5 ms·

Very interesting. In Canada, it will take years to recoup the price difference for buying an electric car even with government incentives. 25% VAT + Extra tax s

Very interesting. In Canada, it will take years to recoup the price difference for buying an electric car even with government incentives. 25% VAT + Extra tax seems to work.

pmalynin 5y ago
And especially now with the added burden of the “luxury” car tax.
- _3u10 5y ago
  The luxury car tax doesn't really apply to new cars. If the seller is registered with the govt as a seller of luxury goods then it does not apply. https://www.canada.ca/en/department-finance/programs/consultations/2021/consultation-proposed-luxury-tax/select-luxury-goods-tax.html https://www.canada.ca/en/department-finance/programs/consult...
jszymborski 5y ago
Agreed! We have subsidies for electric vehicles under a certain price, but imo prices just get inflated to "what the market is willing to pay" + "value of the subsidy"
- dietr1ch 5y ago
  Isn't that intended? That extra revenue should also come with extra pressure to deliver cost-efficient products as new parties may want a share of that sweet subsidy. Initially it may look like the subsidy is just throwing out money, but if the subsidy is kept around for a while it becomes a bounty for future competitors.
  - jszymborski 5y ago
    That's certainly not how it's marketed, at least. A lot of the communications on it have been "Take advantage of our subsidies and save!". If this is a business-side incentive versus a consumer-side incentive, I personally would much rather they just give them the money directly based on sales and avoid the dishonesty of making folk feel like, even after "savings", EVs are expensive.
mikewave 5y ago
That's mostly because of the lack of midmarket cars. I bought a used sub-$20k electrical car a few months ago; it can be done. The market needs pressure to create cars in that price range; right now EVs are mostly luxury cars. Tesla is not the car we should be aiming for; what we need are things in the class of the E-Golf, Kia Niro, FFE, Fiat 500E etc. that are the size of a Corolla and cost 20k CAD or less. Until that's common on the market, the value proposition is flawed and nobody is buying an electric car to save money except for people who buy used cars that someone else has eaten the depreciation on (like me), or people who drive a LOT. Everyone else is basically buying these things as luxury items, and the cost doesn't matter, especially when you can get near-0% financing over 5+ years.....
- _3u10 5y ago
  Yeah, used EVs depreciate quickly. I'm comparing new Tesla Plaids to the C8 Corvette and due to depreciation its looking like the C8 will be much cheaper, and much more fun to drive. The C8 will drop 30k in 5 years according to C6/C7 data, whereas a Plaid will likely drop 70k. If I spend less than $800 a month on fuel the C8 is cheaper. Currently C8s are appreciating their first year, which is really weird. The Model S is really chonky at almost 5000 lbs, which is the same as a 4Runner.
  - philg_jr 5y ago
    Corvette vs Model S is kind of a weird comparison, especially with the weight comparison. One is a coupe and one is a sedan. Maybe compare the Model S to an M5 or E63?
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
  - TaylorAlexander 5y ago
    Please donate to your local food bank. Many people are hungry. You can help. Perhaps this one is local to you: https://www.accfb.org/ https://www.accfb.org/
nereye 5y ago
And in parts of Canada apparently you have to pay additional taxes if you buy an EV, i.e. there are disincentives as opposed to incentives. Sold as being an effort to balance the lack of revenue from EVs skipping the various taxes on gas. E.g.: https://electrek.co/2021/10/04/canadian-group-satirizes-saskatchewans-dumb-ev-tax-by-suggesting-a-sidewalk-tax/ https://electrek.co/2021/10/04/canadian-group-satirizes-sask....
chmod775 5y ago
What does "years" mean in this context? Considering we're talking about cars and not something that you would replace within a month, recouping the price difference within 4-5 years would still be okay.

Very interesting. In Canada, it will take years to recoup the price difference for buying an electric car even with government incentives. 25% VAT + Extra tax seems to work.

pmalynin 5y ago

And especially now with the added burden of the “luxury” car tax.

_3u10 5y ago
The luxury car tax doesn't really apply to new cars. If the seller is registered with the govt as a seller of luxury goods then it does not apply. https://www.canada.ca/en/department-finance/programs/consultations/2021/consultation-proposed-luxury-tax/select-luxury-goods-tax.html https://www.canada.ca/en/department-finance/programs/consult...

jszymborski 5y ago

Agreed! We have subsidies for electric vehicles under a certain price, but imo prices just get inflated to "what the market is willing to pay" + "value of the subsidy"

dietr1ch 5y ago
Isn't that intended? That extra revenue should also come with extra pressure to deliver cost-efficient products as new parties may want a share of that sweet subsidy. Initially it may look like the subsidy is just throwing out money, but if the subsidy is kept around for a while it becomes a bounty for future competitors.
- jszymborski 5y ago
  That's certainly not how it's marketed, at least. A lot of the communications on it have been "Take advantage of our subsidies and save!". If this is a business-side incentive versus a consumer-side incentive, I personally would much rather they just give them the money directly based on sales and avoid the dishonesty of making folk feel like, even after "savings", EVs are expensive.

mikewave 5y ago

That's mostly because of the lack of midmarket cars. I bought a used sub-$20k electrical car a few months ago; it can be done. The market needs pressure to create cars in that price range; right now EVs are mostly luxury cars. Tesla is not the car we should be aiming for; what we need are things in the class of the E-Golf, Kia Niro, FFE, Fiat 500E etc. that are the size of a Corolla and cost 20k CAD or less. Until that's common on the market, the value proposition is flawed and nobody is buying an electric car to save money except for people who buy used cars that someone else has eaten the depreciation on (like me), or people who drive a LOT. Everyone else is basically buying these things as luxury items, and the cost doesn't matter, especially when you can get near-0% financing over 5+ years.....

_3u10 5y ago
Yeah, used EVs depreciate quickly. I'm comparing new Tesla Plaids to the C8 Corvette and due to depreciation its looking like the C8 will be much cheaper, and much more fun to drive. The C8 will drop 30k in 5 years according to C6/C7 data, whereas a Plaid will likely drop 70k. If I spend less than $800 a month on fuel the C8 is cheaper. Currently C8s are appreciating their first year, which is really weird. The Model S is really chonky at almost 5000 lbs, which is the same as a 4Runner.
- philg_jr 5y ago
  Corvette vs Model S is kind of a weird comparison, especially with the weight comparison. One is a coupe and one is a sedan. Maybe compare the Model S to an M5 or E63?
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- TaylorAlexander 5y ago
  Please donate to your local food bank. Many people are hungry. You can help. Perhaps this one is local to you: https://www.accfb.org/ https://www.accfb.org/

nereye 5y ago

And in parts of Canada apparently you have to pay additional taxes if you buy an EV, i.e. there are disincentives as opposed to incentives. Sold as being an effort to balance the lack of revenue from EVs skipping the various taxes on gas. E.g.: https://electrek.co/2021/10/04/canadian-group-satirizes-saskatchewans-dumb-ev-tax-by-suggesting-a-sidewalk-tax/ https://electrek.co/2021/10/04/canadian-group-satirizes-sask....

chmod775 5y ago

What does "years" mean in this context? Considering we're talking about cars and not something that you would replace within a month, recouping the price difference within 4-5 years would still be okay.