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New “Report a Problem” link on product pages
- some_random 5y agoIt's absolutely unacceptable that it took this long.
- 404mm 5y agoI just wish this was available to apps you haven’t purchased yet. There are some obvious scams and I cannot report them until I purchase .. kinda defeats the purpose for this use case.
- CodeWriter23 5y agoWill definitely be used to delete competitors.
- rvz 5y agomore like 'abused' rather than 'used'.
- akersten 5y agoWeird. I thought all the apps were already reviewed and approved by a specialized and trained committee before being blessed with a space in the App Store. What could we possibly need this button for?
- Closi 5y agoEh, it’s pretty easy to hide things behind a feature flag during the review process.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- jedberg 5y agoI think their point is that the App Store review process is random and arbitrary.
- bilbo0s 5y agoWhich is not to say that "Report a Scam or Fraud" is a bad policy. App Store review can be random, AND this can be a good policy. (Well, good for consumers. I could see it causing developers some issues if competitors weaponize it.)
- mcny 5y agoI, for one, like the f-droid model or you could say any sane package manager model. When I download a package from f-droid repository, I know the folks at f-droid have the source code of the bits I downloaded. Same thing with Debian and Fedora. Why can't Apple do the same thing? Require developers to submit machine-readable source code along with build instructions. Build them directly on Apple servers. Sign them with Apple's certificates. I am not an Apple developer. As a consumer, I would welcome such a change. Now, it is true that you could have a web view that fetches application chrome/content from a web server but I would argue Apple should disallow such apps anyway.
- etchalon 5y agoWhile that might be a great idea, Apple is a competitor of many of the companies in the App Store. I'm not sure how they'd feel about their largest competitor having access to their absolutely-valuable-and-secret source code.
- pabs3 5y agoThey could require it be stored with a reputable escrow company.
- matsemann 5y agoHuh, what's the value in the review process then..?
- heavyset_go 5y agoTo limit competition.
- endisneigh 5y agoThis is a strange comment. Do you think people are infallible? lol.
- bagels 5y agoI think the charitable take is that the comment is in jest.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- actusual 5y agoThe comparison to HN is wrong. Moderators would first have to read the comments and let them through.
- endisneigh 5y agoMy point is that even if moderators did read the comments and let them through, that wouldn't obviate the need, since moderators aren't perfect.
- cptskippy 5y agoPart of Apple's argument in the Epic case was that their screening process mitigated the need for things like this. This is essentially an admission that their review process has problems.
- etchalon 5y agoApple admitted that? They've never claimed it's perfect. Just that it's better than not having it.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- didntknowya 5y agoif we had to pay to submit comments and wait a few days or even weeks for it to go through the company's "stringent" rules before it is approved, then yes a flagging button is counterintuitive.
- bryan_w 5y agoYeah, they did say that these processes were part of the value that developers _gladly_ pay 30% + $100 for...
- martimarkov 5y agoThey also don’t force developers to pay $99 or 30%
- floatingatoll 5y agoHuman error.
- happybuy 5y agoBeing an App Store developer is like intentionally walking into an abusive relationship and hoping that the pay-off will be worth the trouble. I'm sure you're aware but, as an app developer, the review process seems random at many times. Depending upon the phase of the moon certain features or metadata may be accepted or rejected in apps. Even when the exact same features have been accepted in prior app versions and app reviews (without changes to the actual guidelines). In such cases, perhaps Apple's interpretation of the guidelines have changed. If so, there's no way for app developers to know this until they get hit with a rejection. Rejections rarely include explanation of the interpretation so it's up to the developer to try and interpret what the real issue is. This is on top of the fact that, in many cases, Apple deliberately uses the guidelines and shifting interpretations to delay or destroy competitors. This occurs even if competitors are acting within the guidelines and all prior known interpretations of those guidelines.
- echelon 5y agoWhy not just allow web installs without the app store? You can report frauds against an app's signature, and centralized command and control can disable apps that attempt to harm users. (With opt-out if you care.)
- vineyardmike 5y ago> You can report frauds against an app's signature, and centralized command and control can disable apps that attempt to harm users. (With opt-out if you care.) The only new thing here is that you can opt-out. Fraud/Scam is a real issue, and controlling your device is a real issue. But they're two issues.
- keleftheriou 5y agoDisclaimer: I'm the developer of FlickType and have been advocating for this change for months now, after being severely affected by scam competitors on the App Store. I have also filed a lawsuit against Apple, partly because of this. This is a welcome change, but what’s most important is what Apple actually does with the reports - which I’m definitely going to be keeping a close eye on. Of note, this “New” Report-a-Problem button is not actually new: it used to be there but Apple decided to remove it years ago, while App Store scams were - and still are - running rampant: https://techcrunch.com/2021/10/06/with-return-of-report-a-problem-on-app-store-apple-invites-public-to-help-fight-fraud/ https://techcrunch.com/2021/10/06/with-return-of-report-a-pr...
