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Are you trying to imply that these other countries have those things you listed because they have no billionaires? There's millions of reasons why that isn't h

by robswc 5y ago

Are you trying to imply that these other countries have those things you listed because they have no billionaires? There's millions of reasons why that isn't happening in the US. Billionaires are almost certainly not one of those reasons. The US subsidizes so much for other countries. Without the US, these other countries wouldn't be able to have the same success. Just look at the numbers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_research_and_development_spending https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_research_... As an aside, I think the biggest irony is commenting this on HN. I know tons of SDEs that come from other countries because they get paid fractions of the salary they would get here.

micromacrofoot 5y ago
The concentration of the majority of wealth to a smaller number of people is definitely a factor, it's the hallmark of a corrupt system... > I know tons of SDEs that come from other countries because they get paid fractions of the salary they would get here. This is not irony, and has nothing to do with billionaires. Most SDEs won't even be millionaires.
- robswc 5y ago
  >The concentration of the majority of wealth to a smaller number of people is definitely a factor, it's the hallmark of a corrupt system... How? >This is not irony We're on a developer news site, talking about the US not having this or that, while also ignoring the fact that the US is very sought after by developers.
  - micromacrofoot 5y ago
    on inequality and corruption: https://www.hks.harvard.edu/publications/inequality-and-corruption https://www.hks.harvard.edu/publications/inequality-and-corr...... Also, it's not irony because it's not even a related subject. People are complaining about billionaires... 99.9999% SDEs are not coming to this country and becoming billionaires. Saying "we're ones to talk" or some kind of equivilant is an irrelevant attempt to lump any sort of wealth with being a billionaire... which is a fairly old-fashioned method to distract by creating lower-class infighting about what "wealthy" means. For an SDE making a very healthy $200k a year... it would take five thousand years to reach $1 billion. It's like arguing that the 2nd amendment should allow the private ownership of nuclear warheads. It's a strawman well outside the scale of the actual discussion.
nebula8804 5y ago
Other countries have billionaries and still manage to get these things done so no I don't think it is only just billionaires. OP's talking points seem to ignore this fundamental truth so thats why I was asking him to clarify. >The US subsidizes so much for other countries. Without the US, these other countries wouldn't be able to have the same success. This chart provides a false picture of R&D spending as European countries do in fact provide a lot of R&D to the global economy in ways that benefit regular people. How is the R&D broken down? I bet the US has a lot of R&D devoted to defense which I woudn't consider in the same category as other types of R&D spending. But regardless of this fact are you implying that since the US subsidizes so much for the other countries that Americans deserve to live in this second rate system where everyone is on their own? >As an aside, I think the biggest irony is commenting this on HN. I know tons of SDEs that come from other countries because they get paid fractions of the salary they would get here. I hear this trope trotted out so many times and in two tangental ways. First point that is always made is we should be happy that US employees makes so much more salary. What you fail to understand is that Europeans are coming from an environment where they had good schooling, probably no debt from University and made it to adulthood without any health issues thanks to good healthcare and good healthy food policies. All of this is a nonzero cost that allows Europeans to jump into the US system with a leg up from many of their American counterparts who may not have had those luxuries. Look at the typical middle class American household and you'll see all these hidden costs that reduce the chances of them achieving the success that the immigrants came into the country with. Furthermore Europeans ALWAYS have an exit strategy to go back to a system that has all these fundamentals. The US employee may be paid better but they grew up and live in an environment where everybody else is sinking due to the lack of these fundamental systems. Just look at how San Francisco is turning out with its failures. Sure tech is booming but everyone else is sinking. Americans were born into this and for the most part are stuck in this system for life. Secondly on a tangental point, Europeans love to talk about how Americans have access to a billion options for snacks and food. What they fail understand is that if you have grown up in this environment of corn laden garbage it is a prison that is difficult to escape. It is easy for Europeans to be in awe coming from an upbringing of whole nutritious foods. Its another thing to realize how much more expensive it is to eat healthy in the US vs Europe thanks to policies that were in place before even I was born (88).

by robswc 5y ago

micromacrofoot 5y ago

The concentration of the majority of wealth to a smaller number of people is definitely a factor, it's the hallmark of a corrupt system... > I know tons of SDEs that come from other countries because they get paid fractions of the salary they would get here. This is not irony, and has nothing to do with billionaires. Most SDEs won't even be millionaires.

robswc 5y ago
>The concentration of the majority of wealth to a smaller number of people is definitely a factor, it's the hallmark of a corrupt system... How? >This is not irony We're on a developer news site, talking about the US not having this or that, while also ignoring the fact that the US is very sought after by developers.
- micromacrofoot 5y ago
  on inequality and corruption: https://www.hks.harvard.edu/publications/inequality-and-corruption https://www.hks.harvard.edu/publications/inequality-and-corr...... Also, it's not irony because it's not even a related subject. People are complaining about billionaires... 99.9999% SDEs are not coming to this country and becoming billionaires. Saying "we're ones to talk" or some kind of equivilant is an irrelevant attempt to lump any sort of wealth with being a billionaire... which is a fairly old-fashioned method to distract by creating lower-class infighting about what "wealthy" means. For an SDE making a very healthy $200k a year... it would take five thousand years to reach $1 billion. It's like arguing that the 2nd amendment should allow the private ownership of nuclear warheads. It's a strawman well outside the scale of the actual discussion.

nebula8804 5y ago

Other countries have billionaries and still manage to get these things done so no I don't think it is only just billionaires. OP's talking points seem to ignore this fundamental truth so thats why I was asking him to clarify. >The US subsidizes so much for other countries. Without the US, these other countries wouldn't be able to have the same success. This chart provides a false picture of R&D spending as European countries do in fact provide a lot of R&D to the global economy in ways that benefit regular people. How is the R&D broken down? I bet the US has a lot of R&D devoted to defense which I woudn't consider in the same category as other types of R&D spending. But regardless of this fact are you implying that since the US subsidizes so much for the other countries that Americans deserve to live in this second rate system where everyone is on their own? >As an aside, I think the biggest irony is commenting this on HN. I know tons of SDEs that come from other countries because they get paid fractions of the salary they would get here. I hear this trope trotted out so many times and in two tangental ways. First point that is always made is we should be happy that US employees makes so much more salary. What you fail to understand is that Europeans are coming from an environment where they had good schooling, probably no debt from University and made it to adulthood without any health issues thanks to good healthcare and good healthy food policies. All of this is a nonzero cost that allows Europeans to jump into the US system with a leg up from many of their American counterparts who may not have had those luxuries. Look at the typical middle class American household and you'll see all these hidden costs that reduce the chances of them achieving the success that the immigrants came into the country with. Furthermore Europeans ALWAYS have an exit strategy to go back to a system that has all these fundamentals. The US employee may be paid better but they grew up and live in an environment where everybody else is sinking due to the lack of these fundamental systems. Just look at how San Francisco is turning out with its failures. Sure tech is booming but everyone else is sinking. Americans were born into this and for the most part are stuck in this system for life. Secondly on a tangental point, Europeans love to talk about how Americans have access to a billion options for snacks and food. What they fail understand is that if you have grown up in this environment of corn laden garbage it is a prison that is difficult to escape. It is easy for Europeans to be in awe coming from an upbringing of whole nutritious foods. Its another thing to realize how much more expensive it is to eat healthy in the US vs Europe thanks to policies that were in place before even I was born (88).