5 ms·

Everyone mentions the scammy nature of NFTs and cryptocurrencies, but I think the bigger reason might be that Steam doesn't want to be subject to financial repo

Everyone mentions the scammy nature of NFTs and cryptocurrencies, but I think the bigger reason might be that Steam doesn't want to be subject to financial reporting requirements when people buy and sell crypto equities on their platform. KYC applied to Steam would be a nightmare.

tpurves 5y ago
This is the simplest and correct answer. Intentionally or otherwise, finding yourself operating as an unlicensed securities dealer, deposit holder, brokerage or money transmitter is going to give you a very bad time with any number of federal authorities that (heavily) regulate all of those things.
HugoDaniel 5y ago
Like many I am willing to buy NFTs and enjoy their many benefits. Steam will likely try to capitalize on it when it becomes an even bigger market by either introducing their own marketplace or token or something else.
- X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
  I'd guess that in a couple years they'll roll out their own L2 system that has a long withdrawal window and reserve the right to freeze funds.
  - Ekaros 5y ago
    I doubt they ever allow withdrawal. They are in perfect position, they either keep getting 5 or 15% cut from market transactions over and over again or 20-30% cut of game sales. Or even 100% cut with certain items. Why allow money to go out when it is almost yours anyway.
    - X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
      Depends on if they are starting to lose marketplace capture or not.
- jfk13 5y ago
  > "their many benefits" I'm trying to think what "many benefits" those might be... can you clarify?
  - q1w2 5y ago
    Selling it when the hype hits peak, of course! ...and I'm being honest because I don't think any court in the world has ever acknowledged an NFT as proof of ownership in any dispute.
    - mminer237 5y ago
      An NFT isn't proof of ownership of a work. That already exists: it's called "copyright". An NFT is "ownership" of a hash of the work, with no actual rights attached thereby.
    - HeadsUpHigh 5y ago
      No one is buying NFTs expecting copyright ownership right now, that's just the nonsense people who are out of it think. There are NFTs that provide copyright with the purchase but that's optional. For now they are an alternative way to directly pay artists. An interesting idea that is gaining traction within the photographing community are people NFTing their photos and releasing them via CC when they are sold. If you buy the nft you get to fund the artist and this collectible has value afterwards. Usually the more scummy ones you see are limited piece PFP collections with rarity traits etc. The OGs( cryptopunks) where interesting as the first NFTs to be ever made but the current churn is just hype. Besides that the more artistic generative collections like the art blocks curated are interesting. Most of the big pieces are in the collections of people that have no intention to ever sell them. Some are experimenting with online galleries of shorts. Basically throughout the whole hype bubble with nonsensical projects( crypto is the definition of fuck around and find out) there are some who are exploring some cool artistic stuff. Personally I never understood high art so I'm staying out of it. Also don't get caught up on the prices, these are priced in Eth, not $$. Eth was $80 a couple years ago and a few cents when it launched( and yes I do know people who have held eth since way back then). When something appreciates so fast it makes sense that some people are more willing to spend it in such ways.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- astlouis44 5y ago
