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I heard you can change your address to California, which then gives the option to cancel online (due to state law). It is absolutely ridiculous that NYT will ha

by madars 5y ago

I heard you can change your address to California, which then gives the option to cancel online (due to state law). It is absolutely ridiculous that NYT will happily take your card info online, but require you to be on hold to speak with their "customer care" to cancel. Maybe it is time to use virtual CC's a la privacy.com.

ribosometronome 5y ago
Do any banks do a good job offering this feature for debit? Back in one of the days, the PayPal TOOLBAR used to offer this feature, it was really convenient since you were essentially direct drawing from your bank account with it.
electroly 5y ago
If you use PayPal to pay for NYT, you can cancel via PayPal and never speak to anyone.
jmknoll 5y ago
If you have a credit card with capital one, they provide a browser extension for generating and managing virtual numbers which works like a charm. I’ve been happily using it for all online purchases for the past couple of years. No need to worry about merchants charging for cancelled subscriptions, and if a service has implemented any dark patterns in their unsubscribe process, I just kill the virtual number and let it resolve itself, rather than needing to worry about it.
hashmymustache 5y ago
That’s every newspaper online. And gym memberships. And many others. Easy to get, pain in the ass to end.
- ahefner 5y ago
  I had no difficulty unsubscribing from The Washington Post.
core-utility 5y ago
That's my biggest use case for Privacy.com. I care less about the privacy aspect and more about the convenience. I've already had once instance where a single-use card I created for 1 specific vendor started getting fraudulent hits (declines) and all I had to do was delete that card.
- JumpCrisscross 5y ago
  > all I had to do was delete that card Careful. If you didn’t properly terminate the contract, you still owe that money. I have a friend whose credit got hit because a service sold his debt to a collector.
  - core-utility 5y ago
    Thanks, good to note. In this case, they were declined transactions (nothing that went through) so it was only a tip-off to something fishy.
- tlogan 5y ago
  Be careful. You are still on the hook. And in many cases companies will sell you debt to collection agencies.
  - abnercoimbre 5y ago
    Long-time Privacy.com user. You'll typically be OK with streaming services, newspapers, and mobile / web apps. Definitely be careful with gyms, insurance companies, and any service that sends out invoices (instead of calling it a monthly subscription.)
SllX 5y ago
I dunno. I cancelled the other day now that I no longer care about the pandemic data and it was basically just three minutes of politely stonewalling in a chat box saying “No Thanks, please cancel my subscription.” a couple of times. I live in California and would have tried cancelling online but actually couldn’t find the option. I can’t say it was difficult to cancel though once I picked a process and initiated it. Maybe that was the online option now that I think about it? I was expecting a button or link.
- gmadsen 5y ago
  I did the same a few years ago and it was relatively painless, however there are many people that do not like confrontation and "stonewalling" is not an easy task. NY Times understands this and preys on a specific segment of the population.
  - SllX 5y ago
    I don’t know. It’s 6 words and you don’t even have to be rude about it or get annoyed at the offers they throw at you. Then you get the confirmation email and you’re set.
    - vageli 5y ago
      They don't have the right to my attention. If they were to cancel my service due to lack of payment (for example), do you think they would engage me in a dialogue to discuss it or just send me a notice in the mail?
    - kelnos 5y ago
      I hate talking in the phone to people I don't know so intensely that I have wasted hundreds of dollars on various things because I procrastinated calling to cancel. This effect is real, and companies know it, and design their cancellation processes to extract extra money from people.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
ceejayoz 5y ago
Even better, when I had to cancel my NYT subscription, it said there weren't enough cancellation reps to connect me; "try again later". I went in via the normal support chat, said I wanted to cancel, and was immediately redirected to one. It was an outright lie.
- slownews45 5y ago
  Yep - and these are the SAME places posting LONG articles about how terrible Apple's store policies are. Uh, folks spend a lot on the apple store for a reason.
  - gbear605 5y ago
    The problem is how Apple both profits from the app store and sets rules on the app store. It’s incentivized to create rules that make it money without helping users. Apple needs to either stop making money from the app store or to create a separate body that can set rules without being incentivized by profit. Laws are good, but the lawmakers shouldn’t profit from them.
    - slownews45 5y ago
      Walmart profits from their store and sets the rules from their store. The incentive is to make the store a place people want to spend money. This is the same as almost any other store isn't it? You do that by making it safe and comfortable for users (or in androids case maybe by doing deals with phone companies to pre-load their apps and make money off users there ). Apple is only partly successful, they have 15% market share in phones or so. But one area they've been good at is trust - users on an iphone probably spend a lot more (it's also harder to pirate, so what developers give up in profits they make back in lack of pirating).
