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That's not what news reports say outside the tame media of the UK's "managed democracy". https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/01/opinion/britain-fuel-crisis-johnson

by danjac 5y ago

That's not what news reports say outside the tame media of the UK's "managed democracy". https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/01/opinion/britain-fuel-crisis-johnson.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/01/opinion/britain-fuel-cris...

neilsense 5y ago
Ah, yes, the NYT, for when you really want the truth...
- danjac 5y ago
  The NYT does not have an axe to grind with Brexit, an issue for a foreign country. Even when it does have an axe to grind, it's default flex is "to both sides" an issue to the point of parody. Yet even the NYT can see the elephant in the room the UK media refuses to address. Don't trust the NYT? https://www.vox.com/22700343/uk-fuel-crisis-brexit-covid-19-european-union https://www.vox.com/22700343/uk-fuel-crisis-brexit-covid-19-... https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/28/business/brexit-fuel-food-shortages/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/28/business/brexit-fuel-food... https://www.indiatoday.in/business/story/uk-fuel-crisis-chaos-at-gas-stations-petrol-pumps-explained-1858208-2021-09-28 https://www.indiatoday.in/business/story/uk-fuel-crisis-chao...
  - Veen 5y ago
    The New York Times has consistently awful UK coverage. And it certainly has an anti-Tory Remainer bias. Personally, I think the shortage is related to Brexit, and it's a short-term consequence of not being able to import cheap foreign labour instead of paying reasonable wages. We do have a driver shortage because haulage firms don't want to pay drivers a competitive salary. Plus, COVID disrupted driver testing and the issuing of new licenses. Plus, some in the media over-egged the problem and created panic buying. It's a multi-cause issue.
    - sofixa 5y ago
      > And it certainly has an anti-Tory Remainer bias And so does reality. Brexit, recent Tory governments are mismanaged unmitigated disasters. Is there anything broadly positive that can be said of them? Vaccination was decently managed, that's for sure.
      - Veen 5y ago
        What do you expect me to say in response? You've stated that your opinion is the only realistic appraisal of the situation. That implies we don't merely disagree in our intepretation of events, but that you understand reality and I am deluded. We can't have a polite disagreement among equals because "reality" is on your side and not mine. Why would I bother to talk to someone who thinks like that?
        sofixa 5y ago
        I'm not trying to convince you, i'm merely stating that it's incredibly hard to look at the Tories and Brexit and come out with positive things to say. If that doesn't match your opinion, i highly doubt you'd reconsider based on an online discussion. Anyone who can overlook everything they've failed at ( be it on a diplomatic, personal or whatever level) - just the corrupt crony contracts they gave for the emergency Brexit ferries or NHS emergency supplies at the beginning at the pandemic and their violation of just signed international agreements by them would be game over for me - either sees things very differently ( e.g. agrees with their generic policies and is willing to accept utter clowns failing at being even remotely competent) or is too stupid/brainwashed/naive/etc. to even consider the reality. I can somewhat understand the first one, but neither can be changed IMHO. And i don't actually care, it's not my country, it's one that's really trying to distance itself from mine, so goodspeed to them. And note, i'm not in any way saying the other UK parties are somewhat better or would do a better job, i don't have a serious opinion on them. But that does in no way excuse the clown car crash.
        ashtonkem 5y ago
        One can have their own opinion on whether brexit should have happened, but it’s extremely hard to argue that the tories haven’t been handling this poorly.
  - bb123 5y ago
    The NYT is famous for having consistently hyperbolic negative coverage of things in the U.K. Edit: sources for those who don’t believe me: What’s the New York Times’s problem with Britain? https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/what-s-the-new-york-times-s-problem-with-britain- https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/what-s-the-new-york-time... The New York Times’ bizarre campaign against Britain https://unherd.com/2020/01/what-has-the-new-york-times-got-against-britain/ https://unherd.com/2020/01/what-has-the-new-york-times-got-a... The New York Times is junk.
    - meigwilym 5y ago
      Both of those have a right-leaning bias, The Spectator in particular. Do you have any other sources?
    - n4r9 5y ago
      For context, these are both right-leaning sources attacking the NYT for having negative coverage of right-leaning politics.
    - danjac 5y ago
      The New York Times may well be junk, but you're not helping your argument with articles from Unherd and Spectator, both notorious "rent-a-quote" right-wing rags of ill repute. Next you'll be quoting Spiked. I've also provided links from other sources if you find NYT unpalatable.

