4 ms·

I never understand this point of view. We decide what happens, collectively. We vote in governments, and we choose what products to buy. It needs to start with

I never understand this point of view. We decide what happens, collectively. We vote in governments, and we choose what products to buy. It needs to start with citizens because we're democratic. The problem is that people's public speech doesn't match their behaviour. Carbon offsets for flights have been available for years. Despite ~75% of people saying "Climate Change is the biggest threat we face" [0] only 1-3% of passengers actually choose the carbon offset [1]. In startups, we know that people lie in surveys, and we need to measure their actual behaviour in order to correctly assess their actual feelings/intentions. From this, we can conclude that most people profess a public belief in climate change, but privately don't care and aren't willing to do anything about it. Companies are taking their cue from this: virtue-signal about changing the world, but don't actually do anything. Governments are likewise taking their cue from it: lots of conferences, lots of talk, no action. We need citizens to stop driving in petrol-driven cars to marches where they protest about carbon emissions. To stop heating their homes with coal. To stop eating fish completely. To buy the carbon offsets, even if they're crap and not very effective. The mismatch between our public speech and our private behaviour is what's causing everyone else to do the same. It has to start with us, because if it doesn't it'll be ignored. This attitude of "someone else has to take the first step" is what's causing our inaction. Stop blaming others for your footprint, and do something about it yourself. [0] https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2021/09/14/climate-change-threat/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2021/09/1... [1] https://aviationbenefits.org/media/167226/fact-sheet_11_voluntary-carbon-offsetting_3.pdf https://aviationbenefits.org/media/167226/fact-sheet_11_volu...

Lutger 5y ago
Excellent reasoning, but I strongly disagree with the conclusion. The gap between action and belief is exactly why we need collective action, not individual action. There's a difference between us as a citizen, and as a consumer. The pandemic has shown perfectly that leaving everything up to 'individual freedom' will result in a mess. > Stop blaming others for your footprint Did you know the very idea of a footprint is invented by BP as a mechanism to shift responsibility and place blame on the consumer? Personally I spend a large part of my income on reducing my footprint by the way, but I have no illusions that this is where the required change will come from. In the country where I live, merely being registered as a citizen, paying taxes and everything that is legally required, will have am unsustainable footprint - before I even begin to take a breath I have consumed my share. What we need to do is hold the actors who are responsible accountable and make a mass collective change that is non-optional.
Gravityloss 5y ago
The whole point of organized anything is to have common laws for everyone. That's why there exist laws regarding waste, otherwise some people would just dump them to random places. Or why do we have referees in sports? Because the teams have agreed together that it's the best way to enforce the rules for all of them. Pushing "just personal action" for climate issues is a known delay tactic.
adrianN 5y ago
No, shifting blame and asking for individual action is a well-known tactic from the corporate propaganda playbook. Consumers have neither the necessary information, nor the necessary time to individually weigh all the different factors they care about whenever they purchase something. Very few problems are solved by demanding individual action. Leaded gasoline wasn't phased out because people started driving to boutique fuel stations that offered unleaded. Acid rain wasn't stopped because people started buying power from boutique power plants that installed sulfur filters. Our problems with the ozone hole weren't fixed because people chose not to use refrigerators. These problems are why we invented governments and central regulation. At the very least we need to internalize the cost of pollution.
licebmi__at__ 5y ago
I definitely disagree. What I don't understand, when I assume good faith, is why people disregard calls for political action as lazy or waiting for "someone else to take the first step"; while also have certain actors pouring millions on lobbying and campaigns to downplay the effects of global warming, to understate the viability of green energies and lastly, on pushing the idea of consumer responsibility.

Lutger 5y ago

Excellent reasoning, but I strongly disagree with the conclusion. The gap between action and belief is exactly why we need collective action, not individual action. There's a difference between us as a citizen, and as a consumer. The pandemic has shown perfectly that leaving everything up to 'individual freedom' will result in a mess. > Stop blaming others for your footprint Did you know the very idea of a footprint is invented by BP as a mechanism to shift responsibility and place blame on the consumer? Personally I spend a large part of my income on reducing my footprint by the way, but I have no illusions that this is where the required change will come from. In the country where I live, merely being registered as a citizen, paying taxes and everything that is legally required, will have am unsustainable footprint - before I even begin to take a breath I have consumed my share. What we need to do is hold the actors who are responsible accountable and make a mass collective change that is non-optional.

Gravityloss 5y ago

The whole point of organized anything is to have common laws for everyone. That's why there exist laws regarding waste, otherwise some people would just dump them to random places. Or why do we have referees in sports? Because the teams have agreed together that it's the best way to enforce the rules for all of them. Pushing "just personal action" for climate issues is a known delay tactic.

adrianN 5y ago

No, shifting blame and asking for individual action is a well-known tactic from the corporate propaganda playbook. Consumers have neither the necessary information, nor the necessary time to individually weigh all the different factors they care about whenever they purchase something. Very few problems are solved by demanding individual action. Leaded gasoline wasn't phased out because people started driving to boutique fuel stations that offered unleaded. Acid rain wasn't stopped because people started buying power from boutique power plants that installed sulfur filters. Our problems with the ozone hole weren't fixed because people chose not to use refrigerators. These problems are why we invented governments and central regulation. At the very least we need to internalize the cost of pollution.

licebmi__at__ 5y ago

I definitely disagree. What I don't understand, when I assume good faith, is why people disregard calls for political action as lazy or waiting for "someone else to take the first step"; while also have certain actors pouring millions on lobbying and campaigns to downplay the effects of global warming, to understate the viability of green energies and lastly, on pushing the idea of consumer responsibility.