5 ms·

It saddens me that we live in a culture in which movies showing violence (including torture and murder) are acceptable, whereas ones showing consensual, non-por

by stared 5y ago

It saddens me that we live in a culture in which movies showing violence (including torture and murder) are acceptable, whereas ones showing consensual, non-pornographic intercourse - aren’t. You might argue that on Netflix every second movie have a lot of sex scenes. Yes, must mostly with partial or implied nudity (think of all of these scenes with sex with bra on, waking up clothed, or L-shaped sheets). At the same time there is no issue with explicit blood, gore, cut-off limbs, etc.

ravenstine 5y ago
And when we do show sex, it's in ways where it's always "complicated". Sex, according to the mainstream, must involve some sort of transgressive participation. You must be committing adultery, or be "in the closet", or committing incest, or doing it with total disregard for responsibilities, or doing it in inappropriate circumstances, or by committing rape. Unless you're watching a deliberately romantic film, I don't know how anyone can get a positive impression of sex or even associate sex with love by watching what's on streaming services.
- Koshkin 5y ago
  Would you find interesting a movie in which people shoot at cardboard figures instead of each other?
  - ravenstine 5y ago
    To suggest that films must feature graphic violence is like saying that comedy can't be funny unless it involves swearing.
    - Joeboy 5y ago
      No, but drama does require drama. People having a nice time together is not dramatic.
- Zababa 5y ago
  That's a different point. People don't show "normal" sex in movies for the same reasons they don't show people eating, going to the toilet and that sort of stuff.
  - Koshkin 5y ago
    > they don't show But they do! (And I agree with the general sentiment.)
  - ravenstine 5y ago
    You're taking my point to an extreme that obviously wasn't my intent. I never said that all sex in entertainment must be missionary position under sheets with the lights off between a Christian husband and wife. First of all, it's rather interesting that you equate sex to taking a shit. But also, what have you been watching to conclude that they don't show people eating on-screen? It's rather common, especially in film, to have characters eating real food. the primary reason it's not as frequent as in real life is because having actors eat food is actually a complicated thing to with multiple takes while maintaining continuity.
    - Zababa 5y ago
      > I never said that all sex in entertainment must be missionary position under sheets with the lights off between a Christian husband and wife. I don't think I've said that you said that either? My point was that they mostly show things that are relevant, and that since most movies focus on the extraordinary, regular sex is shown less and extraordinary sex is shown more. > First of all, it's rather interesting that you equate sex to taking a shit. Is it? I don't really see how. > But also, what have you been watching to conclude that they don't show people eating on-screen? It's rather common, especially in film, to have characters eating real food. the primary reason it's not as frequent as in real life is because having actors eat food is actually a complicated thing to with multiple takes while maintaining continuity. Again, food scenes are show when they are relevant. If you see a movie that happens on three days, you won't see people eat 9 times. You may see them eating once in the morning to show that the father doesn't have much time for his family, or something like that, but you won't see everything. The "ordinary stuff" is a small part of what happens in movies, because most movies aren't made to show it, they are made to show extreme things.
gmuslera 5y ago
More than just blood or gore: killing. It is normalized all across genres and cultures. Most times the "right" to kill comes from things that you can't possibly know, and you are the hero for doing so. And having a gun is a symbol of rightful power, like having money. And is not just the good boys killing, the bad boys more efficient doing so are shown surrounded by desirable things, power, money, women, charisma.
Koshkin 5y ago
Not just movies. It looks like most computer games, too, involve fighting and killing. I think there is something there that speaks to human nature.
quantified 5y ago
Right. I’d like to amplify this sentiment a bit. Killing, maiming, spilling blood and intestines, are all fine. So many examples. And yet two people making each other feel good in some way (whether horny release, tender support, making a baby, just fun) is immoral, unsuitable for “the children”, whatever. I think that there is a case for people to be moral. The moralizers who are ok with bloody torture and not sex as part of the human condition discredit the concept of moral teaching.
newby 5y ago
>> It saddens me that we live in a culture in which movies showing violence (including torture and murder) are acceptable, whereas ones showing consensual, non-pornographic intercourse - aren’t. I just remembered accidentally seeing the US version of the movie "Kingsman: The Secret Service". I was surprised that one scene was cut out - naked ass of a young woman. The scene of brutal massacre where dozens of people are killed and maimed was left there. I still do not get how this came to be. People usually talk about puritanism and such but this does not seem to explain it - why should any culture consider it desirable to watch brutality but not nudity or something sexual?

