6 ms·

There's a lot of doom and gloom here; let's see if it really got that bad. >You need a PD charger and not a QC charger... Impossible, all USB-C QC chargers ar

There's a lot of doom and gloom here; let's see if it really got that bad. >You need a PD charger and not a QC charger... Impossible, all USB-C QC chargers are also USB PD chargers. >into the correct usb port to charge the laptop The port is either marked (everything but MacBooks) or doesn't matter (MacBooks, pretty sweet). >buy an original charger for your laptop Good! Now you have a USB PD charger that covers your laptop and also every device you own that's lighter in wattage. Less chargers to pack when travelling :) >you're back at where we were 20 years ago No, not at all. 20 to 10 years ago all charging ports (including on cameras, phones, everything) were barrel plugs of slightly different diameter; everybody's cranking out their own boxy black chargers putting out maddening variations on the same ~20V for laptops and 3-5V for smaller devices, you can't share chargers between devices, can't always find the replacement, especially if the device is on the older side. Buying a device with a different connector - bam, old charger goes to e-waste (or e-bay). >but it won't charge. You need a fast charger... EU makes it mandatory to say on the packaging what wattage the device needs, and what wattage the chager can provide. Granted, the laptops are not covered by the EU proposition in question yet, but have patience, we don't now have those 240W chargers for nothing :)

