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The grocery stores I visit do the same in the Netherlands, maybe even worse, especially the biggest one here, Albert Hein (Ahold), is very skilled at it. They c

by toshk 5y ago

The grocery stores I visit do the same in the Netherlands, maybe even worse, especially the biggest one here, Albert Hein (Ahold), is very skilled at it. They copy the most popular products, sell them slightly cheaper, similar designs as the most popular brand, then go on and display their products at eye height and move the big brands down. Yet every court case against them they've won. And the sentiment is far less negative about them than Amazon. They have a similar significant market share (35% of grocery market) as Amazon here. Maybe in the end, it's slightly more ethical since their strategy is mostly at the cost of the big corporates (Unilever) who can handle and fight them and not the smaller companies; and arguably, the consumer wins in the end.

TonyTrapp 5y ago
Many "white-label" groceries are in fact produced in the exact same factories as the branded ones (and the factories are owned by those brands), often just with slightly changed recipes or cheaper ingredients. It's not simply blatant unauthorized copies of more expensive groceries.
dazc 5y ago
Not defending amazon but the same happens in the UK and has done for at least the past ten years. There is a German chain, Aldi, who's entire business is built around selling knock-off brands and then boasting their products are so much cheaper than the actual branded products sold elsewhere. The closest comparison to the amazon issue would be Tesco who have a range of budget products that look very similar to the branded alternative.
- Closi 5y ago
  Aldi absolutely doesn't do this IMO - they have own-brands that they have developed with 'knock off' branding, however almost all of their products are own-brand from the start, rather than working with the 'brand' first to work out it's sales and supplier and then cutting them out. Aldi's questionable ethics are on the branding-similarity side, rather than the Amazon approach of using marketplace data to cut-out middlemen distributors. I'm not saying if their approach is right and wrong, but it's a different and distinct issue.
  - dazc 5y ago
    Yes, it is a slightly different issue, I accept, although the brands copied by supermarkets often have the advantage of also being the manufacture.
  - OldHand2018 5y ago
    Aldi also relies on the "white-label" supplier approaching them to develop a product. https://corporate.aldi.us/en/suppliers/become-a-supplier/ https://corporate.aldi.us/en/suppliers/become-a-supplier/ Working with want-to-be suppliers is a full-time job for a large division of their company (my brother does it).
- fencepost 5y ago
  One notable element from the article is that Amazon.in was intentionally going to the same manufacturers and plants being used by the 'top' brands they were cloning so they could bring to market products with the exact same dimensions manufactured in the same plants presumably by the same people. "It's just like $BRAND!" well yeah....
  - belval 5y ago
    I might be old fashioned, but if your contribution to a product is so little that you just take it from a factory in China, stamp your company's name and hand it to an Amazon warehouse, giving yourself a healthy cut in the process, then I really don't mind if Amazon steps in and pass a portion of those savings to me.
    - tweedledee 5y ago
      It gets even better when the Chinese have their own online stores so you can then bypass Amazon as well.
      - belval 5y ago
        Yes! I tinker a lot (3D printing, home automation, drones, etc...) and AliExpress is such an amazing place to buy components for 10% of the price I'd see in hobby shops or Amazon.
        judge2020 5y ago
        Shipping is often 1-2 months out, though, and you often don't get refunds without a return shipping cost (as in, FBA has free returns). It's useful to think that the cost of shipping is built into the price on Amazon.com and not on AliExpress.
        belval 5y ago
        True but even then for $2 shipped I get an ESP8266. On top of that most sellers are really accommodating if the package is lost and will send you another (sure that means in total it takes 5 months for the chip to get to you).
- lbriner 5y ago
  It would be an interesting court case for sure. Aldi don't pretend that their brands are the famous brands and they don't stock the expensive ones so making cornflakes look a little like "Kellogs Cornflakes" is probably more about customers spotting them on the shelves than trying to get customers to buy yours instead. If Kellogs claimed trademark infringement, it would be hard for them to prove that they are losing out since Aldi would simply say that they don't sell Kellogs and people aren't in any way being tricked into thinking any of the Aldi brands are real ones. caveat: I'm no lawyer!
  - judge2020 5y ago
    > is probably more about customers spotting them on the shelves than trying to get customers to buy yours instead. That's the same thing. They don't put Aldi brand cornflakes on the shelf just to be eye candy.
  - dazc 5y ago
    Maybe the millions Kellogg's spend on branding could be an argument?
consp 5y ago
Aren't all those products whitelabel and don't all big supermarkets do this nowadays? I'm pretty sure all similarly packaged products from almost all grocery stores' own brands are exactly the same in all grocery stores despite the labeling being different. They all do look like the top-brand ones though.
- chuckee 5y ago
  > don't all big supermarkets do this nowadays? That makes the problem worse, not better.
- ZetaZero 5y ago
  But how is this different from Amazon?
  - ashtonkem 5y ago
    Most of the products they’re white labeling aren’t new per se. It doesn’t take a genius to white label juice, soap, or butter. While Amazon is copying everything, including novel products.
  - ectopod 5y ago
    The supermarket is using its own sales data. Amazon is snooping on the sales data of third parties using their platform.
    - colejohnson66 5y ago
      The vendors in stores provide that sales data just like with Amazon’s vendors. The store and Amazon have sales data on everything.
      - ectopod 5y ago
        In a store there is only one vendor: the store. For third party sales Amazon insists that they are not the vendor. It's not the same thing.

