4 ms·

Yeah I don't know how we could possibly validate that. It's similar to, but not the same as, measuring this in North Korea.

Fricken 5y ago
You are the gullible and ignorant victim of western anti-china propaganda. Many independent studies have been done. They all show very high approval ratings. Higher now, after the pandemic.
- wolverine876 5y ago
  The Chinese people who do have free speech, in Taiwan, and did, in Hong Kong, certainly don't/didn't like the CCP much. Perhaps that's why the CCP felt the need to shut down freedom in Hong Kong - too much criticism. If the CCP is so popular, why not have free speech and elections?
  - Fricken 5y ago
    Why not? I don't think China is going to change it's functional political system just to prove a point to some rando on the internet is why.
    - loyukfai 5y ago
      It's people like you, and the predictable but classless act of keeping Wikimedia off WIPO (and similar ones) that gives CCP (and "China") bad rep all over world. Many would have liked a/one more counterbalance to US hegemony. From the latest polls though, it seems people would rather the US hegemony continues/strengthens rather than seeing CCP/"China" rises further. Such intangible acts will, sooner or later, have tangible consequences.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - Fricken 5y ago
        Latest polls from who? What polls are you talking about?
  - A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago
    The answer here appears to be simple. Because elections and free speech are aspects of the system that by design introduce certain level of instability, but also a way to channel population frustration thus preventing having to resort to violence. CCP chose stability of system above all else.
    - wolverine876 5y ago
      > The answer here appears to be simple. It was a rhetorical question. The CCP doesn't allow elections and free speech because they don't want to lose power. > elections and free speech are aspects of the system that by design introduce certain level of instability That's the standard claim of dictators, including the CCP, but it's just their propaganda. Democratic governments are far more stable. Chinese democracies - Taiwan and Hong Kong - are/were very stable. Japan, South Korea, etc. When was the last time the US, UK, etc. had a stability problem? Compare that to China, North Korea, and the rest. Also, that claim looks at it only from the dictator's point of view (a natural bias): Will my power last? I might be voted out at any time! I could be criticized into irrelevancy! That would be a catastrophe for the country if my great leadership was removed! Democracies change leaders frequently and with ease; it's rule of law, not of a person (or personality). Finally, from the ordinary citizen's point of view, democracies are far more stable: Their rights are protected; they won't be arbitrarily arrested, have their assets seized, be sent to reeducation camps, etc.
- yostrovs 5y ago
  It is against the law to criticize the CCP in China. What mechanism did the pollsters and researchers use to overcome that? Moreover, as with democracy, it is more than having the right to vote. It is also the right to know what your elected representatives are up to and what the state of the nation is. So if you ask people thoroughly drowning in state enforced propaganda from an early age what they think about something, you'll usually get what the propaganda machine told them to think.
  - Fricken 5y ago
    >So if you ask people thoroughly drowning in state enforced propaganda from an early age what they think about something, you'll usually get what the propaganda machine told them to think. You have the option to stick with what the propaganda machine told to you to think.
  - WhySoGullible 5y ago
    Here is one of the higher quality, long-term studies conducted by Harvard's Ash Center. You can read their full methodology below. [1] https://ash.harvard.edu/news/ash-center-researchers-release-landmark-chinese-public-opinion-study https://ash.harvard.edu/news/ash-center-researchers-release-... [2][pdf]: https://ash.harvard.edu/files/ash/files/final_policy_brief_7.6.2020.pdf https://ash.harvard.edu/files/ash/files/final_policy_brief_7...
    - yostrovs 5y ago
      I downloaded the report. It's a survey that does not seem to have had some way to overcome the reluctance to criticize when criticizing is against the law.
      - plantain00 5y ago
        What's the consequence of criticizing the CCP in China? Which law it will violate? There's a more famous woman criticizing the CCP in China(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fang_Fang https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fang_Fang), any consequence? No, no consequence, then why ordinary people are afraid of criticizing the CCP in China? especially for only offline investigation rather than published publication?
- guywhocodes 5y ago
  No, I lived in China, I got two know locals with wildly different opinions and reasons for thinking what they do. They idea that there is any non-controlled wide-spanning media where this could be discovered is I'm afraid laughable.