Ginden 5y ago
> were barrel plugs of slightly different diameter Some of them had the same diameter, so accidentally plugging 12V to 5V port could fry your device.
- thermin 5y ago
  True! I literally own two identical-looking (to the most minute details of the plug itself) barrel plug chargers (one for the vacuum, the other for the elliptical trainer). One is 18V, the other is 9V, both 500mA At least I'm not afraid that the 65W USB PD charger will fry my phone lol
  - function_seven 5y ago
    I think I can one-up you :) Many years ago I had two Linksys devices. A router and an access point. They were both that blue and gray chassis style. (Like the original WRT54G, except these both predated that model). They had the same size barrel connector. I was fumbling around under my desk getting everything connected when I let the magic smoke out of one of them. Turns out I gave the 9V unit 18V from the other’s wall wart. That may also have been the day I learned the phrase “magic smoke”
    - thermin 5y ago
      TIL the phrase "magical smoke" :) Never were much into electrical engineering, to my own chagrin.
  - citrusybread 5y ago
    should absolutely be illegal. usually barrel plugs are coded for each voltage. I can one up you. Verilux sells a "happy light" SAD lamp thing, still sold at Costco, which uses a mini-USB plug, running on 19V 300mA or something. Yeah. How the FUCK does the USB Forum not shut that down?
    - thermin 5y ago
      OMG, have you tried to charge it from a sane 5V charger?
dionian 5y ago
Plus USB-C doesn't require a correct orientation, you just put it in and it always fits. Maybe underrated but to me it's worth a lot...
- david422 5y ago
  I have some USB C chargers that only charge in 1 orientation. I don't know if it's my phone, or the cable, or what, but for me this isn't true.
  - kps 5y ago
    Same is true of Apple's Lightning. It looks symmetrical, but electrically it isn't.
    - cromka 5y ago
      > Same is true of Apple's Lightning. It looks symmetrical, but electrically it isn't. Have you every used an Apple product? Because if you did you'd know that it doesn't matter which direction you plug it in. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_(connector) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_(connector) "The male Lightning connector is symmetrical (same pins on either side), so it can be inserted into a female Lightning port in either orientation."
      - jaywalk 5y ago
        From an end user's point of view, there is no difference in the orientation. But from the device's point of view, one orientation has pins 1-8 and the other has pins 8-1. It's up to the device to figure out which is being used. This is still considered symmetrical though.
      - kps 5y ago
        It's not, though. https://www.techinsights.com/blog/systems-analysis-apple-lightning-usb-cable https://www.techinsights.com/blog/systems-analysis-apple-lig...
OJFord 5y ago
> >into the correct usb port to charge the laptop > The port is either marked (everything but MacBooks) or doesn't matter (MacBooks, pretty sweet). From https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/363337/how-to-find-cause-of-high-kernel-task-cpu-usage/363933#363933 https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/363337/how-to-find...: > TLDR; If your MacBook Pro runs hot or shows a high % CPU for the kernel task, try charging on the right and not on the left.
- thermin 5y ago
  That's quite insane, thanks Tim Apple.
- unethical_ban 5y ago
  While that is a frustrating bug/design flaw, it doesn't negate the fact that you can charge the laptop from any port.
  - OJFord 5y ago
    Sure, I suppose my point is just further along the lines of 'even if all the ports are the same, they don't necessarily work the same' since it turns out that even if they seem to/say they do, there can still be such differences. IMO if it's to be optional to implement the 'receive' side of USB-PD (or QC? Whatever it is) then it should use an extra pin, so a PD cable physically can't fit in a non-PD port. And the ends opposite, so that the PD-pin-having transformer plug won't fit a non-PD cable. (I don't really want that though, I'd rather it was just required to support it. So it's all the same and we can properly live the one-connector dream.)
SketchySeaBeast 5y ago
Not taking exception to any of your points - honestly, I think that while this new USB world is confusing, it is much better than it was in the day of the barrel plugs, especially not that everything is becoming USB-C. Just taking exception to this one point: > The port is either marked (everything but MacBooks) or doesn't matter (MacBooks, pretty sweet). Except that even when there shouldn't be a right choice, there still is: https://www.extremetech.com/computing/309802-charging-a-macbook-on-the-wrong-side-can-significantly-lower-its-performance https://www.extremetech.com/computing/309802-charging-a-macb...
- dspillett 5y ago
  Direct link to the SO post and answer that the extremetech page paraphrases, for those who don't consent to being tracked left/right/centre and would prefer not to click hundreds of times to say so: https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/363337/how-to-find-cause-of-high-kernel-task-cpu-usage/363933#363933 https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/363337/how-to-find...
  - yarcob 5y ago
    Summary for people who don't want to click a link: Some MacBook Pros get very hot when you use the USB-C ports on the left side for charging.
  - SketchySeaBeast 5y ago
    Yeah, that is a better link for the technical stuff, but you seem to imply it's clean when it comes to tracking and it's obviously not.
    - dspillett 5y ago
      Fair point, I could have made the effort to make that clear, but it is far far far less _un_clean if you care at all about such things. Two clicks to opt-out of everything¹ compared to tens, some of which include needing to visit the parter separately to opt-out there, and even then it is not complete because some simply marked “this partner does not provide an opt-out”. ExtremeTech: welcome to my DNS blacklist. [¹] assuming you trust it to actually opt you out properly, of course
ajsnigrutin 5y ago
> Impossible, all USB-C QC chargers are also USB PD chargers. You have a lot of USB-A QC chargers, and you just take a usb A -> C cable. [0] > The port is either marked (everything but MacBooks) or doesn't matter (MacBooks, pretty sweet). https://p3-ofp.static.pub/fes/cms/2021/07/01/5q6w49cnwh2ka55u379paelzsghy6s114438.jpg https://p3-ofp.static.pub/fes/cms/2021/07/01/5q6w49cnwh2ka55... So... do I tell my grandma to plug it into the "weird robot"-symbol port (5), or the "danger, high voltage" one (6)? It fits into both. > No, not at all. 20 to 10 years ago all charging ports (including on cameras, phones, everything) were barrel plugs of slightly different diameter; everybody's cranking out their own boxy black chargers putting out maddening variations on the same ~20V for laptops and 3-5V for smaller devices, you can't share chargers between devices, can't always find the replacement, especially if the device is on the older side. Buying a device with a different connector - bam, old charger goes to e-waste (or e-bay). This is not really true... Some laptops maybe... Lenovo had a square one ( https://www.amazon.com/Converter-Charger-Adapter-ThinkPad-Universal/dp/B07NZ87LKX https://www.amazon.com/Converter-Charger-Adapter-ThinkPad-Un... ) for example. Phones had all the custom ones... ericsson examples: https://www.amazon.com/Charger-Cable-Ericsson-C510i-C702i/dp/B083ZVV7B2 https://www.amazon.com/Charger-Cable-Ericsson-C510i-C702i/dp... https://www.navigation-accessoires.com/en/sony-ericsson/p-series/p900/ac-adapter-charger-for-sony-ericsson-p900.php https://www.navigation-accessoires.com/en/sony-ericsson/p-se... Either way, you brought one device + one cable, and you know where to plug it. Yes, from an average tech nerd perspective, this might be better, because people know and remember what to use where, which protocol their devices use, and which port they have to plug it in. Normal users don't.. and if it fits, they use it like that. If they buy a custom charger for their laptop, they won't use it to charge their phone, because they know their phone charger won't charge their laptop, even though everything fits. I'm not saying it's all bad, but dealing with several older relatives, and stuff that fits and doesn't work is making it a pain in the ass, especially with stores selling stuff (eg ikeas https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/askstorm-40w-usb-charger-dark-gray-80461200/ https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/askstorm-40w-usb-charger-dark-g... ) that works but doesn't charge if under heavy use. [0] https://www.amazon.com/Charge-Charger-Portable-Adapter-Foldable/dp/B07RM9HM2B/ref=sr_1_8?dchild=1&keywords=usb+qc3&qid=1633362190&sr=8-8 https://www.amazon.com/Charge-Charger-Portable-Adapter-Folda...
- 5y ago
dreamcompiler 5y ago
> Impossible, all USB-C QC chargers are also USB PD chargers. But the reverse is not true: All USB PD chargers are not QC chargers. Some are, but not all. I admit this is not a huge problem because QC is fading away and it merely means that some older equipment won't charge with a newer charger, but the issue does exist.

