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In the US, the main problems are housing, healthcare, and education. All with heavy government involvement, so Senators decide to get involved in Tech to stop

In the US, the main problems are housing, healthcare, and education. All with heavy government involvement, so Senators decide to get involved in Tech to stop what is legal in every other industry?

deleted 5y ago
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thr0wawayf00 5y ago
The big problem with this argument is that tech is everywhere now. Housing? Look at the pressure that companies like Zillow are applying to housing market by buying up houses and holding on to them without providing any real value to the market. Healthcare? Google and Amazon are both making inroads to capturing and owning various aspects of healthcare data transfer and management, which is one the most cumbersome and expensive aspects of healthcare today. Education? Several big tech companies are involved there as well. You can't separate big tech from any of the industries you just listed because their hands are in all of them, which is one of the big reasons we're having this conversation now.
- jedberg 5y ago
  In defense of Zillow, they are in fact providing a service -- liquidity. If you need to get out of your house now, Zillow makes that possible. Edit: To be clear, I don't think this is good for society as a whole, but they do provide value to someone -- they aren't just sitting in the middle rent seeking.
  - mistermann 5y ago
    Zillow does many things, some of them useful and beneficial to individuals and society, others not so much. Back in the good old days society tended to realize that we have the power to collectively determine which activities are allowed and which are not, but it seems like somewhere along the way we forgot that we have this power.
  - chucksta 5y ago
    On the other hand, they are impossible to compete with pushing normal people with local money out of the market. Very few individuals can, or will put in an all cash offer, as-is, no inspection
    - jedberg 5y ago
      I agree, I don't think it's beneficial to society as a whole, but they do provide a service that some people find useful.
  - redisman 5y ago
    Wow that’s so great. If you’re filthy rich
  - thr0wawayf00 5y ago
    And companies like Black Cube that run psyops campaigns on social media are providing a service too, someone absolutely benefits from it. That doesn't automatically mean it's beneficial to society.
    - jedberg 5y ago
      I never said what Zillow does is good or beneficial, just that they do add value.
      - thr0wawayf00 5y ago
        Sure, they add value for those that own property at the expense of everyone else. When you go to defend a company that essentially acts to exclude large swaths of the community from home ownership by accumulating real estate assets and driving prices up $400+/sq ft in many communities without actually doing any work to these houses, it's important to distinguish who exactly benefits here, because it's not most people that benefit from this. Defending a company that adds value exclusively to the wealthier, property-owning class to everyone else's detriment by arguing that they "add value" is a bit of an oversimplification, isn't it?
        deleted 5y ago
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  - bnjms 5y ago
    I’d consider providing liquidity a negative. Doesn’t that prevent people from selling for lower values and help prop up housing prices?
    - jedberg 5y ago
      It's a negative for the local housing market, but it's a positive for the seller as well as a positive for the housing market the seller is moving to, because now they have cash to buy in the new market. Like I said, I think it's a net negative for society, but there are people who get value from it.
      - loeg 5y ago
        Isn't liquidity good for buyers and sellers? They're essentially acting as a market maker, no?
- weezin 5y ago
  Are you really making the argument that Zillow is the cause of housing prices going up? They bought 2,373 homes out of 6.5 million sold in 2020... Housing prices went up because of low interest rates (caused by the government).
anotherman554 5y ago
Healthcare and education may be problems in America, but we are better off than we were before the government programs provided emergencies rooms and a literate population.
KoftaBob 5y ago
Regulating tech companies has bipartisan support, so it's an easy way for politicians to get things passed that will be popular with their constituents. Unlike other industries, tech companies haven't banded together to create some SuperPAC named something like "American Association of Tech Innovators" to lobby/bribe politicians against regulating. For healthcare, you have the vile "American Hospital Association" and "Pharmaceutical Research & Manufacturers of America " goblins trying to block any legislation that will lower healthcare costs at their expense. For housing, the high costs are heavily affected by restrictive local zoning limiting the new supply of housing. The "lobbying" in this case is local NIMBY groups that every state/city has to fight. For education, the high cost of college is due to the fact that the federal government originates/backs the vast majority of student loans. They basically allow colleges to charge whatever they want, pay them up front, and then it's on the federal gov to collect from students afterwards. When they're effectively handing colleges blank checks, no shit they're going to charge the max they can get away with. It's so straightforward and infuriating that this point is rarely ever discussed in the debates around college costs. If these "non-profit" colleges (vast majority are) want access to that vast student loan money, they should have to play ball and only charge what the feds will allow. If they want to charge more, it should be their problem to find a way to get paid.
a_t48 5y ago
Are you sure you don't have the causation backwards? "X is bad because the govt stepped in" vs "the govt stepped in because X is bad/hard"
- rubyist5eva 5y ago
  The govt stepped in because X is bad…now X is worse. Happens more often than not.
HWR_14 5y ago
Housing, healthcare and education are big and huge problems. They used to be even worse. That's why the government got involved.