by danjac 5y ago

neilsense 5y ago

Ah, yes, the NYT, for when you really want the truth...

danjac 5y ago
The NYT does not have an axe to grind with Brexit, an issue for a foreign country. Even when it does have an axe to grind, it's default flex is "to both sides" an issue to the point of parody. Yet even the NYT can see the elephant in the room the UK media refuses to address. Don't trust the NYT? https://www.vox.com/22700343/uk-fuel-crisis-brexit-covid-19-european-union https://www.vox.com/22700343/uk-fuel-crisis-brexit-covid-19-... https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/28/business/brexit-fuel-food-shortages/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/28/business/brexit-fuel-food... https://www.indiatoday.in/business/story/uk-fuel-crisis-chaos-at-gas-stations-petrol-pumps-explained-1858208-2021-09-28 https://www.indiatoday.in/business/story/uk-fuel-crisis-chao...
- Veen 5y ago
  The New York Times has consistently awful UK coverage. And it certainly has an anti-Tory Remainer bias. Personally, I think the shortage is related to Brexit, and it's a short-term consequence of not being able to import cheap foreign labour instead of paying reasonable wages. We do have a driver shortage because haulage firms don't want to pay drivers a competitive salary. Plus, COVID disrupted driver testing and the issuing of new licenses. Plus, some in the media over-egged the problem and created panic buying. It's a multi-cause issue.
  - sofixa 5y ago
    > And it certainly has an anti-Tory Remainer bias And so does reality. Brexit, recent Tory governments are mismanaged unmitigated disasters. Is there anything broadly positive that can be said of them? Vaccination was decently managed, that's for sure.
    - Veen 5y ago
      What do you expect me to say in response? You've stated that your opinion is the only realistic appraisal of the situation. That implies we don't merely disagree in our intepretation of events, but that you understand reality and I am deluded. We can't have a polite disagreement among equals because "reality" is on your side and not mine. Why would I bother to talk to someone who thinks like that?
      - sofixa 5y ago
        I'm not trying to convince you, i'm merely stating that it's incredibly hard to look at the Tories and Brexit and come out with positive things to say. If that doesn't match your opinion, i highly doubt you'd reconsider based on an online discussion. Anyone who can overlook everything they've failed at ( be it on a diplomatic, personal or whatever level) - just the corrupt crony contracts they gave for the emergency Brexit ferries or NHS emergency supplies at the beginning at the pandemic and their violation of just signed international agreements by them would be game over for me - either sees things very differently ( e.g. agrees with their generic policies and is willing to accept utter clowns failing at being even remotely competent) or is too stupid/brainwashed/naive/etc. to even consider the reality. I can somewhat understand the first one, but neither can be changed IMHO. And i don't actually care, it's not my country, it's one that's really trying to distance itself from mine, so goodspeed to them. And note, i'm not in any way saying the other UK parties are somewhat better or would do a better job, i don't have a serious opinion on them. But that does in no way excuse the clown car crash.
      - ashtonkem 5y ago
        One can have their own opinion on whether brexit should have happened, but it’s extremely hard to argue that the tories haven’t been handling this poorly.
- bb123 5y ago
  The NYT is famous for having consistently hyperbolic negative coverage of things in the U.K. Edit: sources for those who don’t believe me: What’s the New York Times’s problem with Britain? https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/what-s-the-new-york-times-s-problem-with-britain- https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/what-s-the-new-york-time... The New York Times’ bizarre campaign against Britain https://unherd.com/2020/01/what-has-the-new-york-times-got-against-britain/ https://unherd.com/2020/01/what-has-the-new-york-times-got-a... The New York Times is junk.
  - meigwilym 5y ago
    Both of those have a right-leaning bias, The Spectator in particular. Do you have any other sources?
  - n4r9 5y ago
    For context, these are both right-leaning sources attacking the NYT for having negative coverage of right-leaning politics.
  - danjac 5y ago
    The New York Times may well be junk, but you're not helping your argument with articles from Unherd and Spectator, both notorious "rent-a-quote" right-wing rags of ill repute. Next you'll be quoting Spiked. I've also provided links from other sources if you find NYT unpalatable.