4 ms·

I have a feeling Australia will also get nukes reasonably soon. First nuke subs, then US bases with US nukes, then nuke subs with nukes. The Chinese pushed the

I have a feeling Australia will also get nukes reasonably soon. First nuke subs, then US bases with US nukes, then nuke subs with nukes. The Chinese pushed the Australians too far, they underestimated their obstinance. Australian attitudes are changing rapidly and in my view it won't take long until a nuclear deterrence becomes the obvious and only solution.

babelfish 5y ago
How has China ‘pushed’ Australia at all?
- ethbr0 5y ago
  Essentially, circa 2015+, Australia began loudly pushing back on Chinese claims to the South China Sea & regarding Taiwan, and banned Huawei involvement in core telecom. China, seeking to make an example in the region, escalated. https://www.hudson.org/research/17228-how-china-overreached-in-australia https://www.hudson.org/research/17228-how-china-overreached-... "Since 2018, China has refused to accept cabinet-level meetings with Australian counterparts, and for the past year is refusing to even accept phone calls. Since 2020, Beijing has imposed punitive measures against Australian barley, coal, timber, beef, cotton, sugar, copper, wool, lobsters, wine, and liquefied natural gas. These export sectors bring in around $15 billion a year from China. State authorities have issued arbitrary travel and safety warnings to Chinese students hoping to study in Australia."
  - babelfish 5y ago
    So if Australia was the instigator, how can China be blamed for their sanctions (“pushing” Australia)?
    - speedybird 5y ago
      How do you read that comment and conclude that Australia was the instigator? Do you really believe that China's claims to the South China Sea are legitimate?
- Gustomaximus 5y ago
  They have threatened Australia in military terms a bunch of times in the the last decade via politics, military leaders and CCP aligned media. Most recently saying with these new subs we are a potential nuclear target now. Or the paper cat will soon learn its lesson type articles. Quite a few of these over recent years and while many are probably bluster, it's hard for people on the end of this to not think its best to prepare for them being more than empty words. In very broad strokes I think China spent 30 years trying to align Australia politically to them, now this has push back they have moved to make an example, not helped that our current leaders seem to have equally encouraged this new relationship. I doubt it will ever be military action but at the same time we should prepare for the unlikely. Nukes make sense for Australia and other small nations where there is threat. As much as they are horrible things and it may lead to nuclear proliferation, it's the only self reliant way for a small nation to protect itself from a large nation if things go hot. Id actually like to see a world where countries agreed to serious limits to military. Maximum # jets, ships, troops and tanks type thing so a build-up to war would be harder, more obvious and give time to deal with fractured relationships.
Gustomaximus 5y ago
I too assumed this is why China was so upset by the subs decision. The strength of the reaction doesnt make sense on subs alone.

babelfish 5y ago

How has China ‘pushed’ Australia at all?

ethbr0 5y ago
Essentially, circa 2015+, Australia began loudly pushing back on Chinese claims to the South China Sea & regarding Taiwan, and banned Huawei involvement in core telecom. China, seeking to make an example in the region, escalated. https://www.hudson.org/research/17228-how-china-overreached-in-australia https://www.hudson.org/research/17228-how-china-overreached-... "Since 2018, China has refused to accept cabinet-level meetings with Australian counterparts, and for the past year is refusing to even accept phone calls. Since 2020, Beijing has imposed punitive measures against Australian barley, coal, timber, beef, cotton, sugar, copper, wool, lobsters, wine, and liquefied natural gas. These export sectors bring in around $15 billion a year from China. State authorities have issued arbitrary travel and safety warnings to Chinese students hoping to study in Australia."
- babelfish 5y ago
  So if Australia was the instigator, how can China be blamed for their sanctions (“pushing” Australia)?
  - speedybird 5y ago
    How do you read that comment and conclude that Australia was the instigator? Do you really believe that China's claims to the South China Sea are legitimate?
Gustomaximus 5y ago
They have threatened Australia in military terms a bunch of times in the the last decade via politics, military leaders and CCP aligned media. Most recently saying with these new subs we are a potential nuclear target now. Or the paper cat will soon learn its lesson type articles. Quite a few of these over recent years and while many are probably bluster, it's hard for people on the end of this to not think its best to prepare for them being more than empty words. In very broad strokes I think China spent 30 years trying to align Australia politically to them, now this has push back they have moved to make an example, not helped that our current leaders seem to have equally encouraged this new relationship. I doubt it will ever be military action but at the same time we should prepare for the unlikely. Nukes make sense for Australia and other small nations where there is threat. As much as they are horrible things and it may lead to nuclear proliferation, it's the only self reliant way for a small nation to protect itself from a large nation if things go hot. Id actually like to see a world where countries agreed to serious limits to military. Maximum # jets, ships, troops and tanks type thing so a build-up to war would be harder, more obvious and give time to deal with fractured relationships.

Gustomaximus 5y ago

I too assumed this is why China was so upset by the subs decision. The strength of the reaction doesnt make sense on subs alone.