancientgreece.blogspot.com/2014/11/hubris-or-hybris.html http://theatreofancientgreece.blogspot.com/2014/11/hubris-or...?
  - vnchr 5y ago
    It powers evil Bitcoin mining
  - andbberger 5y ago
    it's not though. fear of flying is common enough but people accept that's not backed up the statistics. nuclear energy is in the same camp. it is objectively the safest method for power generation
- epistasis 5y ago
  This is not why the plant is being shut down. It is reaching end of life, which means that if it wants an renewal on its license, it needs to come into compliance with modern environmental laws. The key violation for the current plant is its cooling system, which uses once through sea water. To limit the damage to the environment, a modern cooling system would need to be built. When PG&E took bids for new cooling systems, all designs had a construction cost of many billions. Rather than pay for such an expensive upgrade, PG&E made the wise decision to spend that money on cheaper replacements. The problem is that despite having a decade to get things in order, they haven't yet done met the capacity needs for the rest of the state, much less for this capacity retirement.
AdrianB1 5y ago
Same as Germany: politics.
ravenstine 5y ago
CA politicians are largely integrated into a global financial system that extracts wealth from the middle class by facilitating crises. If crises didn't happen, they don't have an excuse to intervene and tax the population by-proxy. It's no coincidence that when Newsom's governance became threatened that they brought out Obama, Biden, Warren, Sanders, and Pelosi to defend him. They need control of California to use it as a proving ground and maintain the influence the state has. It's not about green energy, Democrats or Republicans, but globalized wealth extraction. Plus you factor in our remarkably low average IQ in contrast to the vast majority of states and it's hardly a surprise. Our education is abysmal and we feed junk to our poor. How anyone can call CA a success astounds me. It's a political and economical success, but it's hardly a success in what states are actually intended for, which is to serve its citizens.
- sul_tasto 5y ago
  “Never let a crisis go to waste.” I too see this pattern over and over again.
anonporridge 5y ago
What radicalized me on nuclear power was seeing the decommissioned San Onofre nuclear plants replaced with natural gas plants.
epistasis 5y ago
There is no coordinated plan to phase out nuclear power, the plants are just reaching end of their licenses, ans nobody wants to deal with the expense of bringing nuclear into compliance with modern laws.

I still don't understand why CA is phasing out nuclear power.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

ink404 5y ago

Incentive for other 'green' sources of electricity to come to market

bufferoverflow 5y ago
There's nothing greener than an already built nuclear reactor.
- brandonmenc 5y ago
  > already built Therefore, ineligible for pocketing green subsidies to build new stuff.
  - SilasX 5y ago
    Yikes, that’s a perverse incentive they should fix.
- minhazm 5y ago
  I think the concern with nuclear energy is around the possibility of a nuclear meltdown. The media portrayal of nuclear energy is that it's very dangerous, even if that's not really true.

koheripbal 5y ago

Because lobby groups for environmentalism/green energy are stuck in the Cold War mentality that anything nuclear is bringing forth the apocalypse.

gedy 5y ago
Nuclear is (one of) the new invisible demons flying around to be afraid of.
- TrispusAttucks 5y ago
  It's an old demon. Ironically it's one of the few things that could have prevented our current climate crisis. A great tragedy of human hubris.
  - dehrmann 5y ago
    It's more throwing the baby out with the bathwater than hubris.
    - TrispusAttucks 5y ago
      hu·bris (noun) excessive pride or self-confidence -- I'd say it fits but yours [1] is a better known characterization. I was using it in the tradition of [2] Greek Tragedy Hubris. "The overbearing pride which leads humans to follow paths or projects which lead to certain self-destruction." [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don't_throw_the_baby_out_with_the_bathwater https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don't_throw_the_baby_out_wit... [2] http://theatreofancientgreece.blogspot.com/2014/11/hubris-or-hybris.html http://theatreofancientgreece.blogspot.com/2014/11/hubris-or...?
- vnchr 5y ago
  It powers evil Bitcoin mining
- andbberger 5y ago
  it's not though. fear of flying is common enough but people accept that's not backed up the statistics. nuclear energy is in the same camp. it is objectively the safest method for power generation
epistasis 5y ago
This is not why the plant is being shut down. It is reaching end of life, which means that if it wants an renewal on its license, it needs to come into compliance with modern environmental laws. The key violation for the current plant is its cooling system, which uses once through sea water. To limit the damage to the environment, a modern cooling system would need to be built. When PG&E took bids for new cooling systems, all designs had a construction cost of many billions. Rather than pay for such an expensive upgrade, PG&E made the wise decision to spend that money on cheaper replacements. The problem is that despite having a decade to get things in order, they haven't yet done met the capacity needs for the rest of the state, much less for this capacity retirement.

AdrianB1 5y ago

Same as Germany: politics.

ravenstine 5y ago

CA politicians are largely integrated into a global financial system that extracts wealth from the middle class by facilitating crises. If crises didn't happen, they don't have an excuse to intervene and tax the population by-proxy. It's no coincidence that when Newsom's governance became threatened that they brought out Obama, Biden, Warren, Sanders, and Pelosi to defend him. They need control of California to use it as a proving ground and maintain the influence the state has. It's not about green energy, Democrats or Republicans, but globalized wealth extraction. Plus you factor in our remarkably low average IQ in contrast to the vast majority of states and it's hardly a surprise. Our education is abysmal and we feed junk to our poor. How anyone can call CA a success astounds me. It's a political and economical success, but it's hardly a success in what states are actually intended for, which is to serve its citizens.

sul_tasto 5y ago
“Never let a crisis go to waste.” I too see this pattern over and over again.

anonporridge 5y ago

What radicalized me on nuclear power was seeing the decommissioned San Onofre nuclear plants replaced with natural gas plants.

epistasis 5y ago

There is no coordinated plan to phase out nuclear power, the plants are just reaching end of their licenses, ans nobody wants to deal with the expense of bringing nuclear into compliance with modern laws.