10 ms·

I agree this is a phenomenon right now, but I feel that article is vastly overcomplicating it, and not necessarily accurately. I'd suggest simply: - software

I agree this is a phenomenon right now, but I feel that article is vastly overcomplicating it, and not necessarily accurately. I'd suggest simply: - software engineers are hugely in demand - software engineers have worked out they can work well remotely, and often prefer it for a combination of productivity and work/life balance reasons - software engineers are voting with their feet and finding work that suits their needs - and many firms are losing talent accordingly due to not meeting the needs of those staff

rlayton2 5y ago
Don't forget that it's easier to get a raise by changing jobs than asking your boss.
- brianmcc 5y ago
  Totally! We are perhaps in the midst of a great levelling-up game of musical chairs too!
hihihihi1234 5y ago
Also: more and more job interviews are happening via Zoom. It's far easier to find a new job when you can do it without booking a day off from your current job.
- aweiland 5y ago
  This isn't true for everyone. I'm on site every day and Zoom is a hassle compared to a phone call I can do from my car.
  - noirbot 5y ago
    Sure, but how many companies were hiring Senior Engineers with just a phone call? Zoom is definitely less disruptive than having to sneakily drive across town, let alone fly across the country on a weekday or two for in-person interviews.
brianmcc 5y ago
Replying to myself - the phrase "the war for talent", coined in 1997, has always been apt for the tech sector and it's just becoming more and more so. Employers are going to have to compete really really hard for acquisition and retention of talent. And wishy washy corporate platitudes won't cut it, firms will need to offer both aggressively competitive financial packages and attractive workplace setups - remote, flexible, whatever it takes.
phkahler 5y ago
I also suspect there's a personality aspect. Software engineers make good money, but that's not their primary, or only motivator. They're willing to trade a bit of that income for QoL.
- kongin 5y ago
  And interesting problems. I'm taking two years to work on a moonshot startup because the problem is interesting and I'm one of the dumber people in the zoom. I took a pay cut of 50% on paper and closer 80% when you price the stock realistically.
  - JohnFen 5y ago
    Interesting work that I'm ethically OK with is pretty much the only thing I care about. I have taken positions that involved a reduction in pay because the work itself is something I'm particularly interested in, and would do so again in the future.
candiddevmike 5y ago
Businesses are focusing on "developer experience" and burying people in tech tools and abstractions instead of addressing leadership, product, or pay issues.
BiteCode_dev 5y ago
Pretty much. We can do so because the market is in our favor. Not because we have balls of steel unlike in other industries. I have terrible marketing skills and yet, as a freelancer, I have to refuse work because there is so much demand. This also means I can charge a month of minimum wage for a day of my labor. That's awesome for me, but that's not normal. Everyone is a genius in a bull market.
- jokethrowaway 5y ago
  Very true. At the same time, software seems to be able to generate significantly more revenue for clients than other jobs. It makes sense that anyone wants a piece of the automation cake and therefore need software developers. If you think about the value you're providing, you'll see you're probably creating much more value for the company than for yourself. Sure, you charged 10k£ to build a dashboard serving 50 millions customers which took you a few days to build. That dashboard may avoid the company 25 millions calls, saving way more money than the 10k they spent on you.
- AmericanChopper 5y ago
  > I can charge a month of minimum wage for a day of my labor. That's awesome for me, but that's not normal. I’ve been working mostly as a contractor for quite a long time now. This honestly is quite normal. I’ve done contract work through 2 financial crises now, and the longest I’ve been unintentionally out of work was two months, and otherwise I’ve managed to charge high hourly/daily rates the whole time. I have seen a lot of my contractor friends go full-time during this pandemic though. When it first hit, the place that I was working at converted about 1200 contractors to full-time. The allure of job stability was too good to pass up. But the risks were an illusion the whole time. There was a shortage of software engineers during the GFC, a shortage of software engineers for the 10 years after it, and there’s been a shortage of software engineers during the pandemic. It’s just gotten so bad recently that people who were previously more risk averse have started to notice it.
  - BiteCode_dev 5y ago
    > This honestly is quite normal For our industry, during the last 20 years. Not normal for most industries. Or in IT before 2000. > I have seen a lot of my contractor friends go full-time during this pandemic though Yeah, that's why I think it's important to have an elastic life style if you are a freelancer. So that you can suddenly cut 80% of your expenses. If you have big loans, an expensive car, 2 children in private school and live in a pricey area, if you revenue get shots, you are in trouble. > But the risks were an illusion the whole time. It was surprising though, wasn't it? I mean I expected calls to stop, but I got more of them. Now I have people calling me for things that are very far from my specialty. Software is, indeed, eating the world.
somehnacct3757 5y ago
I would throw in that some percentage of 'the great resignation' isn't a new movement at all, but a one-time backlog of people who stayed longer at their jobs in the middle of a pandemic for income security. Now that things have gotten better (YoY, relatively speaking,) 2021 is full of both 2020's and 2021's resignations.
- burlesona 5y ago
  This x 100. I’m surprised we don’t see this brought up more often. The same effect is happening with many obvious life changes - weddings are way up, and I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a small baby boom in the next year or two as people who waited through 2020 finally felt safe/stable enough to make voluntary life change again in 2021.
zanybear 5y ago
I would throw in also real estate market that makes them cash in on their homes in the city to move to the rural areas (or back home). I think the are way more factors that just this.

