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The elderly drive into town to go to the grocery store. Yes, back in the day everyone grew all the things they needed on their land. I wish this were still th

The elderly drive into town to go to the grocery store. Yes, back in the day everyone grew all the things they needed on their land. I wish this were still the case but with the common availability of stores people have grown accustom to driving to the store to stock up on food. For the elderly and physically disabled that have internet they could shop online if they knew this was a thing and have food delivered to them via someone elses truck. This is by no means an edge case. This is the normal life for 20% of people in the United States. Even in places that don't get cold, elderly are not going to be walking to the grocery store. I don't think we are going to dial back this reality short of a world-war that decimates society everywhere and/or some event that sends us back to the stone age. I should add that even if we all agreed to turn back that dial and get back to self sustainability it is not something you can just turn on. This requires a few generations for this to be functional for entire families.

ajuc 5y ago
It's not that they have to grow their food, it's that they should be able to hop on a cheap bus to the nearest city. It actually makes it easier for elderly than car culture (for example my grandma doesn't drive but she can use the bus no problem). Also most places where people live have grocery stores in walking distance here. But that's just another example of "car culture vs walking culture". BTW another very common sight in countryside is old people biking or walking with a bike. That way they don't need to carry the stuff they bought. And if they get tired they can use the bike as a "walking help". This is the village where my family comes from: https://goo.gl/maps/XrzEjhMF7VUmdVVRA https://goo.gl/maps/XrzEjhMF7VUmdVVRA It's a village of under 500 people in the poorest part of the poorest region of the EU. The nearest city of about 20 000 people is 25 km away. There's 3 bus stops and 3 grocery shops in this village, as well as a primary school, public library, firestation, medical place(sorry no idea how to translate that, there's a few nurses and a doctor), post office, bank and a church. If you notice the shop has 4 bikes and 2 cars parked. That's about normal. Most customers probably walked in. If driving a car was required to live half of the (mostly elderly) population of this village would have to move to a retirement house somewhere cause they probably can't drive anymore (or at least not in big-road traffic which would be required to get to the city).
- LinuxBender 5y ago
  A bike would in theory be great for those still physically able. Maybe even an E-Bike. There is a path part of the way but it doesn't get plowed. The highway gets plowed but it isn't really safe for anyone to bike on the highway. I don't believe I have ever seen a bicycle on the highway.
  - bigwavedave 5y ago
    As far as I know, biking on the highway is quite illegal in most states. So is walking, unless it's an emergency and you're walking to the next exit to get help because your phone and car are dead. It's been a long time since I checked, but at the time there were just under a dozen states that allow cycling and five or six states that only allow it if bicycle signage is explicitly posted. But YMMV (literally ;) )
    - LinuxBender 5y ago
      I wasn't sure so I looked it up. Apparently it is legal to ride a bicycle on the interstate in my state. Bikes are treated equal to cars and must follow all the same laws. That said I've not seen anyone do it. I do see dirt motorcycles, tractors... In town there was a tractor behind me in the drive-through.
jeromegv 5y ago
Typically the elderly can walk to the store or get into a bus longer in their life than they can drive themselves to the store. Driving requires a very high amount of attention and getting older (or being too young!) are perfect examples that show that having a society optimized around car ownership is really not convenient for a lot of people.
lm28469 5y ago
> The elderly drive into town to go to the grocery store. Yes, back in the day everyone grew all the things they needed on their land. When I was a kid, and that wasn't a long time ago, we had grocery stores in every large streets, they all closed and relocated to the new commercial complex 5km outside of the city. My grandparents used to be able to literally cross the street and buy their food, now they have to rely on family member to go shopping for them.
ericmay 5y ago
> elderly are not going to be walking to the grocery store. This is by design. That's it. There's nothing stopping elderly people from walking to grocery stores except that we build in a way to make that impossible. They'd probably live longer and be healthier (as we all would be) if we walked a little more. It's very easy to test this - how do most people in the world including the elderly get their groceries? > I should add that even if we all agreed to turn back that dial I wouldn't be so quick to suggest that walking is turning back the dial anymore than stopping smoking is.
mrsuprawsm 5y ago
>Even in places that don't get cold, elderly are not going to be walking to the grocery store. I don't think we are going to dial back this reality short of a world-war that decimates society everywhere and/or some event that sends us back to the stone age. This comment is outlandish. In vast swathes of the non-American developed world (Europe, Japan, etc) walking, cycling, and public transport are perfectly normal ways of getting around that many, if not a majority, of elderly people use on a daily basis without any difficulty whatsoever. And indeed these people are widely considered to be thriving - in no small part because they remain physically active and engaged in their community, which is another convenient upside of avoiding car culture. Not exactly the stone age, as your comment mentions. Like the parent comment says, the majority of the potential negatives associated with avoiding car culture are in themselves a consequence of car culture in the first place.

