6 ms·

So you’re arguing for free hunting licenses? I’m joking of course, a hunting license isn’t a form of ID. Curiously, my CHL isn’t a form of ID, even though it i

So you’re arguing for free hunting licenses? I’m joking of course, a hunting license isn’t a form of ID. Curiously, my CHL isn’t a form of ID, even though it is state issued, has my pic, and I had to be finger printed to get it.

xxpor 5y ago
In some states (Texas I think), a concealed carry license is acceptable ID, but a student ID isn't. There is, of course, no bias in the types of people that have one but not the other.
- _-david-_ 5y ago
  A CCL requires a background check. A student ID does not.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - jlokier 5y ago
    There is, of course, no bias in the types of people who are comfortable with and can easily pass a background check, and those who are not or cannot. In a free and fair election, the right to vote is not be based on your detailed personal history, or whether you have done something that looks off and might cause you trouble with authorities. Even if it's just fear of imagined trouble that puts people off feeling safe to obtain the necessary approvals to vote, that's enough to prevent a free and fair election.
    - _-david-_ 5y ago
      I am not suggesting you should need a background check to vote. All I am saying is we have a good idea that the person with a CCL is that person and they are not a felon (in some states felons cannot vote). Anybody can go to a community college including a noncitizen. There is no background check and no real verification the person is who they say they are. You just show up and have your picture taken. If you are going to trust one of these forms of IDs it is clear that it should be the CCL.
      - xxpor 5y ago
        Non-citizens can get CCLs too.
        djsbs 5y ago
        Only if they’re legal US persons. Ie they have a green card. Undocumented, student visas, etc are banned from buying guns
        _-david-_ 5y ago
        I did not mean to imply a noncitizen could not get a CCL. What I meant is we know the person is who they say they are when they have a CCL. This means if a noncitizen has a CCL they would be unable to use this as proof they are a citizen. If a noncitizen goes to a university they could claim they are somebody other than who they are and could use the fake ID as proof to vote. Since there are no background checks to get a university ID it isn't really proof of anything.
        ModernMech 5y ago
        Even if you feel the verification that goes into a student ID is not strict enough, that could have been remedied in the very bill that was just signed into law. Why didn’t they, I wonder? But I think student IDs do undergo a pretty significant verification. They are going to at least need transcripts and some other ID card like a driver’s license to prove your id. They do background checks as a matter of course for funding. Community colleges do verify residency to determine which tuition rate you pay. 99% of the students most community colleges are state residents anyway. They could have just made a requirement that state funded schools must display residency information and an expiration date in the card, and there would be no problem.
        _-david-_ 5y ago
        My university did no checks on address or anything like that. I went to a private university so that could be why. It is possible that public colleges do more verification. Honestly I think the best solution is to just give a free ID to everyone. As far as I know every state that requires an ID for voting has free IDs. We should make it easier and more convenient instead of allowing a bunch of alternative forms of ID. Driver's license, voter ID license, generic state ID or federal ID (passport) should be sufficient.
    - staysafeanon 5y ago
      >There is, of course, no bias in the types of people who are comfortable with and can easily pass a background check, and those who are not or cannot. You're correct, there's no bias on the system for background checks. Anyone of any race, color, or creed can get a background check to verify their eligibility to exercise their right to own/carry firearms and vote.
- WillPostForFood 5y ago
  And no difference in the level of verification to get the ID. You need a state issued ID, and federal background check, and full fingerprints to get a Student ID, right? In terms of rigor of identity authentication: CHL > Driver's license.
  - ModernMech 5y ago
    There is a lot of verification that goes into a student ID. Even at the community college level they are going to at least verify your residency to make sure you are paying the correct tuition rate. My local CC even differentiates this on their IDs. But at the state level you will need much more. We are talking 12 years of transcripts and a high school diploma. Vaccination records going back to birth. Income information (paystubs, bank accounts) on you and your family so they can verify your ability to pay tuition or qualify for aid. In order to qualify you’ll need to undergo background checks (felons are not eligible for aid). Then you need letter of reference from at least 3 individuals and your HS guidance counselor. Finally, you will need official SAT test scores, and the college board does their own process of identity verification. Is the process perfect? No. But if you were looking for a vector for fraud, student IDs are probably one of the most onerous.
- mgarfias 5y ago
  Try giving your Texas CCW to the TSA to board a plane. They’ll take a Costco card with a shitty pic, but not the CHL
- staysafeanon 5y ago
  >There is, of course, no bias in the types of people that have one but not the other. I agree, and it's in Texas' state law: any legal resident regardless of race, color, or creed can apply for a concealed carry license. It's truly bias free.

xxpor 5y ago

In some states (Texas I think), a concealed carry license is acceptable ID, but a student ID isn't. There is, of course, no bias in the types of people that have one but not the other.