      - VectorMath 5y ago
        Except, as a seller, I have multiple avenues to deliver my product to customers other than Walmart. On top of that, Walmart charges a fee per sale [1], and doesn't get to double dip into additional services rendered on top of that product. As soon as the sale is done through Walmart, they're cut out of the picture. Could you imagine Walmart demanding a 30% cut of profits if I sell a video game with in-game purchases--just because they performed the task of stocking it on the shelf? [1] https://deliverr.com/blog/costs-of-selling-on-walmart-vs-amazon/ https://deliverr.com/blog/costs-of-selling-on-walmart-vs-ama...
tshaddox 5y ago
In California the New York Times still requires you to chat with a customer support person on their website. You still have to wait in queue, then wait for the person (or maybe it's a bot at this point) paste in several attempts at retaining your subscription. The law needs to be that you can cancel all recurring payments through a standard interface. It's ludicrous that my online banking account doesn't just show me all subscriptions and allow me to cancel all future payments of any of them.
- 8note 5y ago
  I should be able to tell my credit card company that I'm ending a subscription, and have them be in charge of notifying the provider that the subscription has been terminated
  - tshaddox 5y ago
    Or just reject the payment the next time they try, that would be fine by me.
  - jackson1442 5y ago
    I think my bank does this, when I called for another reason this week there was an option on the phone menu to stop a recurring payment.
    - 6nf 5y ago
      I've done this using my credit card company (not the bank) and they were very helpful. I explained why I wanted them to stop the recurring payment and they asked if I wanted to dispute any of the older charges, took less than 5 minutes. I call the 'fraud/disputes' phone number on the back of my card for this and I think that is not the bank, I think it's Visa / Mastercard themselves.
      - jackson1442 5y ago
        I bet processes like this are why subscriptions like gyms are starting to require your _bank account info_ rather than just a card.
arecurrence 5y ago
The Globe and Mail operates similarly. I spent some time while cancelling a few years ago informing them that making me call them to cancel is a crime in California. The person on the line cancelling my account was genuinely surprised. Canada was the first to require simple unsubscribe for email lists... I'm surprised it still does not have a law to require online unsubscribe for media subscriptions.
- murphyslab 5y ago
  > I'm surprised it still does not have a law to require online unsubscribe for media subscriptions. Newspaper editorial endorsements are still a big thing in Canada. > The Globe and Mail operates similarly. But this is good to know. I was considering swapping another newspaper subscription for a Globe and Mail subscription, but after looking into it, the eventual unsubscribe hassle isn't worth it.
dopu 5y ago
I signed up to NYT using a virtual CC, knowing how much of a pain it was to unsubscribe (I'm not in California). When I was through with it, I just paused the card. And I was amazed at how many times they tried charging it before giving up and actually cancelling the account. 13 times, now that I'm looking at it. The Gray Lady isn't as well-mannered as one might think.
d23 5y ago
I love privacy.com for this, and I’ll never sign up for a trial or something recurring without using it again. I signed up for a trial for another service which shall remain unnamed, and of course I couldn’t find anywhere on the site to cancel my trial once I wanted to. No problem, I just disabled the card. They’ve probably tried to bill me a dozen times since.
- hahajk 5y ago
  was it… stamps.com? adobe? wsj? a gym? Privacy.com is free, but I’d pay quite a bit of money for it, it has saved me hundreds of dollars.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- bin_bash 5y ago
  There are some less scrupulous sites that ban privacy.com cards. Dallas Morning News is a recent one I ran into.
  - bgeeek 5y ago
    I hadn't heard of privacy.com cards, but that thought had crossed my mind. What is to stop organisations simply banning privacy.com cards?
    - bin_bash 5y ago
      We’ll technically I don’t think they’re able to, but they can ban prepaid cards which I think is how they’re classified.
boplicity 5y ago
As a side note, I got a subscription to the online edition of the NY Times included with my local newspaper. When I cancelled my local newspaper subscription, the NY Times access was never removed, meaning I have free access to the Times. I've told them about this issue several times, and they acknowledged it, and yet, I still have free access to everything. My account says I'm a "subscriber." So, apparently , it is sometimes just as hard to stop getting something for free.
Shank 5y ago
I used a Privacy card and NYT did a “force post” [0] after they got a decline. I contacted Privacy and this is apparently a per se violation of the Visa rules, so they opened a dispute and I won. But NYT actually tried to charge me despite me trying to cancel, and I live in CA, and the card was blocked in Privacy. [0]: https://support.privacy.com/hc/en-us/articles/360012288214-Force-posts https://support.privacy.com/hc/en-us/articles/360012288214-F...