Ginden 5y ago

> were barrel plugs of slightly different diameter Some of them had the same diameter, so accidentally plugging 12V to 5V port could fry your device.

thermin 5y ago
True! I literally own two identical-looking (to the most minute details of the plug itself) barrel plug chargers (one for the vacuum, the other for the elliptical trainer). One is 18V, the other is 9V, both 500mA At least I'm not afraid that the 65W USB PD charger will fry my phone lol
- function_seven 5y ago
  I think I can one-up you :) Many years ago I had two Linksys devices. A router and an access point. They were both that blue and gray chassis style. (Like the original WRT54G, except these both predated that model). They had the same size barrel connector. I was fumbling around under my desk getting everything connected when I let the magic smoke out of one of them. Turns out I gave the 9V unit 18V from the other’s wall wart. That may also have been the day I learned the phrase “magic smoke”
  - thermin 5y ago
    TIL the phrase "magical smoke" :) Never were much into electrical engineering, to my own chagrin.
- citrusybread 5y ago
  should absolutely be illegal. usually barrel plugs are coded for each voltage. I can one up you. Verilux sells a "happy light" SAD lamp thing, still sold at Costco, which uses a mini-USB plug, running on 19V 300mA or something. Yeah. How the FUCK does the USB Forum not shut that down?
  - thermin 5y ago
    OMG, have you tried to charge it from a sane 5V charger?

dionian 5y ago

Plus USB-C doesn't require a correct orientation, you just put it in and it always fits. Maybe underrated but to me it's worth a lot...

david422 5y ago
I have some USB C chargers that only charge in 1 orientation. I don't know if it's my phone, or the cable, or what, but for me this isn't true.
- kps 5y ago
  Same is true of Apple's Lightning. It looks symmetrical, but electrically it isn't.
  - cromka 5y ago
    > Same is true of Apple's Lightning. It looks symmetrical, but electrically it isn't. Have you every used an Apple product? Because if you did you'd know that it doesn't matter which direction you plug it in. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_(connector) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightning_(connector) "The male Lightning connector is symmetrical (same pins on either side), so it can be inserted into a female Lightning port in either orientation."
    - jaywalk 5y ago
      From an end user's point of view, there is no difference in the orientation. But from the device's point of view, one orientation has pins 1-8 and the other has pins 8-1. It's up to the device to figure out which is being used. This is still considered symmetrical though.
    - kps 5y ago
      It's not, though. https://www.techinsights.com/blog/systems-analysis-apple-lightning-usb-cable https://www.techinsights.com/blog/systems-analysis-apple-lig...

OJFord 5y ago

> >into the correct usb port to charge the laptop > The port is either marked (everything but MacBooks) or doesn't matter (MacBooks, pretty sweet). From https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/363337/how-to-find-cause-of-high-kernel-task-cpu-usage/363933#363933 https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/363337/how-to-find...: > TLDR; If your MacBook Pro runs hot or shows a high % CPU for the kernel task, try charging on the right and not on the left.

thermin 5y ago
That's quite insane, thanks Tim Apple.
unethical_ban 5y ago
While that is a frustrating bug/design flaw, it doesn't negate the fact that you can charge the laptop from any port.
- OJFord 5y ago
  Sure, I suppose my point is just further along the lines of 'even if all the ports are the same, they don't necessarily work the same' since it turns out that even if they seem to/say they do, there can still be such differences. IMO if it's to be optional to implement the 'receive' side of USB-PD (or QC? Whatever it is) then it should use an extra pin, so a PD cable physically can't fit in a non-PD port. And the ends opposite, so that the PD-pin-having transformer plug won't fit a non-PD cable. (I don't really want that though, I'd rather it was just required to support it. So it's all the same and we can properly live the one-connector dream.)

