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> It would only take one competitor to produce a long lasting vaccine and that competitor would take the entire market You're assuming a free market, not one t

> It would only take one competitor to produce a long lasting vaccine and that competitor would take the entire market You're assuming a free market, not one that's stuffed full of highly paid lobbyists.

Barrin92 5y ago
I'm not at all assuming an idealized free market. Lobbyists can exist but even lobbyists for particular firms compete with other lobbyists. Again, for something like this to make sense you would need to show how every scientific institution on earth somehow coordinates to not produce a superior vaccine. Someone in the US can lobby all they want, if someone in India or China, any public research institute, any state agency produces a superior vaccine they will lose. Are you saying tens of thousands of scientists and competing businesses, from Cambodia to Cuba to Russia to the US, to organisations that don't even have a profit motive like public university researchers, have all conspired to lock away some magic vaccine in a box? Let's say the entire US has been captured by the vaccine lizard people, do you think China or Russia would forego the opportunity to expose to the entire world that this has been happening while also capturing the entire global market with a better product?
- generalizations 5y ago
  > Are you saying [extreme borderline-strawman statement that is obviously not what I said at all] I'm saying it's possible that a few extremely powerful corporations chose to develop a vaccine that is less useful than it could have been, and are profiting off the difference. I'm also saying that the big ones might have enough influence to get away with a less-effective vaccine than some smaller player who can get swallowed up, if needed. I'm also aware that the scientific consensus you seem to think exists about the vaccine, doesn't. I'm also aware that you don't need to get all those experts on board - just like 20 years ago when it was the tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists who thought the government was spying on them, all you have to do is make the dissidents look ridiculous. Lizard people, eh?

Barrin92 5y ago

I'm not at all assuming an idealized free market. Lobbyists can exist but even lobbyists for particular firms compete with other lobbyists. Again, for something like this to make sense you would need to show how every scientific institution on earth somehow coordinates to not produce a superior vaccine. Someone in the US can lobby all they want, if someone in India or China, any public research institute, any state agency produces a superior vaccine they will lose. Are you saying tens of thousands of scientists and competing businesses, from Cambodia to Cuba to Russia to the US, to organisations that don't even have a profit motive like public university researchers, have all conspired to lock away some magic vaccine in a box? Let's say the entire US has been captured by the vaccine lizard people, do you think China or Russia would forego the opportunity to expose to the entire world that this has been happening while also capturing the entire global market with a better product?

generalizations 5y ago
> Are you saying [extreme borderline-strawman statement that is obviously not what I said at all] I'm saying it's possible that a few extremely powerful corporations chose to develop a vaccine that is less useful than it could have been, and are profiting off the difference. I'm also saying that the big ones might have enough influence to get away with a less-effective vaccine than some smaller player who can get swallowed up, if needed. I'm also aware that the scientific consensus you seem to think exists about the vaccine, doesn't. I'm also aware that you don't need to get all those experts on board - just like 20 years ago when it was the tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists who thought the government was spying on them, all you have to do is make the dissidents look ridiculous. Lizard people, eh?