3 ms·

You picked a source that not age-stratified and also looks at a timeframe when many were not vaccinated in the first place. I can give you a source for deaths

You picked a source that not age-stratified and also looks at a timeframe when many were not vaccinated in the first place. I can give you a source for deaths in the past few weeks in Israel, but only stratified between over/under 60: https://www.covid-datascience.com/post/what-do-new-israeli-data-say-about-effect-of-vaccines-boosters-vs-death-critical-severe-disease https://www.covid-datascience.com/post/what-do-new-israeli-d... The picture is similar: Efficacy of around 70% (two doses) and 95% (fresh booster) against death. This is far from "one in a million". If you age-stratified this data further, you would likely get better efficacy though.

shapefrog 5y ago
Assume for the purpose every single one of the ~600 is old. Same outcome. Indeed leaving them in, according to your own source makes vaccines look worse than they are! Given how the large sample size etc is I am more than comfortable taking the UK unstratified data and clncluding the vaccines are effective. > Because of age confounding, it is crucial to stratify by age groups, and further to remove children from the <60yr group; otherwise Simpson's paradox makes vaccines look like they are not effective in protecting against COVID-19 deaths at all.
- incrudible 5y ago
  No matter how you twist and turn it, the vaccines are significantly less effective in the people who need it the most, to the point where a significant amount of deaths, in both absolue and relative terms, occur in the fully vaccinated. That means better options for treatment are still needed. That is the point I am making, nothing else.
  - shapefrog 5y ago
    You are litterally making shit up by saying a significant amount of deaths, in both absolue and relative terms, occur in the fully vaccinated Best of luck to you on your propaganda campaign.
    - incrudible 5y ago
      > You are litterally making shit up by saying a significant amount of deaths, in both absolue and relative terms, occur in the fully vaccinated Let's go back to current UK data: During the delta wave, 1,613 deaths have been fully vaccinated. That's 70% of deaths, despite high vaccine efficacy. If that's not significant, then the other 722 unvaccinated deaths aren't significant either. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1018547/Technical_Briefing_23_21_09_16.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... (Page 20) > Best of luck to you on your propaganda campaign. Same to you.

shapefrog 5y ago

Assume for the purpose every single one of the ~600 is old. Same outcome. Indeed leaving them in, according to your own source makes vaccines look worse than they are! Given how the large sample size etc is I am more than comfortable taking the UK unstratified data and clncluding the vaccines are effective. > Because of age confounding, it is crucial to stratify by age groups, and further to remove children from the <60yr group; otherwise Simpson's paradox makes vaccines look like they are not effective in protecting against COVID-19 deaths at all.

incrudible 5y ago
No matter how you twist and turn it, the vaccines are significantly less effective in the people who need it the most, to the point where a significant amount of deaths, in both absolue and relative terms, occur in the fully vaccinated. That means better options for treatment are still needed. That is the point I am making, nothing else.
- shapefrog 5y ago
  You are litterally making shit up by saying a significant amount of deaths, in both absolue and relative terms, occur in the fully vaccinated Best of luck to you on your propaganda campaign.
  - incrudible 5y ago
    > You are litterally making shit up by saying a significant amount of deaths, in both absolue and relative terms, occur in the fully vaccinated Let's go back to current UK data: During the delta wave, 1,613 deaths have been fully vaccinated. That's 70% of deaths, despite high vaccine efficacy. If that's not significant, then the other 722 unvaccinated deaths aren't significant either. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1018547/Technical_Briefing_23_21_09_16.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... (Page 20) > Best of luck to you on your propaganda campaign. Same to you.