_-david-_ 5y ago
A CCL requires a background check. A student ID does not.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- jlokier 5y ago
  There is, of course, no bias in the types of people who are comfortable with and can easily pass a background check, and those who are not or cannot. In a free and fair election, the right to vote is not be based on your detailed personal history, or whether you have done something that looks off and might cause you trouble with authorities. Even if it's just fear of imagined trouble that puts people off feeling safe to obtain the necessary approvals to vote, that's enough to prevent a free and fair election.
  - _-david-_ 5y ago
    I am not suggesting you should need a background check to vote. All I am saying is we have a good idea that the person with a CCL is that person and they are not a felon (in some states felons cannot vote). Anybody can go to a community college including a noncitizen. There is no background check and no real verification the person is who they say they are. You just show up and have your picture taken. If you are going to trust one of these forms of IDs it is clear that it should be the CCL.
    - xxpor 5y ago
      Non-citizens can get CCLs too.
      - djsbs 5y ago
        Only if they’re legal US persons. Ie they have a green card. Undocumented, student visas, etc are banned from buying guns
      - _-david-_ 5y ago
        I did not mean to imply a noncitizen could not get a CCL. What I meant is we know the person is who they say they are when they have a CCL. This means if a noncitizen has a CCL they would be unable to use this as proof they are a citizen. If a noncitizen goes to a university they could claim they are somebody other than who they are and could use the fake ID as proof to vote. Since there are no background checks to get a university ID it isn't really proof of anything.
        ModernMech 5y ago
        Even if you feel the verification that goes into a student ID is not strict enough, that could have been remedied in the very bill that was just signed into law. Why didn’t they, I wonder? But I think student IDs do undergo a pretty significant verification. They are going to at least need transcripts and some other ID card like a driver’s license to prove your id. They do background checks as a matter of course for funding. Community colleges do verify residency to determine which tuition rate you pay. 99% of the students most community colleges are state residents anyway. They could have just made a requirement that state funded schools must display residency information and an expiration date in the card, and there would be no problem.
        _-david-_ 5y ago
        My university did no checks on address or anything like that. I went to a private university so that could be why. It is possible that public colleges do more verification. Honestly I think the best solution is to just give a free ID to everyone. As far as I know every state that requires an ID for voting has free IDs. We should make it easier and more convenient instead of allowing a bunch of alternative forms of ID. Driver's license, voter ID license, generic state ID or federal ID (passport) should be sufficient.
  - staysafeanon 5y ago
    >There is, of course, no bias in the types of people who are comfortable with and can easily pass a background check, and those who are not or cannot. You're correct, there's no bias on the system for background checks. Anyone of any race, color, or creed can get a background check to verify their eligibility to exercise their right to own/carry firearms and vote.
WillPostForFood 5y ago
And no difference in the level of verification to get the ID. You need a state issued ID, and federal background check, and full fingerprints to get a Student ID, right? In terms of rigor of identity authentication: CHL > Driver's license.
- ModernMech 5y ago
  There is a lot of verification that goes into a student ID. Even at the community college level they are going to at least verify your residency to make sure you are paying the correct tuition rate. My local CC even differentiates this on their IDs. But at the state level you will need much more. We are talking 12 years of transcripts and a high school diploma. Vaccination records going back to birth. Income information (paystubs, bank accounts) on you and your family so they can verify your ability to pay tuition or qualify for aid. In order to qualify you’ll need to undergo background checks (felons are not eligible for aid). Then you need letter of reference from at least 3 individuals and your HS guidance counselor. Finally, you will need official SAT test scores, and the college board does their own process of identity verification. Is the process perfect? No. But if you were looking for a vector for fraud, student IDs are probably one of the most onerous.
mgarfias 5y ago
Try giving your Texas CCW to the TSA to board a plane. They’ll take a Costco card with a shitty pic, but not the CHL
staysafeanon 5y ago
>There is, of course, no bias in the types of people that have one but not the other. I agree, and it's in Texas' state law: any legal resident regardless of race, color, or creed can apply for a concealed carry license. It's truly bias free.