5 ms·

It's heretical to say such things and "anti-science" as branded by the media. The fact that California now wants kids to get the vaccine is bonkers to me. Kids

It's heretical to say such things and "anti-science" as branded by the media. The fact that California now wants kids to get the vaccine is bonkers to me. Kids don't even feel this shit if they catch it. Pharmaceutical companies must be paying big bucks to the politicians in that state.

javagram 5y ago
Covid is more dangerous to kids than chicken pox, we still vaccinate kids for chickenpox though. Hundreds of children have died of Covid-19. https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Deaths-Focus-on-Ages-0-18-Yea/nr4s-juj3 https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Deaths-Focus-...
- makomk 5y ago
  Not all countries vaccinate kids for chickenpox. The UK still doesn't for example. I'm pretty sure it's easily the least necessary of the childhood vaccinations.
- Jensson 5y ago
  Chickenpox vaccine lasts a lifetime, giving it to kids protects them as an adult as well.
- rc2634 5y ago
  Thousands of kids die every year of the flu but we never mandated the flu vaccine for them but somehow hundreds of deaths over almost two years is supposed to prove COVID is more dangerous and experimental vaccines with no long term safety data should be mandated for kids? Give me a break!
s5300 5y ago
If kids "don't even feel this shit if they catch it" Why have pediatric ICU beds been near or at capacity and care as a whole on the brink of failure from months of completely fucked working conditions for the doctors and nurses? Along with other kids not dealing with COVID having life saving medical procedures/treatments indefinitely delayed until beds are back down below a certain fill for some amount of time? I've personally had to see effects this in my extended family. Seriously - what is wrong with you? What makes you have to say things/come to conclusions like this when you're very clearly factually incorrect? https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavirus/pediatric-hospital-beds-icus-full-in-tarrant-county-health-director-says/2741699/ https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavirus/pediatric-hospital-b... https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/patient-flow/number-of-us-children-hospitalized-with-covid-19-hits-record-dallas-out-of-pediatric-icu-beds.html https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/patient-flow/number-of... https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210816/u-s-reports-record-covid-hospitalizations-of-children https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210816/u-s-reports-record-... https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/kids-sick-covid-are-filling-children-s-hospitals-areas-seeing-n1276238 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/kids-sick-covid-are-fil... https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/24/health/covid-hospitalizations-commentary/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/24/health/covid-hospitalizations... https://www.baltimoresun.com/coronavirus/bs-md-pediatric-covid-20210818-qkruyn754nesbm3ghwgdlyixrq-story.html https://www.baltimoresun.com/coronavirus/bs-md-pediatric-cov... https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/09/02/picu-hospital-beds-children-covid/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/09/02/picu-hosp...
- angelzen 5y ago
  There are 3006 counties in the USA. Given that the pandemic is not trivial, it is possible to find a couple counties with overwhelmed ICU beds on any given day. The catch is that the counties change as the pandemic waves come and go. The media chases around for the counties that get overwhelmed, and ignores the vast majority of counties that are not overwhelmed. That before taking in account that, for economic reasons, ICUs are not build for pandemics, with double digit occupancy rates even outside epidemic waves. For example, here's actual pedriatic ICU data from Seattle metro area with ~4M people. I bet this never made the news. MARY BRIDGE CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL, 55.5%, 6.1 of 11.0 beds used SEATTLE CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL, 83.0%, 71.4 of 86.0 beds used https://datacentral.kitsapsun.com/covid-19-hospital-capacity https://datacentral.kitsapsun.com/covid-19-hospital-capacity Edit: Turns out that the KitsapSun app has county-level data for all of USA. For Tarrant county (your top 2 links), right now the pedriatic ICU data is: COOK CHILDRENS MEDICAL CENTER, 82.5%, 34.3 of 41.6 beds used Not great, but not months-long-near-capacity-brink-of-failure situation either. The adult ICU situation is much worse, hopefully it will retreat in the coming weeks. https://datacentral.kitsapsun.com/covid-19-hospital-capacity/texas/48/tarrant-county/48439/ https://datacentral.kitsapsun.com/covid-19-hospital-capacity...
ceejayoz 5y ago
> Kids don't even feel this shit if they catch it. In general, sure, but that's a bit like arguing people should be able to drive drunk because drunks are more likely to survive a car accident. https://www.scientificamerican.com/podcast/episode/odds-favor-drunk-trauma-victims-09-10-01/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/podcast/episode/odds-favo... > A retrospective study of nearly 8,000 trauma patients found that seven percent of people who came in sober died of their injuries, while those who were hurt while drunk only died one percent of the time. A positive blood alcohol level seemed to increase the likelihood of survival, even after the researchers took into account the age of the patient and the severity of the injury. Trauma patients who came in to the hospital drunk were discharged sooner, too. The impact on others can be significant, and important.
- pyronik19 5y ago
  Then the establishment should just be honest about it instead of trying to fear-porn parents into wanting to "protect your kids from the deadly disease".... Just say.... we are going to put your kids at risk from the vaccine because we think the ends justify the benefits for old people.
  - ceejayoz 5y ago
    > instead of trying to fear-porn parents > we are going to put your kids at risk from the vaccine A bit on the nose, don't you think?
    - AndrewBissell 5y ago
      How else should it be stated except "on the nose," given what's at stake?
      - ceejayoz 5y ago
        It's "a bit on the nose" that someone complaining about fear-porn uses the same post to push fear-porn about the vaccines.