by stared 5y ago

ravenstine 5y ago

And when we do show sex, it's in ways where it's always "complicated". Sex, according to the mainstream, must involve some sort of transgressive participation. You must be committing adultery, or be "in the closet", or committing incest, or doing it with total disregard for responsibilities, or doing it in inappropriate circumstances, or by committing rape. Unless you're watching a deliberately romantic film, I don't know how anyone can get a positive impression of sex or even associate sex with love by watching what's on streaming services.

Koshkin 5y ago
Would you find interesting a movie in which people shoot at cardboard figures instead of each other?
- ravenstine 5y ago
  To suggest that films must feature graphic violence is like saying that comedy can't be funny unless it involves swearing.
  - Joeboy 5y ago
    No, but drama does require drama. People having a nice time together is not dramatic.
Zababa 5y ago
That's a different point. People don't show "normal" sex in movies for the same reasons they don't show people eating, going to the toilet and that sort of stuff.
- Koshkin 5y ago
  > they don't show But they do! (And I agree with the general sentiment.)
- ravenstine 5y ago
  You're taking my point to an extreme that obviously wasn't my intent. I never said that all sex in entertainment must be missionary position under sheets with the lights off between a Christian husband and wife. First of all, it's rather interesting that you equate sex to taking a shit. But also, what have you been watching to conclude that they don't show people eating on-screen? It's rather common, especially in film, to have characters eating real food. the primary reason it's not as frequent as in real life is because having actors eat food is actually a complicated thing to with multiple takes while maintaining continuity.
  - Zababa 5y ago
    > I never said that all sex in entertainment must be missionary position under sheets with the lights off between a Christian husband and wife. I don't think I've said that you said that either? My point was that they mostly show things that are relevant, and that since most movies focus on the extraordinary, regular sex is shown less and extraordinary sex is shown more. > First of all, it's rather interesting that you equate sex to taking a shit. Is it? I don't really see how. > But also, what have you been watching to conclude that they don't show people eating on-screen? It's rather common, especially in film, to have characters eating real food. the primary reason it's not as frequent as in real life is because having actors eat food is actually a complicated thing to with multiple takes while maintaining continuity. Again, food scenes are show when they are relevant. If you see a movie that happens on three days, you won't see people eat 9 times. You may see them eating once in the morning to show that the father doesn't have much time for his family, or something like that, but you won't see everything. The "ordinary stuff" is a small part of what happens in movies, because most movies aren't made to show it, they are made to show extreme things.

gmuslera 5y ago

More than just blood or gore: killing. It is normalized all across genres and cultures. Most times the "right" to kill comes from things that you can't possibly know, and you are the hero for doing so. And having a gun is a symbol of rightful power, like having money. And is not just the good boys killing, the bad boys more efficient doing so are shown surrounded by desirable things, power, money, women, charisma.

Koshkin 5y ago

Not just movies. It looks like most computer games, too, involve fighting and killing. I think there is something there that speaks to human nature.

quantified 5y ago

Right. I’d like to amplify this sentiment a bit. Killing, maiming, spilling blood and intestines, are all fine. So many examples. And yet two people making each other feel good in some way (whether horny release, tender support, making a baby, just fun) is immoral, unsuitable for “the children”, whatever. I think that there is a case for people to be moral. The moralizers who are ok with bloody torture and not sex as part of the human condition discredit the concept of moral teaching.

newby 5y ago

>> It saddens me that we live in a culture in which movies showing violence (including torture and murder) are acceptable, whereas ones showing consensual, non-pornographic intercourse - aren’t. I just remembered accidentally seeing the US version of the movie "Kingsman: The Secret Service". I was surprised that one scene was cut out - naked ass of a young woman. The scene of brutal massacre where dozens of people are killed and maimed was left there. I still do not get how this came to be. People usually talk about puritanism and such but this does not seem to explain it - why should any culture consider it desirable to watch brutality but not nudity or something sexual?