Fricken 5y ago

You are the gullible and ignorant victim of western anti-china propaganda. Many independent studies have been done. They all show very high approval ratings. Higher now, after the pandemic.

wolverine876 5y ago
The Chinese people who do have free speech, in Taiwan, and did, in Hong Kong, certainly don't/didn't like the CCP much. Perhaps that's why the CCP felt the need to shut down freedom in Hong Kong - too much criticism. If the CCP is so popular, why not have free speech and elections?
- Fricken 5y ago
  Why not? I don't think China is going to change it's functional political system just to prove a point to some rando on the internet is why.
  - loyukfai 5y ago
    It's people like you, and the predictable but classless act of keeping Wikimedia off WIPO (and similar ones) that gives CCP (and "China") bad rep all over world. Many would have liked a/one more counterbalance to US hegemony. From the latest polls though, it seems people would rather the US hegemony continues/strengthens rather than seeing CCP/"China" rises further. Such intangible acts will, sooner or later, have tangible consequences.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - Fricken 5y ago
      Latest polls from who? What polls are you talking about?
- A4ET8a8uTh0 5y ago
  The answer here appears to be simple. Because elections and free speech are aspects of the system that by design introduce certain level of instability, but also a way to channel population frustration thus preventing having to resort to violence. CCP chose stability of system above all else.
  - wolverine876 5y ago
    > The answer here appears to be simple. It was a rhetorical question. The CCP doesn't allow elections and free speech because they don't want to lose power. > elections and free speech are aspects of the system that by design introduce certain level of instability That's the standard claim of dictators, including the CCP, but it's just their propaganda. Democratic governments are far more stable. Chinese democracies - Taiwan and Hong Kong - are/were very stable. Japan, South Korea, etc. When was the last time the US, UK, etc. had a stability problem? Compare that to China, North Korea, and the rest. Also, that claim looks at it only from the dictator's point of view (a natural bias): Will my power last? I might be voted out at any time! I could be criticized into irrelevancy! That would be a catastrophe for the country if my great leadership was removed! Democracies change leaders frequently and with ease; it's rule of law, not of a person (or personality). Finally, from the ordinary citizen's point of view, democracies are far more stable: Their rights are protected; they won't be arbitrarily arrested, have their assets seized, be sent to reeducation camps, etc.
yostrovs 5y ago
It is against the law to criticize the CCP in China. What mechanism did the pollsters and researchers use to overcome that? Moreover, as with democracy, it is more than having the right to vote. It is also the right to know what your elected representatives are up to and what the state of the nation is. So if you ask people thoroughly drowning in state enforced propaganda from an early age what they think about something, you'll usually get what the propaganda machine told them to think.
- Fricken 5y ago
  >So if you ask people thoroughly drowning in state enforced propaganda from an early age what they think about something, you'll usually get what the propaganda machine told them to think. You have the option to stick with what the propaganda machine told to you to think.
- WhySoGullible 5y ago
  Here is one of the higher quality, long-term studies conducted by Harvard's Ash Center. You can read their full methodology below. [1] https://ash.harvard.edu/news/ash-center-researchers-release-landmark-chinese-public-opinion-study https://ash.harvard.edu/news/ash-center-researchers-release-... [2][pdf]: https://ash.harvard.edu/files/ash/files/final_policy_brief_7.6.2020.pdf https://ash.harvard.edu/files/ash/files/final_policy_brief_7...
  - yostrovs 5y ago
    I downloaded the report. It's a survey that does not seem to have had some way to overcome the reluctance to criticize when criticizing is against the law.
    - plantain00 5y ago
      What's the consequence of criticizing the CCP in China? Which law it will violate? There's a more famous woman criticizing the CCP in China(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fang_Fang https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fang_Fang), any consequence? No, no consequence, then why ordinary people are afraid of criticizing the CCP in China? especially for only offline investigation rather than published publication?
guywhocodes 5y ago
No, I lived in China, I got two know locals with wildly different opinions and reasons for thinking what they do. They idea that there is any non-controlled wide-spanning media where this could be discovered is I'm afraid laughable.