  This is the correct answer. They know how much money is potentially at stake here, they want to bide their time and do it right while they formulate a way to capitalize on this mammoth of an opportunity. Axie Infinity just recently raised $152M at a $3B valuation, and it's not going away. People from the Philippines are making a livelihood out of this game, and that is so powerful I can't even put it into words. The genie is out of the bottle so to speak, and the entire world is going to get into P2E games and the metaverse sooner rather than later. If Steam is really serious about not entertaining this, there is a HUGE opportunity for a new contender to come in and disrupt them by allowing blockchain-based games. WebGPU + WebAssembly in particular is a fascinating way to deliver binaries without having to go through walled gardens, and you can today hook these games up wallets like Metamask. I'd go as far as to say a meaningful part of web3 will be decentralized gaming on the blockchain.
  - JCharante 5y ago
    > Axie Infinity is a trading and battling game that allows players to collect, breed, raise, battle, and trade creatures known as "axies" (characters based on axolotl), which are digitized as NFTs. That just sounds like CryptoKittens > Axie Infinity uses NFTs for the rights to each pet that is purchased. To grow these pets, you purchase or farm SLPs, or small-love potions. You can sell these pets or SLPs for cryptocurrency, then swap into your respective currency. I don't see what's novel here, the game was intentionally designed to store inventory/assets with NFTs. It sounds like these people are farming in-game items and selling them to other players (whales). It's literally just gold farming in wow except allowed by the developers. Any other game that lets users trade their inventory for crypto (to prevent charge backs if you were using paypal etc) could also do this without NFTs. I wouldn't want to play a game that allows gold farming, because then the metric of your progress isn't how much time you've spent playing, but just how much money you've spent on it.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > Steam will likely try to capitalize on it when it becomes an even bigger market by either introducing their own marketplace or token or something else. They may be a big business, but its not clear at all that it is th kind of business that Steam wants to be in. Just because a business opportunity exists doesn't mean a particular existing incumbent business in a different field will transition to engage in it.
43g34g34 5y ago
This is most likely it. They already collect light KYC (SSN) if you make significant sales on those trading cards that you get from games randomly and can sell or dust. Currently, there are not enough clear rules around how to regulate any digital asset, so it could be a very complicated problem for Steam. I do believe we'll eventually see integration of digital assets into the platform, but I believe that will absolutely be the case with all major platforms.
madrox 5y ago
Agreed. Tangentially, seems likely to me is that blockchain makes it impossible for Steam to police fraud. There's consumer expectations around refundability that Steam simply won't be able to meet in this world, and people will blame Steam for if they're on the bad end of it.
q1w2 5y ago
It's not only KYC. They would need to start putting in anti-money laundering detection reports, OFAC reporting... the list of financial reports/audit/regulations is ENORMOUS. No way a gaming company wants to do this... in every country they operate in. Not to mention, that gaming platforms have been used in the past to launder money, so it's not even a stretch to assume that would be happening.

