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I'd be more worried about the actual wage slavery [1] inflicted by the billionaire in question. The government as the arm of the people putting an end to this

I'd be more worried about the actual wage slavery [1] inflicted by the billionaire in question. The government as the arm of the people putting an end to this is a good thing. Why would people want to overthrow their government because it put an end to exploitation? [1] https://fortune.com/2019/04/12/china-996-jack-ma/ https://fortune.com/2019/04/12/china-996-jack-ma/

mherrmann 5y ago
> Why would people want to overthrow their government because it put an end to exploitation? Maybe because disappearing people does not exactly make you feel safe in a country? Maybe because there should be a check on the power that does such things?
- malermeister 5y ago
  The check is "don't be a billionaire that's built his wealth on exploiting others and brags about it". I feel pretty safe with that in place. Plus, it's not like the US doesn't disappear people [1], they just wouldn't dare do it to an oligarch. [1] https://www.npr.org/2020/07/17/892277592/federal-officers-use-unmarked-vehicles-to-grab-protesters-in-portland https://www.npr.org/2020/07/17/892277592/federal-officers-us...
  - mherrmann 5y ago
    > The check is don't be a billionaire Tell that to the millions of Uyghurs.
    - malermeister 5y ago
      [citation needed] And no, Adrian Zenz, a religious extremist who claimed he is "led by god" on a "mission" against communist China, does not count as a trustworthy source.
      - mherrmann 5y ago
        Citation: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-22278037 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-22278037
      - schleck8 5y ago
        Here you go, includes people who have gone missing. The full report is over a hundred pages long, published a few months ago. Contains a section about torture and medical experiments in camps. All first-hand testimonies and research by Amnesty. https://xinjiang.amnesty.org/ https://xinjiang.amnesty.org/
      - jacquesm 5y ago
        I'd pick a different hill to die on.
bennysomething 5y ago
Do you really believe this is about the CCP helping chinese people!? Its about it publicly destroying any threats to its total authority. Jack Ma was being punished for critising the goverment. The west may not be perfect but it has rule of law and due process that at least makes an attempt to protect its citizens from arbitary arrest. Do you think that a one party state that locks up ethnic minorities, tortures them, uses them for slave labour is somehow superior to democracy, free press, rule of law and property rights?
- cute_boi 5y ago
  Helping Chinese people usually means helping CCP right?. CCP is not just cracking down on Jack Ma. I would you have believed you if CCP was not cracking on online gaming, celebrities, private tutoring, gig economies and hundred others. CCP has done many nefarious thing but I still think the crackdowns are generally net positive. Regarding why they ban private tutoring I think many people are not giving birth in China because it takes lot of money to raise children and private tutoring is supposed to be one reason. First of all people should know that CCP already realize they are mostly alone in this world so they need to gear up their technology, become more independent, increase domestic consumption, drive innovations etc.. Playing games / Celebrities, Gig Economy, 996 is not helpful to achieve CCP long term goals.In democracy politicians mostly have only short terms goals so that they can appease the mass. But in China CCP is eternal and it doesn't need to appease the mass. Also if west want to crackdown on certain person it can bring its own reason as we can see with Julian Assange case. "Do you think that a one party state that locks up ethnic minorities, tortures them, uses them for slave labour is somehow superior to democracy, free press, rule of law and property rights?" Yea I think that is really bad part of CCP. But AFAIK since 2019 they have relaxed their rules in ethnic minorities[1] [1]: https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-lifestyle-china-health-travel-7a6967f335f97ca868cc618ea84b98b9 https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-lifestyle-ch...
  - atatatat 5y ago
    Stab in the dark — you're in Asia?
MaxDPS 5y ago
Not sure why that is relevant. That’s not the reason he was disappeared was it?

mherrmann 5y ago

> Why would people want to overthrow their government because it put an end to exploitation? Maybe because disappearing people does not exactly make you feel safe in a country? Maybe because there should be a check on the power that does such things?

malermeister 5y ago
The check is "don't be a billionaire that's built his wealth on exploiting others and brags about it". I feel pretty safe with that in place. Plus, it's not like the US doesn't disappear people [1], they just wouldn't dare do it to an oligarch. [1] https://www.npr.org/2020/07/17/892277592/federal-officers-use-unmarked-vehicles-to-grab-protesters-in-portland https://www.npr.org/2020/07/17/892277592/federal-officers-us...
- mherrmann 5y ago
  > The check is don't be a billionaire Tell that to the millions of Uyghurs.
  - malermeister 5y ago
    [citation needed] And no, Adrian Zenz, a religious extremist who claimed he is "led by god" on a "mission" against communist China, does not count as a trustworthy source.
    - mherrmann 5y ago
      Citation: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-22278037 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-22278037
    - schleck8 5y ago
      Here you go, includes people who have gone missing. The full report is over a hundred pages long, published a few months ago. Contains a section about torture and medical experiments in camps. All first-hand testimonies and research by Amnesty. https://xinjiang.amnesty.org/ https://xinjiang.amnesty.org/
    - jacquesm 5y ago
      I'd pick a different hill to die on.

bennysomething 5y ago

Do you really believe this is about the CCP helping chinese people!? Its about it publicly destroying any threats to its total authority. Jack Ma was being punished for critising the goverment. The west may not be perfect but it has rule of law and due process that at least makes an attempt to protect its citizens from arbitary arrest. Do you think that a one party state that locks up ethnic minorities, tortures them, uses them for slave labour is somehow superior to democracy, free press, rule of law and property rights?

cute_boi 5y ago
Helping Chinese people usually means helping CCP right?. CCP is not just cracking down on Jack Ma. I would you have believed you if CCP was not cracking on online gaming, celebrities, private tutoring, gig economies and hundred others. CCP has done many nefarious thing but I still think the crackdowns are generally net positive. Regarding why they ban private tutoring I think many people are not giving birth in China because it takes lot of money to raise children and private tutoring is supposed to be one reason. First of all people should know that CCP already realize they are mostly alone in this world so they need to gear up their technology, become more independent, increase domestic consumption, drive innovations etc.. Playing games / Celebrities, Gig Economy, 996 is not helpful to achieve CCP long term goals.In democracy politicians mostly have only short terms goals so that they can appease the mass. But in China CCP is eternal and it doesn't need to appease the mass. Also if west want to crackdown on certain person it can bring its own reason as we can see with Julian Assange case. "Do you think that a one party state that locks up ethnic minorities, tortures them, uses them for slave labour is somehow superior to democracy, free press, rule of law and property rights?" Yea I think that is really bad part of CCP. But AFAIK since 2019 they have relaxed their rules in ethnic minorities[1] [1]: https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-lifestyle-china-health-travel-7a6967f335f97ca868cc618ea84b98b9 https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-lifestyle-ch...
- atatatat 5y ago
  Stab in the dark — you're in Asia?

MaxDPS 5y ago

Not sure why that is relevant. That’s not the reason he was disappeared was it?