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Your link is press-release like article. It cites a self-reporting based survey published by the Bitcoin Mining Council, a "voluntary global forum of Bitcoin mi

Your link is press-release like article. It cites a self-reporting based survey published by the Bitcoin Mining Council, a "voluntary global forum of Bitcoin mining companies and other companies in the Bitcoin industry", that goes so far as to claim Bitcoin is "one of the most sustainable industries globally". This hardly seems like an objective, reputable source whose claims should be accepted at face value.

fleddr 5y ago
The very point of that council, which is brand new, is to give transparency and insight into the energy mix used to mine Bitcoin. You should never take any claim at face value, but it's quite lazy to dismiss their data without backing it up.
- LurkingPenguin 5y ago
  > The very point of that council, which is brand new, is to give transparency and insight into the energy mix used to mine Bitcoin. No, it isn't. Per the website: > The mandate of the Bitcoin Mining Council is to promote transparency, share best practices, and educate the public on the benefits of Bitcoin and Bitcoin mining. So group that says it exists to promote Bitcoin mining and educate the public on the supposed benefits of Bitcoin mining publishes a study claiming that Bitcoin mining is super sustainable at a time when one of the biggest criticisms of Bitcoin is its energy use. Shocking! > You should never take any claim at face value, but it's quite lazy to dismiss their data without backing it up. It's the other way around. Groups making claims are responsible for backing them up, and there's arguably a higher standard for special interest groups who are conflicted and make claims that just happen to support their interests. Claims like Bitcoin is "one of the most sustainable industries globally" and "the network remains as strong as ever, it simply shrugs off adversity and moves forward". Based on the press release and YouTube slides, this survey relied on self-reported data from parties who volunteered to answer 3 questions, with no independent verification that any of them responded accurately or truthfully. The responses (supposedly) cover (only) "32 percent of the current global Bitcoin network".
  - fleddr 5y ago
    You already made up your mind and reason from bad faith. You can't even quote them correctly. The group doesn't exist to promote Bitcoin mining as if to encourage more companies to start mining. The group is there to explain why Bitcoin uses so much energy, encourages miners to give insights into this (which is sorely lacking, everybody is largely guessing right now) and shares best practices between miners to go for sustainable energy, and even better: stranded surplus sustainable energy, such as flaring. Nowhere do their reports say they are "super sustainable", it's you fabricating these lazy labels. Whilst mainstream media focuses on some rogue abandoned coal factory mining Bitcoin, in reality the conversion towards renewables for Bitcoin mining is moving ahead at a spectacular pace.
    - LurkingPenguin 5y ago
      The quotes are taken directly from https://bitcoinminingcouncil.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/2021.07.01-Mining-Council-Press-Release-Q2.pdf https://bitcoinminingcouncil.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/... > Based on this data it is estimated that the global mining industry’s sustainable electricity mix had grown to approximately 56 percent, during Q2 2021, making it one of the most sustainable industries globally. > “Despite China shutting down over 60 percent of the global Bitcoin network, the Bitcoin network experienced zero downtime, no bailouts, has registered no bankruptcies and simply adapted by redeploying its infrastructure into regions that have greater freedoms,” Mr. Feinstein said. “The network remains as strong as ever, it simply shrugs off adversity and moves forward.” Accusing me of "fabricating" what anyone can verify for themselves in the link on the Bitcoin Mining Council website linked to above is absurd.
      - fleddr 5y ago
        You didn't invalidate either of those two quotes with anything of substance, other than assuming they are wrong. That's bad faith reasoning. You fabricated the term "super sustainable", which is claimed nowhere. The claim instead refers to the relatively high percentage of renewables compared to several other industries, whom often score in the 10-20% renewables range only. As to whether 56% is accurate, I don't know. Yet if you don't know, you can't be confident in it being wrong. You simply don't know. The second quote isn't even a claim, it's what factually has happened. China shut down almost all Bitcoin mining overnight yet it did nothing to Bitcoin. The network self heals by means of a difficulty adjustment and miners moving elsewhere. A super power shut down the entire thing and months later the hash rate is right back where it was. That's extreme resiliency.

fleddr 5y ago

The very point of that council, which is brand new, is to give transparency and insight into the energy mix used to mine Bitcoin. You should never take any claim at face value, but it's quite lazy to dismiss their data without backing it up.

LurkingPenguin 5y ago
> The very point of that council, which is brand new, is to give transparency and insight into the energy mix used to mine Bitcoin. No, it isn't. Per the website: > The mandate of the Bitcoin Mining Council is to promote transparency, share best practices, and educate the public on the benefits of Bitcoin and Bitcoin mining. So group that says it exists to promote Bitcoin mining and educate the public on the supposed benefits of Bitcoin mining publishes a study claiming that Bitcoin mining is super sustainable at a time when one of the biggest criticisms of Bitcoin is its energy use. Shocking! > You should never take any claim at face value, but it's quite lazy to dismiss their data without backing it up. It's the other way around. Groups making claims are responsible for backing them up, and there's arguably a higher standard for special interest groups who are conflicted and make claims that just happen to support their interests. Claims like Bitcoin is "one of the most sustainable industries globally" and "the network remains as strong as ever, it simply shrugs off adversity and moves forward". Based on the press release and YouTube slides, this survey relied on self-reported data from parties who volunteered to answer 3 questions, with no independent verification that any of them responded accurately or truthfully. The responses (supposedly) cover (only) "32 percent of the current global Bitcoin network".
- fleddr 5y ago
  You already made up your mind and reason from bad faith. You can't even quote them correctly. The group doesn't exist to promote Bitcoin mining as if to encourage more companies to start mining. The group is there to explain why Bitcoin uses so much energy, encourages miners to give insights into this (which is sorely lacking, everybody is largely guessing right now) and shares best practices between miners to go for sustainable energy, and even better: stranded surplus sustainable energy, such as flaring. Nowhere do their reports say they are "super sustainable", it's you fabricating these lazy labels. Whilst mainstream media focuses on some rogue abandoned coal factory mining Bitcoin, in reality the conversion towards renewables for Bitcoin mining is moving ahead at a spectacular pace.
  - LurkingPenguin 5y ago
    The quotes are taken directly from https://bitcoinminingcouncil.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/2021.07.01-Mining-Council-Press-Release-Q2.pdf https://bitcoinminingcouncil.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/... > Based on this data it is estimated that the global mining industry’s sustainable electricity mix had grown to approximately 56 percent, during Q2 2021, making it one of the most sustainable industries globally. > “Despite China shutting down over 60 percent of the global Bitcoin network, the Bitcoin network experienced zero downtime, no bailouts, has registered no bankruptcies and simply adapted by redeploying its infrastructure into regions that have greater freedoms,” Mr. Feinstein said. “The network remains as strong as ever, it simply shrugs off adversity and moves forward.” Accusing me of "fabricating" what anyone can verify for themselves in the link on the Bitcoin Mining Council website linked to above is absurd.
    - fleddr 5y ago
      You didn't invalidate either of those two quotes with anything of substance, other than assuming they are wrong. That's bad faith reasoning. You fabricated the term "super sustainable", which is claimed nowhere. The claim instead refers to the relatively high percentage of renewables compared to several other industries, whom often score in the 10-20% renewables range only. As to whether 56% is accurate, I don't know. Yet if you don't know, you can't be confident in it being wrong. You simply don't know. The second quote isn't even a claim, it's what factually has happened. China shut down almost all Bitcoin mining overnight yet it did nothing to Bitcoin. The network self heals by means of a difficulty adjustment and miners moving elsewhere. A super power shut down the entire thing and months later the hash rate is right back where it was. That's extreme resiliency.