In the US, the main problems are housing, healthcare, and education. All with heavy government involvement, so Senators decide to get involved in Tech to stop what is legal in every other industry?

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

thr0wawayf00 5y ago

The big problem with this argument is that tech is everywhere now. Housing? Look at the pressure that companies like Zillow are applying to housing market by buying up houses and holding on to them without providing any real value to the market. Healthcare? Google and Amazon are both making inroads to capturing and owning various aspects of healthcare data transfer and management, which is one the most cumbersome and expensive aspects of healthcare today. Education? Several big tech companies are involved there as well. You can't separate big tech from any of the industries you just listed because their hands are in all of them, which is one of the big reasons we're having this conversation now.

jedberg 5y ago
In defense of Zillow, they are in fact providing a service -- liquidity. If you need to get out of your house now, Zillow makes that possible. Edit: To be clear, I don't think this is good for society as a whole, but they do provide value to someone -- they aren't just sitting in the middle rent seeking.
- mistermann 5y ago
  Zillow does many things, some of them useful and beneficial to individuals and society, others not so much. Back in the good old days society tended to realize that we have the power to collectively determine which activities are allowed and which are not, but it seems like somewhere along the way we forgot that we have this power.
- chucksta 5y ago
  On the other hand, they are impossible to compete with pushing normal people with local money out of the market. Very few individuals can, or will put in an all cash offer, as-is, no inspection
  - jedberg 5y ago
    I agree, I don't think it's beneficial to society as a whole, but they do provide a service that some people find useful.
- redisman 5y ago
  Wow that’s so great. If you’re filthy rich
- thr0wawayf00 5y ago
  And companies like Black Cube that run psyops campaigns on social media are providing a service too, someone absolutely benefits from it. That doesn't automatically mean it's beneficial to society.
  - jedberg 5y ago
    I never said what Zillow does is good or beneficial, just that they do add value.
    - thr0wawayf00 5y ago
      Sure, they add value for those that own property at the expense of everyone else. When you go to defend a company that essentially acts to exclude large swaths of the community from home ownership by accumulating real estate assets and driving prices up $400+/sq ft in many communities without actually doing any work to these houses, it's important to distinguish who exactly benefits here, because it's not most people that benefit from this. Defending a company that adds value exclusively to the wealthier, property-owning class to everyone else's detriment by arguing that they "add value" is a bit of an oversimplification, isn't it?
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
- bnjms 5y ago
  I’d consider providing liquidity a negative. Doesn’t that prevent people from selling for lower values and help prop up housing prices?
  - jedberg 5y ago
    It's a negative for the local housing market, but it's a positive for the seller as well as a positive for the housing market the seller is moving to, because now they have cash to buy in the new market. Like I said, I think it's a net negative for society, but there are people who get value from it.
    - loeg 5y ago
      Isn't liquidity good for buyers and sellers? They're essentially acting as a market maker, no?
weezin 5y ago
Are you really making the argument that Zillow is the cause of housing prices going up? They bought 2,373 homes out of 6.5 million sold in 2020... Housing prices went up because of low interest rates (caused by the government).

anotherman554 5y ago

Healthcare and education may be problems in America, but we are better off than we were before the government programs provided emergencies rooms and a literate population.

KoftaBob 5y ago

Regulating tech companies has bipartisan support, so it's an easy way for politicians to get things passed that will be popular with their constituents. Unlike other industries, tech companies haven't banded together to create some SuperPAC named something like "American Association of Tech Innovators" to lobby/bribe politicians against regulating. For healthcare, you have the vile "American Hospital Association" and "Pharmaceutical Research & Manufacturers of America " goblins trying to block any legislation that will lower healthcare costs at their expense. For housing, the high costs are heavily affected by restrictive local zoning limiting the new supply of housing. The "lobbying" in this case is local NIMBY groups that every state/city has to fight. For education, the high cost of college is due to the fact that the federal government originates/backs the vast majority of student loans. They basically allow colleges to charge whatever they want, pay them up front, and then it's on the federal gov to collect from students afterwards. When they're effectively handing colleges blank checks, no shit they're going to charge the max they can get away with. It's so straightforward and infuriating that this point is rarely ever discussed in the debates around college costs. If these "non-profit" colleges (vast majority are) want access to that vast student loan money, they should have to play ball and only charge what the feds will allow. If they want to charge more, it should be their problem to find a way to get paid.

a_t48 5y ago

Are you sure you don't have the causation backwards? "X is bad because the govt stepped in" vs "the govt stepped in because X is bad/hard"

rubyist5eva 5y ago
The govt stepped in because X is bad…now X is worse. Happens more often than not.

HWR_14 5y ago

Housing, healthcare and education are big and huge problems. They used to be even worse. That's why the government got involved.