tpurves 5y ago

This is the simplest and correct answer. Intentionally or otherwise, finding yourself operating as an unlicensed securities dealer, deposit holder, brokerage or money transmitter is going to give you a very bad time with any number of federal authorities that (heavily) regulate all of those things.

HugoDaniel 5y ago

Like many I am willing to buy NFTs and enjoy their many benefits. Steam will likely try to capitalize on it when it becomes an even bigger market by either introducing their own marketplace or token or something else.

X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
I'd guess that in a couple years they'll roll out their own L2 system that has a long withdrawal window and reserve the right to freeze funds.
- Ekaros 5y ago
  I doubt they ever allow withdrawal. They are in perfect position, they either keep getting 5 or 15% cut from market transactions over and over again or 20-30% cut of game sales. Or even 100% cut with certain items. Why allow money to go out when it is almost yours anyway.
  - X6S1x6Okd1st 5y ago
    Depends on if they are starting to lose marketplace capture or not.
jfk13 5y ago
> "their many benefits" I'm trying to think what "many benefits" those might be... can you clarify?
- q1w2 5y ago
  Selling it when the hype hits peak, of course! ...and I'm being honest because I don't think any court in the world has ever acknowledged an NFT as proof of ownership in any dispute.
  - mminer237 5y ago
    An NFT isn't proof of ownership of a work. That already exists: it's called "copyright". An NFT is "ownership" of a hash of the work, with no actual rights attached thereby.
  - HeadsUpHigh 5y ago
    No one is buying NFTs expecting copyright ownership right now, that's just the nonsense people who are out of it think. There are NFTs that provide copyright with the purchase but that's optional. For now they are an alternative way to directly pay artists. An interesting idea that is gaining traction within the photographing community are people NFTing their photos and releasing them via CC when they are sold. If you buy the nft you get to fund the artist and this collectible has value afterwards. Usually the more scummy ones you see are limited piece PFP collections with rarity traits etc. The OGs( cryptopunks) where interesting as the first NFTs to be ever made but the current churn is just hype. Besides that the more artistic generative collections like the art blocks curated are interesting. Most of the big pieces are in the collections of people that have no intention to ever sell them. Some are experimenting with online galleries of shorts. Basically throughout the whole hype bubble with nonsensical projects( crypto is the definition of fuck around and find out) there are some who are exploring some cool artistic stuff. Personally I never understood high art so I'm staying out of it. Also don't get caught up on the prices, these are priced in Eth, not $$. Eth was $80 a couple years ago and a few cents when it launched( and yes I do know people who have held eth since way back then). When something appreciates so fast it makes sense that some people are more willing to spend it in such ways.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
astlouis44 5y ago
This is the correct answer. They know how much money is potentially at stake here, they want to bide their time and do it right while they formulate a way to capitalize on this mammoth of an opportunity. Axie Infinity just recently raised $152M at a $3B valuation, and it's not going away. People from the Philippines are making a livelihood out of this game, and that is so powerful I can't even put it into words. The genie is out of the bottle so to speak, and the entire world is going to get into P2E games and the metaverse sooner rather than later. If Steam is really serious about not entertaining this, there is a HUGE opportunity for a new contender to come in and disrupt them by allowing blockchain-based games. WebGPU + WebAssembly in particular is a fascinating way to deliver binaries without having to go through walled gardens, and you can today hook these games up wallets like Metamask. I'd go as far as to say a meaningful part of web3 will be decentralized gaming on the blockchain.
- JCharante 5y ago
  > Axie Infinity is a trading and battling game that allows players to collect, breed, raise, battle, and trade creatures known as "axies" (characters based on axolotl), which are digitized as NFTs. That just sounds like CryptoKittens > Axie Infinity uses NFTs for the rights to each pet that is purchased. To grow these pets, you purchase or farm SLPs, or small-love potions. You can sell these pets or SLPs for cryptocurrency, then swap into your respective currency. I don't see what's novel here, the game was intentionally designed to store inventory/assets with NFTs. It sounds like these people are farming in-game items and selling them to other players (whales). It's literally just gold farming in wow except allowed by the developers. Any other game that lets users trade their inventory for crypto (to prevent charge backs if you were using paypal etc) could also do this without NFTs. I wouldn't want to play a game that allows gold farming, because then the metric of your progress isn't how much time you've spent playing, but just how much money you've spent on it.
dragonwriter 5y ago
> Steam will likely try to capitalize on it when it becomes an even bigger market by either introducing their own marketplace or token or something else. They may be a big business, but its not clear at all that it is th kind of business that Steam wants to be in. Just because a business opportunity exists doesn't mean a particular existing incumbent business in a different field will transition to engage in it.

43g34g34 5y ago

This is most likely it. They already collect light KYC (SSN) if you make significant sales on those trading cards that you get from games randomly and can sell or dust. Currently, there are not enough clear rules around how to regulate any digital asset, so it could be a very complicated problem for Steam. I do believe we'll eventually see integration of digital assets into the platform, but I believe that will absolutely be the case with all major platforms.

madrox 5y ago

Agreed. Tangentially, seems likely to me is that blockchain makes it impossible for Steam to police fraud. There's consumer expectations around refundability that Steam simply won't be able to meet in this world, and people will blame Steam for if they're on the bad end of it.

q1w2 5y ago

It's not only KYC. They would need to start putting in anti-money laundering detection reports, OFAC reporting... the list of financial reports/audit/regulations is ENORMOUS. No way a gaming company wants to do this... in every country they operate in. Not to mention, that gaming platforms have been used in the past to launder money, so it's not even a stretch to assume that would be happening.