4 ms·

It really seems that if you aren't in the upper income brackets you are just one major health problem away from bankruptcy.

rootusrootus 5y ago
Well, if you are low enough in the income brackets, you get medicaid to pay for it all. On the one hand, medical expenses are the number one cause of bankruptcy, we've all heard that. But on the other hand, if it were really as bad as it seems, why don't we do something about it? I guess the answer is tribal politics. Amazing how we can all be turned against each other so effectively, while a small portion of the population, who needs help the least, has no problem whatsoever advocating vigorously for their own benefit.
- Uehreka 5y ago
  > if were really as bad as it seems, why don’t we do something about it? This sounds like a person in a burning building saying “if it was that bad, wouldn’t I have left the building already? Maybe there’s a reason I’m in here?” Like, yeah, our politics are tribal. But one side is debating back and forth about how to fix this situation (with some good points on both sides, I’d be cool with an NHS, a Canadian single payer system, or even a German public/private combo system honestly), while the other side seems dead set on acting like the burning building just needs more gasoline and it’ll turn out alright.
  - kaczordon 5y ago
    Despite the snark about the “other side” your proposed solutions are equally blind to the actual problem. Even if we had single payer(not to mention that places like Canada rely on the drug and treatment innovations from the US) that doesn’t fix the system. The problem is hospital billing and financial scams pulled by hospitals, a majority of health care spending goes to things that have nothing to do with health. I highly recommend reading The Price We Pay: What Broke American Health Care and How to Fix It to understand the real issues with healthcare in the US today.
    - bserge 5y ago
      It seems to me that insurance companies are the main problem, the hospitals just take advantage of that.
      - spaetzleesser 5y ago
        All players in the US system are corrupt and take advantage. Insurance , hospitals, doctors, ambulances, drug companies, medical device companies, various middleman, construction companies and more. No need to point out a single player. I think you would have to work hard if you tried to build a worse system if you decided to build a system that’s more opaque , unpredictable, bureaucratic, cruel and expensive.
    - willvarfar 5y ago
      There ought be a bot to keep replying to people saying that the high margins in the US fund healthcare innovations. This is a popular narrative promoted by the US medical industry. However, it doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. Just the first debunking I find in a google search is https://www.mhaonline.com/blog/healthcare-debates-funding-medical-research https://www.mhaonline.com/blog/healthcare-debates-funding-me... I think the big profits to be made on _treating_ diereses in the US is probably a perverse incentive preventing those companies from developing preventative measures.
      - kaczordon 5y ago
        The article you linked disproves your point: In 2016, the US was responsible for 57 percent of new chemical entities worldwide. From this perspective, ensuring increased investment in R&D seems logical.
- tcmart14 5y ago
  I'd say we can't do anything about it because the one with the power to do something about it are more worried about the thousands of other frivolous social policies (BOTH SIDES) for show while they pad their pockets with lobbying money and benefits.
- emmelaich 5y ago
  Hold up ... it's probably overstated. "Myth and Measurement: The Case of Medical Bankruptcies" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5865642/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5865642/ also https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/08/28/sanderss-flawed-statistic-medical-bankruptcies-year/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/08/28/sanderss-...
- californical 5y ago
  > Amazing how we can all be turned against each other so effectively, while a small portion of the population, who needs help the least, has no problem whatsoever advocating vigorously for their own benefit. I know it wasn’t your main point, but this really made me think. Is it possible that these traits are somewhat correlated, in the sense that people who are more likely to advocate for their own interests & needs (in a persuasive way) are more likely to be successful in other areas (financial) as well?
  - spaetzleesser 5y ago
    Sure, being selfish is good trait if yiu want to be successful. Especially if you are good at convincing others with “facts” that are beneficial for you.
- swayvil 5y ago
  Speaking as a person on medicaid. Our local dental clinic. "Sorry, we are not accepting new patients at the moment" But there's a local veterinarian that has a sideline in tooth-pulling, if it gets too bad. USA is medieval.
- spaetzleesser 5y ago
  I know people on Medicaid. The coverage is very spotty, super bureaucratic and it’s hard to find a doctor who will treat you. Definitely not a desirable thing
tcmart14 5y ago
Something dad always told me growing up, 'most people are one bad accident away from the poorhouse/welfare.'

rootusrootus 5y ago

Well, if you are low enough in the income brackets, you get medicaid to pay for it all. On the one hand, medical expenses are the number one cause of bankruptcy, we've all heard that. But on the other hand, if it were really as bad as it seems, why don't we do something about it? I guess the answer is tribal politics. Amazing how we can all be turned against each other so effectively, while a small portion of the population, who needs help the least, has no problem whatsoever advocating vigorously for their own benefit.