ajuc 5y ago

It's not that they have to grow their food, it's that they should be able to hop on a cheap bus to the nearest city. It actually makes it easier for elderly than car culture (for example my grandma doesn't drive but she can use the bus no problem). Also most places where people live have grocery stores in walking distance here. But that's just another example of "car culture vs walking culture". BTW another very common sight in countryside is old people biking or walking with a bike. That way they don't need to carry the stuff they bought. And if they get tired they can use the bike as a "walking help". This is the village where my family comes from: https://goo.gl/maps/XrzEjhMF7VUmdVVRA https://goo.gl/maps/XrzEjhMF7VUmdVVRA It's a village of under 500 people in the poorest part of the poorest region of the EU. The nearest city of about 20 000 people is 25 km away. There's 3 bus stops and 3 grocery shops in this village, as well as a primary school, public library, firestation, medical place(sorry no idea how to translate that, there's a few nurses and a doctor), post office, bank and a church. If you notice the shop has 4 bikes and 2 cars parked. That's about normal. Most customers probably walked in. If driving a car was required to live half of the (mostly elderly) population of this village would have to move to a retirement house somewhere cause they probably can't drive anymore (or at least not in big-road traffic which would be required to get to the city).

LinuxBender 5y ago
A bike would in theory be great for those still physically able. Maybe even an E-Bike. There is a path part of the way but it doesn't get plowed. The highway gets plowed but it isn't really safe for anyone to bike on the highway. I don't believe I have ever seen a bicycle on the highway.
- bigwavedave 5y ago
  As far as I know, biking on the highway is quite illegal in most states. So is walking, unless it's an emergency and you're walking to the next exit to get help because your phone and car are dead. It's been a long time since I checked, but at the time there were just under a dozen states that allow cycling and five or six states that only allow it if bicycle signage is explicitly posted. But YMMV (literally ;) )
  - LinuxBender 5y ago
    I wasn't sure so I looked it up. Apparently it is legal to ride a bicycle on the interstate in my state. Bikes are treated equal to cars and must follow all the same laws. That said I've not seen anyone do it. I do see dirt motorcycles, tractors... In town there was a tractor behind me in the drive-through.

jeromegv 5y ago

Typically the elderly can walk to the store or get into a bus longer in their life than they can drive themselves to the store. Driving requires a very high amount of attention and getting older (or being too young!) are perfect examples that show that having a society optimized around car ownership is really not convenient for a lot of people.

lm28469 5y ago

> The elderly drive into town to go to the grocery store. Yes, back in the day everyone grew all the things they needed on their land. When I was a kid, and that wasn't a long time ago, we had grocery stores in every large streets, they all closed and relocated to the new commercial complex 5km outside of the city. My grandparents used to be able to literally cross the street and buy their food, now they have to rely on family member to go shopping for them.

ericmay 5y ago

> elderly are not going to be walking to the grocery store. This is by design. That's it. There's nothing stopping elderly people from walking to grocery stores except that we build in a way to make that impossible. They'd probably live longer and be healthier (as we all would be) if we walked a little more. It's very easy to test this - how do most people in the world including the elderly get their groceries? > I should add that even if we all agreed to turn back that dial I wouldn't be so quick to suggest that walking is turning back the dial anymore than stopping smoking is.

mrsuprawsm 5y ago

>Even in places that don't get cold, elderly are not going to be walking to the grocery store. I don't think we are going to dial back this reality short of a world-war that decimates society everywhere and/or some event that sends us back to the stone age. This comment is outlandish. In vast swathes of the non-American developed world (Europe, Japan, etc) walking, cycling, and public transport are perfectly normal ways of getting around that many, if not a majority, of elderly people use on a daily basis without any difficulty whatsoever. And indeed these people are widely considered to be thriving - in no small part because they remain physically active and engaged in their community, which is another convenient upside of avoiding car culture. Not exactly the stone age, as your comment mentions. Like the parent comment says, the majority of the potential negatives associated with avoiding car culture are in themselves a consequence of car culture in the first place.