by toshk 5y ago

TonyTrapp 5y ago

Many "white-label" groceries are in fact produced in the exact same factories as the branded ones (and the factories are owned by those brands), often just with slightly changed recipes or cheaper ingredients. It's not simply blatant unauthorized copies of more expensive groceries.

dazc 5y ago

Not defending amazon but the same happens in the UK and has done for at least the past ten years. There is a German chain, Aldi, who's entire business is built around selling knock-off brands and then boasting their products are so much cheaper than the actual branded products sold elsewhere. The closest comparison to the amazon issue would be Tesco who have a range of budget products that look very similar to the branded alternative.

Closi 5y ago
Aldi absolutely doesn't do this IMO - they have own-brands that they have developed with 'knock off' branding, however almost all of their products are own-brand from the start, rather than working with the 'brand' first to work out it's sales and supplier and then cutting them out. Aldi's questionable ethics are on the branding-similarity side, rather than the Amazon approach of using marketplace data to cut-out middlemen distributors. I'm not saying if their approach is right and wrong, but it's a different and distinct issue.
- dazc 5y ago
  Yes, it is a slightly different issue, I accept, although the brands copied by supermarkets often have the advantage of also being the manufacture.
- OldHand2018 5y ago
  Aldi also relies on the "white-label" supplier approaching them to develop a product. https://corporate.aldi.us/en/suppliers/become-a-supplier/ https://corporate.aldi.us/en/suppliers/become-a-supplier/ Working with want-to-be suppliers is a full-time job for a large division of their company (my brother does it).
fencepost 5y ago
One notable element from the article is that Amazon.in was intentionally going to the same manufacturers and plants being used by the 'top' brands they were cloning so they could bring to market products with the exact same dimensions manufactured in the same plants presumably by the same people. "It's just like $BRAND!" well yeah....
- belval 5y ago
  I might be old fashioned, but if your contribution to a product is so little that you just take it from a factory in China, stamp your company's name and hand it to an Amazon warehouse, giving yourself a healthy cut in the process, then I really don't mind if Amazon steps in and pass a portion of those savings to me.
  - tweedledee 5y ago
    It gets even better when the Chinese have their own online stores so you can then bypass Amazon as well.
    - belval 5y ago
      Yes! I tinker a lot (3D printing, home automation, drones, etc...) and AliExpress is such an amazing place to buy components for 10% of the price I'd see in hobby shops or Amazon.
      - judge2020 5y ago
        Shipping is often 1-2 months out, though, and you often don't get refunds without a return shipping cost (as in, FBA has free returns). It's useful to think that the cost of shipping is built into the price on Amazon.com and not on AliExpress.
        belval 5y ago
        True but even then for $2 shipped I get an ESP8266. On top of that most sellers are really accommodating if the package is lost and will send you another (sure that means in total it takes 5 months for the chip to get to you).
lbriner 5y ago
It would be an interesting court case for sure. Aldi don't pretend that their brands are the famous brands and they don't stock the expensive ones so making cornflakes look a little like "Kellogs Cornflakes" is probably more about customers spotting them on the shelves than trying to get customers to buy yours instead. If Kellogs claimed trademark infringement, it would be hard for them to prove that they are losing out since Aldi would simply say that they don't sell Kellogs and people aren't in any way being tricked into thinking any of the Aldi brands are real ones. caveat: I'm no lawyer!
- judge2020 5y ago
  > is probably more about customers spotting them on the shelves than trying to get customers to buy yours instead. That's the same thing. They don't put Aldi brand cornflakes on the shelf just to be eye candy.
- dazc 5y ago
  Maybe the millions Kellogg's spend on branding could be an argument?

consp 5y ago

Aren't all those products whitelabel and don't all big supermarkets do this nowadays? I'm pretty sure all similarly packaged products from almost all grocery stores' own brands are exactly the same in all grocery stores despite the labeling being different. They all do look like the top-brand ones though.

chuckee 5y ago
> don't all big supermarkets do this nowadays? That makes the problem worse, not better.
ZetaZero 5y ago
But how is this different from Amazon?
- ashtonkem 5y ago
  Most of the products they’re white labeling aren’t new per se. It doesn’t take a genius to white label juice, soap, or butter. While Amazon is copying everything, including novel products.
- ectopod 5y ago
  The supermarket is using its own sales data. Amazon is snooping on the sales data of third parties using their platform.
  - colejohnson66 5y ago
    The vendors in stores provide that sales data just like with Amazon’s vendors. The store and Amazon have sales data on everything.
    - ectopod 5y ago
      In a store there is only one vendor: the store. For third party sales Amazon insists that they are not the vendor. It's not the same thing.