by madars 5y ago

ribosometronome 5y ago

Do any banks do a good job offering this feature for debit? Back in one of the days, the PayPal TOOLBAR used to offer this feature, it was really convenient since you were essentially direct drawing from your bank account with it.

electroly 5y ago

If you use PayPal to pay for NYT, you can cancel via PayPal and never speak to anyone.

jmknoll 5y ago

If you have a credit card with capital one, they provide a browser extension for generating and managing virtual numbers which works like a charm. I’ve been happily using it for all online purchases for the past couple of years. No need to worry about merchants charging for cancelled subscriptions, and if a service has implemented any dark patterns in their unsubscribe process, I just kill the virtual number and let it resolve itself, rather than needing to worry about it.

hashmymustache 5y ago

That’s every newspaper online. And gym memberships. And many others. Easy to get, pain in the ass to end.

ahefner 5y ago
I had no difficulty unsubscribing from The Washington Post.

core-utility 5y ago

That's my biggest use case for Privacy.com. I care less about the privacy aspect and more about the convenience. I've already had once instance where a single-use card I created for 1 specific vendor started getting fraudulent hits (declines) and all I had to do was delete that card.

JumpCrisscross 5y ago
> all I had to do was delete that card Careful. If you didn’t properly terminate the contract, you still owe that money. I have a friend whose credit got hit because a service sold his debt to a collector.
- core-utility 5y ago
  Thanks, good to note. In this case, they were declined transactions (nothing that went through) so it was only a tip-off to something fishy.
tlogan 5y ago
Be careful. You are still on the hook. And in many cases companies will sell you debt to collection agencies.
- abnercoimbre 5y ago
  Long-time Privacy.com user. You'll typically be OK with streaming services, newspapers, and mobile / web apps. Definitely be careful with gyms, insurance companies, and any service that sends out invoices (instead of calling it a monthly subscription.)

SllX 5y ago

I dunno. I cancelled the other day now that I no longer care about the pandemic data and it was basically just three minutes of politely stonewalling in a chat box saying “No Thanks, please cancel my subscription.” a couple of times. I live in California and would have tried cancelling online but actually couldn’t find the option. I can’t say it was difficult to cancel though once I picked a process and initiated it. Maybe that was the online option now that I think about it? I was expecting a button or link.

gmadsen 5y ago
I did the same a few years ago and it was relatively painless, however there are many people that do not like confrontation and "stonewalling" is not an easy task. NY Times understands this and preys on a specific segment of the population.
- SllX 5y ago
  I don’t know. It’s 6 words and you don’t even have to be rude about it or get annoyed at the offers they throw at you. Then you get the confirmation email and you’re set.
  - vageli 5y ago
    They don't have the right to my attention. If they were to cancel my service due to lack of payment (for example), do you think they would engage me in a dialogue to discuss it or just send me a notice in the mail?
  - kelnos 5y ago
    I hate talking in the phone to people I don't know so intensely that I have wasted hundreds of dollars on various things because I procrastinated calling to cancel. This effect is real, and companies know it, and design their cancellation processes to extract extra money from people.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]

ceejayoz 5y ago

Even better, when I had to cancel my NYT subscription, it said there weren't enough cancellation reps to connect me; "try again later". I went in via the normal support chat, said I wanted to cancel, and was immediately redirected to one. It was an outright lie.

slownews45 5y ago
Yep - and these are the SAME places posting LONG articles about how terrible Apple's store policies are. Uh, folks spend a lot on the apple store for a reason.
- gbear605 5y ago
  The problem is how Apple both profits from the app store and sets rules on the app store. It’s incentivized to create rules that make it money without helping users. Apple needs to either stop making money from the app store or to create a separate body that can set rules without being incentivized by profit. Laws are good, but the lawmakers shouldn’t profit from them.
  - slownews45 5y ago
    Walmart profits from their store and sets the rules from their store. The incentive is to make the store a place people want to spend money. This is the same as almost any other store isn't it? You do that by making it safe and comfortable for users (or in androids case maybe by doing deals with phone companies to pre-load their apps and make money off users there ). Apple is only partly successful, they have 15% market share in phones or so. But one area they've been good at is trust - users on an iphone probably spend a lot more (it's also harder to pirate, so what developers give up in profits they make back in lack of pirating).
    - VectorMath 5y ago
      Except, as a seller, I have multiple avenues to deliver my product to customers other than Walmart. On top of that, Walmart charges a fee per sale [1], and doesn't get to double dip into additional services rendered on top of that product. As soon as the sale is done through Walmart, they're cut out of the picture. Could you imagine Walmart demanding a 30% cut of profits if I sell a video game with in-game purchases--just because they performed the task of stocking it on the shelf? [1] https://deliverr.com/blog/costs-of-selling-on-walmart-vs-amazon/ https://deliverr.com/blog/costs-of-selling-on-walmart-vs-ama...

