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>and we both were dumbstruck about iphone prices. We agree it's good hardware/products but the price is insane. I'm honestly dumbstruck that people like you ar

by xoa 5y ago

>and we both were dumbstruck about iphone prices. We agree it's good hardware/products but the price is insane. I'm honestly dumbstruck that people like you are dumbstruck. It's not very hard, and whether you your self use powerful handheld computers/cameras much it's objectively obvious others do a lot. Just do the normal ROI calc. Apple makes a feature for this called "ScreenTime". How many hours a day is the average iPhone user on their phone? A quick google search indicates over two hours. So that's over 700 hours per year, with a life time of at least two years on average. Do the math. What is so shocking about spending <$1/hour on something so heavily used and important? What price privacy/security focus and long term upgrades? Subtract too the resale value. What is surprising here?

johnchristopher 5y ago
> Do the math. What is so shocking about spending <$1/hour on something so heavily used and important? What price privacy/security focus and long term upgrades? Subtract too the resale value. What is surprising here? What's surprising is that for the vast majority the same can be done for <20ç/hour.
- EveYoung 5y ago
  Yes, but researching these alternatives takes time and energy. Personally, I rather spent a £1-2k more on my tech gadgets per year than leaving the Apple ecosystem, which works well for me.
  - johnchristopher 5y ago
    Yes, I am also all for paying a bit more if it comes with the guarantee that it's less problem/questioning/time wasted researching or supporting the thing down the line.
- marcellus23 5y ago
  Not really, unless you look at these devices like someone who thinks all cars are equal because they're all capable of taking you from A to B. If you're spending that much time with a device, you would probably prefer the experience to be _nice_, not shoddy.
  - johnchristopher 5y ago
    I am someone who has owned iphones before and still think they are overpriced for what they are. To be fair, the reality distortion field rarely works on me.
wpietri 5y ago
I will grant that a small fraction of iPhone owners do a careful analysis similar to yours. And good for them. But just look at Apple ads to see what their real market is. Their ads don't argue that they're a good value. Apple established themselves as a luxury good that indicates wealth and social status. Their ads look like other ads for wealthy people. The reason Apple doesn't make a cheap phone is the same reason Porche doesn't make a cheap car. They could, but it would drop total profit as the luxury premium evaporates. The funny thing is, I've heard people make the exact same argument people are making here but for Louis Vuitton bags. It's something they use every day! They're so well made that they last a long time! They have great resale value! And all of those things are true, but people who spend $100 on a purse are still going to give side-eye to people who spend $1000 or $10,000, and I think that's fine. In my view status goods are a plague upon humanity.
- riversflow 5y ago
  >In my view status goods are a plague upon humanity. Why? I'd argue that status goods have driven technological and artistic progress throughout time. So many innovations were the result of someone trying to make a new higher status good, or trying to make a status good cheaper(so they could have more wealth/power). Living in the 21st century, almost every good you can buy would have been a status good to someone at a time in the past.
  - wpietri 5y ago
    Violence and war have also driven technological and artistic progress. I don't think that makes them good. I also think you're confusing "did contribute to the creation of" and "was the only possibly way we could get". E.g., it's true that early cellphones were status goods. But given the massive market for them today, it's clear that was not a necessary step toward their existence and perfection.

by xoa 5y ago

johnchristopher 5y ago

> Do the math. What is so shocking about spending <$1/hour on something so heavily used and important? What price privacy/security focus and long term upgrades? Subtract too the resale value. What is surprising here? What's surprising is that for the vast majority the same can be done for <20ç/hour.

EveYoung 5y ago
Yes, but researching these alternatives takes time and energy. Personally, I rather spent a £1-2k more on my tech gadgets per year than leaving the Apple ecosystem, which works well for me.
- johnchristopher 5y ago
  Yes, I am also all for paying a bit more if it comes with the guarantee that it's less problem/questioning/time wasted researching or supporting the thing down the line.
marcellus23 5y ago
Not really, unless you look at these devices like someone who thinks all cars are equal because they're all capable of taking you from A to B. If you're spending that much time with a device, you would probably prefer the experience to be _nice_, not shoddy.
- johnchristopher 5y ago
  I am someone who has owned iphones before and still think they are overpriced for what they are. To be fair, the reality distortion field rarely works on me.

wpietri 5y ago

I will grant that a small fraction of iPhone owners do a careful analysis similar to yours. And good for them. But just look at Apple ads to see what their real market is. Their ads don't argue that they're a good value. Apple established themselves as a luxury good that indicates wealth and social status. Their ads look like other ads for wealthy people. The reason Apple doesn't make a cheap phone is the same reason Porche doesn't make a cheap car. They could, but it would drop total profit as the luxury premium evaporates. The funny thing is, I've heard people make the exact same argument people are making here but for Louis Vuitton bags. It's something they use every day! They're so well made that they last a long time! They have great resale value! And all of those things are true, but people who spend $100 on a purse are still going to give side-eye to people who spend $1000 or $10,000, and I think that's fine. In my view status goods are a plague upon humanity.

riversflow 5y ago
>In my view status goods are a plague upon humanity. Why? I'd argue that status goods have driven technological and artistic progress throughout time. So many innovations were the result of someone trying to make a new higher status good, or trying to make a status good cheaper(so they could have more wealth/power). Living in the 21st century, almost every good you can buy would have been a status good to someone at a time in the past.
- wpietri 5y ago
  Violence and war have also driven technological and artistic progress. I don't think that makes them good. I also think you're confusing "did contribute to the creation of" and "was the only possibly way we could get". E.g., it's true that early cellphones were status goods. But given the massive market for them today, it's clear that was not a necessary step toward their existence and perfection.