4 ms·

Microsoft Has Committed to Right to Repair

20 points by jonbaer 5y ago

rektide 5y ago
For all the fear we had of Microsoft Secure Boot & UEFI, it's mostly pretty good. Over a decade into it & none of the early fears we had seem to have manifested, about users losing control, about the terms of the deal in Secure Boot being updated to be exclusionary. Because of this, Windows running PCs have been capable of running alternate OSes, capable of being maintained by their owners indefinitely. AFAIK it's still impossible to delete the MS keys on many many systems, meaning secure boot will never ever be able to block Microsoft or the feds from loading whatever boot payload they want on your laptop, But the Microsoft resident keys feel three-hundred-thousand-times better than the fat-load-of-nothing we've gotten from Android handset manufacturers. I'd guess less than 1% of handsets probably have manufacturer unlockable (not hacked unlockable) bootloaders. This is so anti-right-to-repair it's sick. Once a phone stops receiving support, we basically have to throw it out, or hack the bootloader, to begin to repair them. Chromebook at least is better. Often there's a weird ritual of opening the case & removing a screw, then the device visibly shows it's in unsafe mode, but there's a well defined normal path to a device handing itself over to users. Apple interesting repeats the split: they seem ultra-hostile to unlocking mobile devices, but the new M1 powered macs? They went out the door capable of running alternate OSes, didn't try to stop that. Apple's first desktop-class chip, and while you can't buy the chip, they also haven't stopped outside users. I find that fascinating. Interesting to see John Carmack recently get Facebook to also start towards doing the right thing, at least on the old Oculus Go hardware[1] (not the newer Quest though)! Good job being able to announce that, two weeks before Microsoft announces they're going to do the right thing, support right-to-repair. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28647316 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28647316 https://twitter.com/id_aa_carmack/status/1441496416463904768 https://twitter.com/id_aa_carmack/status/1441496416463904768
adolph 5y ago
1. show me don't tell me 2. make something worth repairing
- 908B64B197 5y ago
  > show me don't tell me The reparability score of the Surface Laptop has increased with newer generations. 1 - https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+Teardown/92915 https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+Tea... 2 - https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+2+Teardown/126422 https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+2+T... 3 - https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+3++(13.5-inch)+Teardown/127330 https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+3++...
drewcoo 5y ago
the company will study the environmental impact of right-to-repair and act on its findings by the end of the next year The title seems misleading.
brundolf 5y ago
I see this as a shot at Apple, just like Apple made a shot at Google over tracking. Apple is much more dependent than Microsoft on hardware sales, particularly tightly-integrated hardware, so they'd be burdened disproportionately by right-to-repair laws. Of course even if it comes from a cynical place it can still have a good impact.
Daedren 5y ago
A lot of websites are taking this as a positive measure towards reducing electronic waste. While I believe that to be true, I wonder how long it'll take for this to make up for the possibly billions of computers that cannot update to Windows 11 for an insignificant reason.

20 points by jonbaer 5y ago

For all the fear we had of Microsoft Secure Boot & UEFI, it's mostly pretty good. Over a decade into it & none of the early fears we had seem to have manifested, about users losing control, about the terms of the deal in Secure Boot being updated to be exclusionary. Because of this, Windows running PCs have been capable of running alternate OSes, capable of being maintained by their owners indefinitely. AFAIK it's still impossible to delete the MS keys on many many systems, meaning secure boot will never ever be able to block Microsoft or the feds from loading whatever boot payload they want on your laptop, But the Microsoft resident keys feel three-hundred-thousand-times better than the fat-load-of-nothing we've gotten from Android handset manufacturers. I'd guess less than 1% of handsets probably have manufacturer unlockable (not hacked unlockable) bootloaders. This is so anti-right-to-repair it's sick. Once a phone stops receiving support, we basically have to throw it out, or hack the bootloader, to begin to repair them. Chromebook at least is better. Often there's a weird ritual of opening the case & removing a screw, then the device visibly shows it's in unsafe mode, but there's a well defined normal path to a device handing itself over to users. Apple interesting repeats the split: they seem ultra-hostile to unlocking mobile devices, but the new M1 powered macs? They went out the door capable of running alternate OSes, didn't try to stop that. Apple's first desktop-class chip, and while you can't buy the chip, they also haven't stopped outside users. I find that fascinating. Interesting to see John Carmack recently get Facebook to also start towards doing the right thing, at least on the old Oculus Go hardware[1] (not the newer Quest though)! Good job being able to announce that, two weeks before Microsoft announces they're going to do the right thing, support right-to-repair. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28647316 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28647316 https://twitter.com/id_aa_carmack/status/1441496416463904768 https://twitter.com/id_aa_carmack/status/1441496416463904768

adolph 5y ago

1. show me don't tell me 2. make something worth repairing

908B64B197 5y ago
> show me don't tell me The reparability score of the Surface Laptop has increased with newer generations. 1 - https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+Teardown/92915 https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+Tea... 2 - https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+2+Teardown/126422 https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+2+T... 3 - https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+3++(13.5-inch)+Teardown/127330 https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Laptop+3++...

drewcoo 5y ago

the company will study the environmental impact of right-to-repair and act on its findings by the end of the next year The title seems misleading.

brundolf 5y ago

I see this as a shot at Apple, just like Apple made a shot at Google over tracking. Apple is much more dependent than Microsoft on hardware sales, particularly tightly-integrated hardware, so they'd be burdened disproportionately by right-to-repair laws. Of course even if it comes from a cynical place it can still have a good impact.

Daedren 5y ago

A lot of websites are taking this as a positive measure towards reducing electronic waste. While I believe that to be true, I wonder how long it'll take for this to make up for the possibly billions of computers that cannot update to Windows 11 for an insignificant reason.