tshaddox 5y ago

In California the New York Times still requires you to chat with a customer support person on their website. You still have to wait in queue, then wait for the person (or maybe it's a bot at this point) paste in several attempts at retaining your subscription. The law needs to be that you can cancel all recurring payments through a standard interface. It's ludicrous that my online banking account doesn't just show me all subscriptions and allow me to cancel all future payments of any of them.

8note 5y ago
I should be able to tell my credit card company that I'm ending a subscription, and have them be in charge of notifying the provider that the subscription has been terminated
- tshaddox 5y ago
  Or just reject the payment the next time they try, that would be fine by me.
- jackson1442 5y ago
  I think my bank does this, when I called for another reason this week there was an option on the phone menu to stop a recurring payment.
  - 6nf 5y ago
    I've done this using my credit card company (not the bank) and they were very helpful. I explained why I wanted them to stop the recurring payment and they asked if I wanted to dispute any of the older charges, took less than 5 minutes. I call the 'fraud/disputes' phone number on the back of my card for this and I think that is not the bank, I think it's Visa / Mastercard themselves.
    - jackson1442 5y ago
      I bet processes like this are why subscriptions like gyms are starting to require your _bank account info_ rather than just a card.

arecurrence 5y ago

The Globe and Mail operates similarly. I spent some time while cancelling a few years ago informing them that making me call them to cancel is a crime in California. The person on the line cancelling my account was genuinely surprised. Canada was the first to require simple unsubscribe for email lists... I'm surprised it still does not have a law to require online unsubscribe for media subscriptions.

murphyslab 5y ago
> I'm surprised it still does not have a law to require online unsubscribe for media subscriptions. Newspaper editorial endorsements are still a big thing in Canada. > The Globe and Mail operates similarly. But this is good to know. I was considering swapping another newspaper subscription for a Globe and Mail subscription, but after looking into it, the eventual unsubscribe hassle isn't worth it.

dopu 5y ago

I signed up to NYT using a virtual CC, knowing how much of a pain it was to unsubscribe (I'm not in California). When I was through with it, I just paused the card. And I was amazed at how many times they tried charging it before giving up and actually cancelling the account. 13 times, now that I'm looking at it. The Gray Lady isn't as well-mannered as one might think.

d23 5y ago

I love privacy.com for this, and I’ll never sign up for a trial or something recurring without using it again. I signed up for a trial for another service which shall remain unnamed, and of course I couldn’t find anywhere on the site to cancel my trial once I wanted to. No problem, I just disabled the card. They’ve probably tried to bill me a dozen times since.

hahajk 5y ago
was it… stamps.com? adobe? wsj? a gym? Privacy.com is free, but I’d pay quite a bit of money for it, it has saved me hundreds of dollars.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
bin_bash 5y ago
There are some less scrupulous sites that ban privacy.com cards. Dallas Morning News is a recent one I ran into.
- bgeeek 5y ago
  I hadn't heard of privacy.com cards, but that thought had crossed my mind. What is to stop organisations simply banning privacy.com cards?
  - bin_bash 5y ago
    We’ll technically I don’t think they’re able to, but they can ban prepaid cards which I think is how they’re classified.

boplicity 5y ago

As a side note, I got a subscription to the online edition of the NY Times included with my local newspaper. When I cancelled my local newspaper subscription, the NY Times access was never removed, meaning I have free access to the Times. I've told them about this issue several times, and they acknowledged it, and yet, I still have free access to everything. My account says I'm a "subscriber." So, apparently , it is sometimes just as hard to stop getting something for free.

Shank 5y ago

I used a Privacy card and NYT did a “force post” [0] after they got a decline. I contacted Privacy and this is apparently a per se violation of the Visa rules, so they opened a dispute and I won. But NYT actually tried to charge me despite me trying to cancel, and I live in CA, and the card was blocked in Privacy. [0]: https://support.privacy.com/hc/en-us/articles/360012288214-Force-posts https://support.privacy.com/hc/en-us/articles/360012288214-F...