5 ms·

Wth is going on with Australian and NZ governments I don't know, what I do know is that people need to vote those suckers out... Don't listen your politicians a

Wth is going on with Australian and NZ governments I don't know, what I do know is that people need to vote those suckers out... Don't listen your politicians and do say hi to your neighbors.

lostlogin 5y ago
How does this comment relate to what the story is about? I’m missing something.
paranoidrobot 5y ago
Care to elaborate why you think the AU and NZ governments should be voted out? Given that the governments are very different from each other, I don't see much in the way of commonality there.
- sonthonax 5y ago
  I think it’s the smug xenophobia of their zero Covid policies that people are irked by. It’s effectively calling the rest of the world unclean. It’s eventually going to spread and take hold, but until then, their leaders get to bask in technocratic adoration.
  - paranoidrobot 5y ago
    You're not the person that I was replying to. > xenophobia [...] unclean [...] technocratic adoration That's some emotive language, and projecting viewpoints that I don't think represent the beliefs or thoughts of most Australians or New Zealanders. > their leaders get to bask in technocratic adoration. That you're saying this about Australia indicates you're not aware of the political situation at a state or federal level in Australia. Governments at all levels have been criticised broadly and constantly over their actions (or lack thereof) in relation to the pandemic. Overall the broad strategy of both countries is to limit the spread long enough to get the country vaccinated. The only way to effectively do that, is through zero-covid approaches. Oh, and by the way - the zero-covid strategy was only adopted by the States in Australia - the federal government didn't (doesn't) want that to be the policy, but the states forced it anyway. These strategies would've been even more important if a vaccine took the 2-3 years that most experts were projecting that it would take to develop, produce and deploy an effective and safe vaccine. For the most part, these strategies have worked, they've limited the number of deaths, the number of people in hospital.
    - buzzert 5y ago
      > For the most part, these strategies have worked, they've limited the number of deaths, the number of people in hospital. Uh huh... https://6761deed1591e2a2-buzzertdotnet.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/junk/victoria.jpg https://6761deed1591e2a2-buzzertdotnet.s3.us-west-2.amazonaw...
      - paranoidrobot 5y ago
        Seems like you misunderstand what you're showing. That graph shows precisely how well the approach has worked. If Victoria and other states had gone with the same approach as The UK, US, or most other wealthy nations, the case numbers and deaths would've been vastly higher.
        buzzert 5y ago
        "would've been vastly higher" is an unfalsifiable statement. The only thing we can conclude from the actual real data is that Australia's outcome has been relatively poor, just like the rest of the world accounting for population density/etc.
    - sonthonax 5y ago
      > That's some emotive language, and projecting viewpoints that I don't think represent the beliefs or thoughts of most Australians or New Zealanders. But xenophobia is literally the policy; even their own citizens aren’t able to return without great expense and difficulty. The mood of xenophobia is intrinsically connected with the idea of societal hygiene. In a very literal sense, people outside of Australia are an unclean biohazard. It’s reaching an absurd point now, Australia has their army deployed to enforce a lockdown, while 50% of the population is vaccinated. They’re going to be in for a nasty shock when they discover that the elderly still drop like flies even when they’re vaccinated.
      - paranoidrobot 5y ago
        Enforcing quarantine during a pandemic is not xenophobia. That there's limited quarantine facilities available is hardly unique to Australia or NZ - nobody has quarantine facilities standing by to facilitate quarantine of unlimited inbound travellers. > Australia has their army deployed to enforce a lockdown This is factually incorrect. The ADF isn't enforcing a lockdown. Lockdowns are being directed and enforced by state authorities. This is more than being semantically inaccurate, it's just wrong. The ADF personnel involved are unarmed, and hold no powers. They cannot issue directives or enforce any laws any more than any other person could do so. They were deployed upon the direct request of police and emergency service authorities to help in logistics and to help with police patrols. They were also only deployed in limited areas. This is pretty standard stuff around the world where during times of crisis, civilian authorities request the support of the military.