SketchySeaBeast 5y ago

Not taking exception to any of your points - honestly, I think that while this new USB world is confusing, it is much better than it was in the day of the barrel plugs, especially not that everything is becoming USB-C. Just taking exception to this one point: > The port is either marked (everything but MacBooks) or doesn't matter (MacBooks, pretty sweet). Except that even when there shouldn't be a right choice, there still is: https://www.extremetech.com/computing/309802-charging-a-macbook-on-the-wrong-side-can-significantly-lower-its-performance https://www.extremetech.com/computing/309802-charging-a-macb...

dspillett 5y ago
Direct link to the SO post and answer that the extremetech page paraphrases, for those who don't consent to being tracked left/right/centre and would prefer not to click hundreds of times to say so: https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/363337/how-to-find-cause-of-high-kernel-task-cpu-usage/363933#363933 https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/363337/how-to-find...
- yarcob 5y ago
  Summary for people who don't want to click a link: Some MacBook Pros get very hot when you use the USB-C ports on the left side for charging.
- SketchySeaBeast 5y ago
  Yeah, that is a better link for the technical stuff, but you seem to imply it's clean when it comes to tracking and it's obviously not.
  - dspillett 5y ago
    Fair point, I could have made the effort to make that clear, but it is far far far less _un_clean if you care at all about such things. Two clicks to opt-out of everything¹ compared to tens, some of which include needing to visit the parter separately to opt-out there, and even then it is not complete because some simply marked “this partner does not provide an opt-out”. ExtremeTech: welcome to my DNS blacklist. [¹] assuming you trust it to actually opt you out properly, of course

ajsnigrutin 5y ago

> Impossible, all USB-C QC chargers are also USB PD chargers. You have a lot of USB-A QC chargers, and you just take a usb A -> C cable. [0] > The port is either marked (everything but MacBooks) or doesn't matter (MacBooks, pretty sweet). https://p3-ofp.static.pub/fes/cms/2021/07/01/5q6w49cnwh2ka55u379paelzsghy6s114438.jpg https://p3-ofp.static.pub/fes/cms/2021/07/01/5q6w49cnwh2ka55... So... do I tell my grandma to plug it into the "weird robot"-symbol port (5), or the "danger, high voltage" one (6)? It fits into both. > No, not at all. 20 to 10 years ago all charging ports (including on cameras, phones, everything) were barrel plugs of slightly different diameter; everybody's cranking out their own boxy black chargers putting out maddening variations on the same ~20V for laptops and 3-5V for smaller devices, you can't share chargers between devices, can't always find the replacement, especially if the device is on the older side. Buying a device with a different connector - bam, old charger goes to e-waste (or e-bay). This is not really true... Some laptops maybe... Lenovo had a square one ( https://www.amazon.com/Converter-Charger-Adapter-ThinkPad-Universal/dp/B07NZ87LKX https://www.amazon.com/Converter-Charger-Adapter-ThinkPad-Un... ) for example. Phones had all the custom ones... ericsson examples: https://www.amazon.com/Charger-Cable-Ericsson-C510i-C702i/dp/B083ZVV7B2 https://www.amazon.com/Charger-Cable-Ericsson-C510i-C702i/dp... https://www.navigation-accessoires.com/en/sony-ericsson/p-series/p900/ac-adapter-charger-for-sony-ericsson-p900.php https://www.navigation-accessoires.com/en/sony-ericsson/p-se... Either way, you brought one device + one cable, and you know where to plug it. Yes, from an average tech nerd perspective, this might be better, because people know and remember what to use where, which protocol their devices use, and which port they have to plug it in. Normal users don't.. and if it fits, they use it like that. If they buy a custom charger for their laptop, they won't use it to charge their phone, because they know their phone charger won't charge their laptop, even though everything fits. I'm not saying it's all bad, but dealing with several older relatives, and stuff that fits and doesn't work is making it a pain in the ass, especially with stores selling stuff (eg ikeas https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/askstorm-40w-usb-charger-dark-gray-80461200/ https://www.ikea.com/us/en/p/askstorm-40w-usb-charger-dark-g... ) that works but doesn't charge if under heavy use. [0] https://www.amazon.com/Charge-Charger-Portable-Adapter-Foldable/dp/B07RM9HM2B/ref=sr_1_8?dchild=1&keywords=usb+qc3&qid=1633362190&sr=8-8 https://www.amazon.com/Charge-Charger-Portable-Adapter-Folda...

5y ago

dreamcompiler 5y ago

> Impossible, all USB-C QC chargers are also USB PD chargers. But the reverse is not true: All USB PD chargers are not QC chargers. Some are, but not all. I admit this is not a huge problem because QC is fading away and it merely means that some older equipment won't charge with a newer charger, but the issue does exist.