- bberenberg 5y agoI am interested in what they will do around false reports. I hear about negative review attacks from competitors on Amazon listings, so it will be interesting to see how this is weaponized and how Apple responds.
- OldHand2018 5y ago> Now App Store product pages on iOS 15, iPadOS 15, and macOS Monterey display a “Report a Problem“ link, so users can more easily report concerns with content they’ve purchased or downloaded. It appears that reports are going to be attributed to actual accounts, which should enable Apple to identify abusers more easily.
- jsjohnst 5y ago> It appears that reports are going to be attributed to actual accounts, which should enable Apple to identify abusers more easily. I don't feel X == Y in this case. Account creation is not a high enough bar to block abusers IMHO. Amazon reviews require accounts too, but that obviously doesn't stop the negative review attacks which GP mentioned.
- DelightOne 5y ago
- vineyardmike 5y agoi can only imagine the amount of trash reports they'll get. "I clicked on this ad on facebook and bought something that never arrived!" Help i've been scammed! "Why is this amazon product late??" Amazon App is a scam! "They messed up my chipotle order and the app doesn't allow me to report the order as missing something". I know none of these are really apple's fault/responsibility. But ask anyone who works in customer support - there is a really long tail of people who actually thinks all apps are by apple and apple should offer support.
- tlogan 5y agoExactly! You do not need to work in customer support to know that: just read reviews on trustpilot.com
- r00fus 5y agoBravo, this is true comedy. Punchline: Trustpilot is essentially a paid referral service.
- paulpauper 5y agoThis is why fraudsters do not fear report options. The high incidence of false positives and noise to signal guarantees a high threshold will of reports will have to be met before any action is taken, giving the scammers enough time to profit before action is taken.
- asperous 5y agoIn this case though it can flag a human review.. unlike something like Amazon where it’s harder, more expensive, and takes longer to check if something is a scam
- codetrotter 5y agoThey will be getting many trash reports for sure. The mobile carrier that I use has an app on the App Store that subscribers can install in order to view their subscription, change subscription plan, and view past and present bills/invoices. The app itself is pretty good, it's snappy and easy to use. Only shortcoming is that they have a widget that comes with the app but the widget doesn't work and they have been aware of this for a long time without fixing it. Anyways, I was looking at the reviews and most were positive. But then there was one review that stood out. A one star review, and get this – the review was complaining about something totally orthogonal to the app itself. They were complaining about the prices of the plans the carrier is offering. The pricing of the plans that your carrier is offering is not relevant to managing your plan through this app. These kinds of irrelevant complaints are sure to show up in reports too, like you say. But let's hope that the amount of those will stay relatively low.
- DwnVoteHoneyPot 5y agoThey had this functionality before, but removed it.
- axpy906 5y agoI wonder what percent of users actually believe that all the apps listed are legit?
- tgsovlerkhgsel 5y agoIn other words, Apple has been ignoring blatant fraud like subscription fraud for years and something has now forced their hand. I wonder what it was. Maybe someone realized that Apple should be considered complicit if they pocket 30% of the proceeds of the crime and continue to enable it?
- paulpauper 5y agoIt will only matter if management is responsive to reports (see for example the youtube crypto livestream scam problem, which has been going on for almost 3 years).
- ChrisMarshallNY 5y agoAwesome! It has always been difficult to do this. There's a particularly nasty type of scam that is the "Gazillion bucks a month subscription" app, that I have encountered a few times, but have been unable to report.
- PostThisTooFast 5y agoOn WHAT pages? Another shit headline.
- kybernetyk 5y agoGreat. I’m waiting eagerly to see how my competition will try to report my app to get it kicked from the App Store. And Apple being apple they might even be successful.
- 1cvmask 5y ago“Be careful what you wish for, lest it comes true!” - Aesop’s Fables (circa 260 BC). This will probably not affect the big incumbent apps at all with all their resources and legal teams. This can and probably will be used as a blunt instrument and weapon on the honest indie hacker. Another unnecessary high bar put in front of them. The scamsters will probably be unaffected in the long run while the costs will be borne by the small guys. They are pros at gaming the system and will always figure out workarounds. I hope I am wrong but the unintended consequences of penalties is always selectively applied to the weak and honest. We already see similar results play out everywhere else and we never seem to learn. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unintended_consequences https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unintended_consequences