Wth is going on with Australian and NZ governments I don't know, what I do know is that people need to vote those suckers out... Don't listen your politicians and do say hi to your neighbors.

lostlogin 5y ago

How does this comment relate to what the story is about? I’m missing something.

paranoidrobot 5y ago

Care to elaborate why you think the AU and NZ governments should be voted out? Given that the governments are very different from each other, I don't see much in the way of commonality there.

sonthonax 5y ago
I think it’s the smug xenophobia of their zero Covid policies that people are irked by. It’s effectively calling the rest of the world unclean. It’s eventually going to spread and take hold, but until then, their leaders get to bask in technocratic adoration.
- paranoidrobot 5y ago
  You're not the person that I was replying to. > xenophobia [...] unclean [...] technocratic adoration That's some emotive language, and projecting viewpoints that I don't think represent the beliefs or thoughts of most Australians or New Zealanders. > their leaders get to bask in technocratic adoration. That you're saying this about Australia indicates you're not aware of the political situation at a state or federal level in Australia. Governments at all levels have been criticised broadly and constantly over their actions (or lack thereof) in relation to the pandemic. Overall the broad strategy of both countries is to limit the spread long enough to get the country vaccinated. The only way to effectively do that, is through zero-covid approaches. Oh, and by the way - the zero-covid strategy was only adopted by the States in Australia - the federal government didn't (doesn't) want that to be the policy, but the states forced it anyway. These strategies would've been even more important if a vaccine took the 2-3 years that most experts were projecting that it would take to develop, produce and deploy an effective and safe vaccine. For the most part, these strategies have worked, they've limited the number of deaths, the number of people in hospital.
  - buzzert 5y ago
    > For the most part, these strategies have worked, they've limited the number of deaths, the number of people in hospital. Uh huh... https://6761deed1591e2a2-buzzertdotnet.s3.us-west-2.amazonaws.com/junk/victoria.jpg https://6761deed1591e2a2-buzzertdotnet.s3.us-west-2.amazonaw...
    - paranoidrobot 5y ago
      Seems like you misunderstand what you're showing. That graph shows precisely how well the approach has worked. If Victoria and other states had gone with the same approach as The UK, US, or most other wealthy nations, the case numbers and deaths would've been vastly higher.
      - buzzert 5y ago
        "would've been vastly higher" is an unfalsifiable statement. The only thing we can conclude from the actual real data is that Australia's outcome has been relatively poor, just like the rest of the world accounting for population density/etc.
  - sonthonax 5y ago
    > That's some emotive language, and projecting viewpoints that I don't think represent the beliefs or thoughts of most Australians or New Zealanders. But xenophobia is literally the policy; even their own citizens aren’t able to return without great expense and difficulty. The mood of xenophobia is intrinsically connected with the idea of societal hygiene. In a very literal sense, people outside of Australia are an unclean biohazard. It’s reaching an absurd point now, Australia has their army deployed to enforce a lockdown, while 50% of the population is vaccinated. They’re going to be in for a nasty shock when they discover that the elderly still drop like flies even when they’re vaccinated.
    - paranoidrobot 5y ago
      Enforcing quarantine during a pandemic is not xenophobia. That there's limited quarantine facilities available is hardly unique to Australia or NZ - nobody has quarantine facilities standing by to facilitate quarantine of unlimited inbound travellers. > Australia has their army deployed to enforce a lockdown This is factually incorrect. The ADF isn't enforcing a lockdown. Lockdowns are being directed and enforced by state authorities. This is more than being semantically inaccurate, it's just wrong. The ADF personnel involved are unarmed, and hold no powers. They cannot issue directives or enforce any laws any more than any other person could do so. They were deployed upon the direct request of police and emergency service authorities to help in logistics and to help with police patrols. They were also only deployed in limited areas. This is pretty standard stuff around the world where during times of crisis, civilian authorities request the support of the military.