javagram 5y ago

Covid is more dangerous to kids than chicken pox, we still vaccinate kids for chickenpox though. Hundreds of children have died of Covid-19. https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Deaths-Focus-on-Ages-0-18-Yea/nr4s-juj3 https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Deaths-Focus-...

makomk 5y ago
Not all countries vaccinate kids for chickenpox. The UK still doesn't for example. I'm pretty sure it's easily the least necessary of the childhood vaccinations.
Jensson 5y ago
Chickenpox vaccine lasts a lifetime, giving it to kids protects them as an adult as well.
rc2634 5y ago
Thousands of kids die every year of the flu but we never mandated the flu vaccine for them but somehow hundreds of deaths over almost two years is supposed to prove COVID is more dangerous and experimental vaccines with no long term safety data should be mandated for kids? Give me a break!

s5300 5y ago

If kids "don't even feel this shit if they catch it" Why have pediatric ICU beds been near or at capacity and care as a whole on the brink of failure from months of completely fucked working conditions for the doctors and nurses? Along with other kids not dealing with COVID having life saving medical procedures/treatments indefinitely delayed until beds are back down below a certain fill for some amount of time? I've personally had to see effects this in my extended family. Seriously - what is wrong with you? What makes you have to say things/come to conclusions like this when you're very clearly factually incorrect? https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavirus/pediatric-hospital-beds-icus-full-in-tarrant-county-health-director-says/2741699/ https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/coronavirus/pediatric-hospital-b... https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/patient-flow/number-of-us-children-hospitalized-with-covid-19-hits-record-dallas-out-of-pediatric-icu-beds.html https://www.beckershospitalreview.com/patient-flow/number-of... https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210816/u-s-reports-record-covid-hospitalizations-of-children https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210816/u-s-reports-record-... https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/kids-sick-covid-are-filling-children-s-hospitals-areas-seeing-n1276238 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/kids-sick-covid-are-fil... https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/24/health/covid-hospitalizations-commentary/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/24/health/covid-hospitalizations... https://www.baltimoresun.com/coronavirus/bs-md-pediatric-covid-20210818-qkruyn754nesbm3ghwgdlyixrq-story.html https://www.baltimoresun.com/coronavirus/bs-md-pediatric-cov... https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/09/02/picu-hospital-beds-children-covid/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/09/02/picu-hosp...

angelzen 5y ago
There are 3006 counties in the USA. Given that the pandemic is not trivial, it is possible to find a couple counties with overwhelmed ICU beds on any given day. The catch is that the counties change as the pandemic waves come and go. The media chases around for the counties that get overwhelmed, and ignores the vast majority of counties that are not overwhelmed. That before taking in account that, for economic reasons, ICUs are not build for pandemics, with double digit occupancy rates even outside epidemic waves. For example, here's actual pedriatic ICU data from Seattle metro area with ~4M people. I bet this never made the news. MARY BRIDGE CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL, 55.5%, 6.1 of 11.0 beds used SEATTLE CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL, 83.0%, 71.4 of 86.0 beds used https://datacentral.kitsapsun.com/covid-19-hospital-capacity https://datacentral.kitsapsun.com/covid-19-hospital-capacity Edit: Turns out that the KitsapSun app has county-level data for all of USA. For Tarrant county (your top 2 links), right now the pedriatic ICU data is: COOK CHILDRENS MEDICAL CENTER, 82.5%, 34.3 of 41.6 beds used Not great, but not months-long-near-capacity-brink-of-failure situation either. The adult ICU situation is much worse, hopefully it will retreat in the coming weeks. https://datacentral.kitsapsun.com/covid-19-hospital-capacity/texas/48/tarrant-county/48439/ https://datacentral.kitsapsun.com/covid-19-hospital-capacity...

ceejayoz 5y ago

> Kids don't even feel this shit if they catch it. In general, sure, but that's a bit like arguing people should be able to drive drunk because drunks are more likely to survive a car accident. https://www.scientificamerican.com/podcast/episode/odds-favor-drunk-trauma-victims-09-10-01/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/podcast/episode/odds-favo... > A retrospective study of nearly 8,000 trauma patients found that seven percent of people who came in sober died of their injuries, while those who were hurt while drunk only died one percent of the time. A positive blood alcohol level seemed to increase the likelihood of survival, even after the researchers took into account the age of the patient and the severity of the injury. Trauma patients who came in to the hospital drunk were discharged sooner, too. The impact on others can be significant, and important.

pyronik19 5y ago
Then the establishment should just be honest about it instead of trying to fear-porn parents into wanting to "protect your kids from the deadly disease".... Just say.... we are going to put your kids at risk from the vaccine because we think the ends justify the benefits for old people.
- ceejayoz 5y ago
  > instead of trying to fear-porn parents > we are going to put your kids at risk from the vaccine A bit on the nose, don't you think?
  - AndrewBissell 5y ago
    How else should it be stated except "on the nose," given what's at stake?
    - ceejayoz 5y ago
      It's "a bit on the nose" that someone complaining about fear-porn uses the same post to push fear-porn about the vaccines.