Uehreka 5y ago
> if were really as bad as it seems, why don’t we do something about it? This sounds like a person in a burning building saying “if it was that bad, wouldn’t I have left the building already? Maybe there’s a reason I’m in here?” Like, yeah, our politics are tribal. But one side is debating back and forth about how to fix this situation (with some good points on both sides, I’d be cool with an NHS, a Canadian single payer system, or even a German public/private combo system honestly), while the other side seems dead set on acting like the burning building just needs more gasoline and it’ll turn out alright.
- kaczordon 5y ago
  Despite the snark about the “other side” your proposed solutions are equally blind to the actual problem. Even if we had single payer(not to mention that places like Canada rely on the drug and treatment innovations from the US) that doesn’t fix the system. The problem is hospital billing and financial scams pulled by hospitals, a majority of health care spending goes to things that have nothing to do with health. I highly recommend reading The Price We Pay: What Broke American Health Care and How to Fix It to understand the real issues with healthcare in the US today.
  - bserge 5y ago
    It seems to me that insurance companies are the main problem, the hospitals just take advantage of that.
    - spaetzleesser 5y ago
      All players in the US system are corrupt and take advantage. Insurance , hospitals, doctors, ambulances, drug companies, medical device companies, various middleman, construction companies and more. No need to point out a single player. I think you would have to work hard if you tried to build a worse system if you decided to build a system that’s more opaque , unpredictable, bureaucratic, cruel and expensive.
  - willvarfar 5y ago
    There ought be a bot to keep replying to people saying that the high margins in the US fund healthcare innovations. This is a popular narrative promoted by the US medical industry. However, it doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. Just the first debunking I find in a google search is https://www.mhaonline.com/blog/healthcare-debates-funding-medical-research https://www.mhaonline.com/blog/healthcare-debates-funding-me... I think the big profits to be made on _treating_ diereses in the US is probably a perverse incentive preventing those companies from developing preventative measures.
    - kaczordon 5y ago
      The article you linked disproves your point: In 2016, the US was responsible for 57 percent of new chemical entities worldwide. From this perspective, ensuring increased investment in R&D seems logical.
tcmart14 5y ago
I'd say we can't do anything about it because the one with the power to do something about it are more worried about the thousands of other frivolous social policies (BOTH SIDES) for show while they pad their pockets with lobbying money and benefits.
emmelaich 5y ago
Hold up ... it's probably overstated. "Myth and Measurement: The Case of Medical Bankruptcies" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5865642/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5865642/ also https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/08/28/sanderss-flawed-statistic-medical-bankruptcies-year/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/08/28/sanderss-...
californical 5y ago
> Amazing how we can all be turned against each other so effectively, while a small portion of the population, who needs help the least, has no problem whatsoever advocating vigorously for their own benefit. I know it wasn’t your main point, but this really made me think. Is it possible that these traits are somewhat correlated, in the sense that people who are more likely to advocate for their own interests & needs (in a persuasive way) are more likely to be successful in other areas (financial) as well?
- spaetzleesser 5y ago
  Sure, being selfish is good trait if yiu want to be successful. Especially if you are good at convincing others with “facts” that are beneficial for you.
swayvil 5y ago
Speaking as a person on medicaid. Our local dental clinic. "Sorry, we are not accepting new patients at the moment" But there's a local veterinarian that has a sideline in tooth-pulling, if it gets too bad. USA is medieval.
spaetzleesser 5y ago
I know people on Medicaid. The coverage is very spotty, super bureaucratic and it’s hard to find a doctor who will treat you. Definitely not a desirable thing

tcmart14 5y ago

Something dad always told me growing up, 'most people are one bad accident away from the poorhouse/welfare.'