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Will you address point (2)? Bed capacity is mostly a synonym for worker capacity. When people talk about hospitals being "full" they don't mean literally physi
by native_samples 5y ago
Will you address point (2)?
Bed capacity is mostly a synonym for worker capacity. When people talk about hospitals being "full" they don't mean literally physically full - that's why the emergency hospitals that were built never got used even though the press keep telling you that hospitals are overflowing. Here's a random recent example of such an article:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/covid-vaccine-mandate-hospitals-virginia/2021/10/01/b7976d16-21ff-11ec-8200-5e3fd4c49f5e_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/covid-vaccine-mandate-h...
"Across the country, health-care systems that have instituted mandates have seen some workers leave or be terminated over their refusal to get the shot, exacerbating a shortage in skilled nursing and bedside care."
Another: https://www.reuters.com/world/us/new-york-hospitals-face-staff-shortages-vaccine-mandate-kicks-2021-09-27/ https://www.reuters.com/world/us/new-york-hospitals-face-sta...
"NEW YORK, Sept 27 (Reuters) - New York hospitals on Monday began firing or suspending healthcare workers for defying a state order to get the COVID-19 vaccine, and resulting staff shortages prompted some hospitals to postpone elective surgeries or curtail services ... Erie County Medical Center in Buffalo suspended elective inpatient surgeries and had stopped accepting intensive-care patients from other hospitals as it prepares to fire hundreds of unvaccinated employees, a spokesman Peter Cutler said."
Note: before they were OK, accepting ICU patients and doing elective surgeries. After: they can't handle electives or ICU intake anymore. That isn't being caused by unvaccinated people getting so sick they're flooding out all the other operations, it's caused by hospitals being forced to shed staff.
At any rate, isolated hospitals can easily run out of staffed beds for many reasons and this is a phenomenon that predates COVID. That's why there are stories about overflowing hospitals from the flu in pre-COVID years. As the article notes there were already problems but this is now making it worse.
So staffing levels are not genuinely a COVID problem, let alone an unvaccinated COVID problem. If it were true that unvaccinated COVID = overflow then it'd be the case everywhere. Look at the Swiss dashboard:
https://www.covid19.admin.ch/en/hosp-capacity/total https://www.covid19.admin.ch/en/hosp-capacity/total
COVID utilization is low during the entire pandemic, with ~25% at its peak (but still lots of spare beds, i.e. a lot of these cases are infections of people already there for something else). There has never been a time throughout the whole two years when there wasn't plenty of spare capacity - in fact they've been reducing the number of beds allocated to ICU during 2021 because the level of nursing care required for them is expensive.
Now look at vaccination rate on the same dashboard. Only 64% of the population has even taken one dose. Yet, the hospitals are fine and there are thousands of free beds. There is nothing magical about the Swiss people or hospitals. You can find similar graphs for US regions, I think (I am just less familiar with them). Rather, looking at the raw data tells a very different story to what the press and governments are telling.
- bellyfullofbac 5y agoApples and oranges much? Nowadays Switzerland requires digitally signed vaccinated/recovered/tested certificates before you go into a lot of places (bars, restaurants, clubs), meanwhile in the red states, where the infection rates are the worst currently, some governments are even banning such restrictions. So, are you pro restrictions for the unvaccinated, and pro control of public events with such certificates, then? Also, to clarify, those thousands of free beds in Switzerland are not ICU beds, they don't even have 1000 ICU beds in total: https://www.covid19.admin.ch/en/hosp-capacity/icu https://www.covid19.admin.ch/en/hosp-capacity/icu . So, don't confuse those 2 either.
- native_samples 5y agoNo, the vaccine passes are recent and have made no impact. That is visible in the graphs. Nor can they, given that vaccinated people still get sick and spread it. Regardless it's irrelevant to my point: the hospital system was never even close to being collapsed or overwhelmed, even though it's the same virus everywhere. Obviously I know the graphs are total capacity and not ICU. I even mentioned that. The point is identical if considering ICU beds. I guess the answer is no, you won't answer point (2).