rlayton2 5y ago

Don't forget that it's easier to get a raise by changing jobs than asking your boss.

brianmcc 5y ago
Totally! We are perhaps in the midst of a great levelling-up game of musical chairs too!

hihihihi1234 5y ago

Also: more and more job interviews are happening via Zoom. It's far easier to find a new job when you can do it without booking a day off from your current job.

aweiland 5y ago
This isn't true for everyone. I'm on site every day and Zoom is a hassle compared to a phone call I can do from my car.
- noirbot 5y ago
  Sure, but how many companies were hiring Senior Engineers with just a phone call? Zoom is definitely less disruptive than having to sneakily drive across town, let alone fly across the country on a weekday or two for in-person interviews.

brianmcc 5y ago

Replying to myself - the phrase "the war for talent", coined in 1997, has always been apt for the tech sector and it's just becoming more and more so. Employers are going to have to compete really really hard for acquisition and retention of talent. And wishy washy corporate platitudes won't cut it, firms will need to offer both aggressively competitive financial packages and attractive workplace setups - remote, flexible, whatever it takes.

phkahler 5y ago

I also suspect there's a personality aspect. Software engineers make good money, but that's not their primary, or only motivator. They're willing to trade a bit of that income for QoL.

kongin 5y ago
And interesting problems. I'm taking two years to work on a moonshot startup because the problem is interesting and I'm one of the dumber people in the zoom. I took a pay cut of 50% on paper and closer 80% when you price the stock realistically.
- JohnFen 5y ago
  Interesting work that I'm ethically OK with is pretty much the only thing I care about. I have taken positions that involved a reduction in pay because the work itself is something I'm particularly interested in, and would do so again in the future.

candiddevmike 5y ago

Businesses are focusing on "developer experience" and burying people in tech tools and abstractions instead of addressing leadership, product, or pay issues.

BiteCode_dev 5y ago

Pretty much. We can do so because the market is in our favor. Not because we have balls of steel unlike in other industries. I have terrible marketing skills and yet, as a freelancer, I have to refuse work because there is so much demand. This also means I can charge a month of minimum wage for a day of my labor. That's awesome for me, but that's not normal. Everyone is a genius in a bull market.

jokethrowaway 5y ago
Very true. At the same time, software seems to be able to generate significantly more revenue for clients than other jobs. It makes sense that anyone wants a piece of the automation cake and therefore need software developers. If you think about the value you're providing, you'll see you're probably creating much more value for the company than for yourself. Sure, you charged 10k£ to build a dashboard serving 50 millions customers which took you a few days to build. That dashboard may avoid the company 25 millions calls, saving way more money than the 10k they spent on you.
AmericanChopper 5y ago
> I can charge a month of minimum wage for a day of my labor. That's awesome for me, but that's not normal. I’ve been working mostly as a contractor for quite a long time now. This honestly is quite normal. I’ve done contract work through 2 financial crises now, and the longest I’ve been unintentionally out of work was two months, and otherwise I’ve managed to charge high hourly/daily rates the whole time. I have seen a lot of my contractor friends go full-time during this pandemic though. When it first hit, the place that I was working at converted about 1200 contractors to full-time. The allure of job stability was too good to pass up. But the risks were an illusion the whole time. There was a shortage of software engineers during the GFC, a shortage of software engineers for the 10 years after it, and there’s been a shortage of software engineers during the pandemic. It’s just gotten so bad recently that people who were previously more risk averse have started to notice it.
- BiteCode_dev 5y ago
  > This honestly is quite normal For our industry, during the last 20 years. Not normal for most industries. Or in IT before 2000. > I have seen a lot of my contractor friends go full-time during this pandemic though Yeah, that's why I think it's important to have an elastic life style if you are a freelancer. So that you can suddenly cut 80% of your expenses. If you have big loans, an expensive car, 2 children in private school and live in a pricey area, if you revenue get shots, you are in trouble. > But the risks were an illusion the whole time. It was surprising though, wasn't it? I mean I expected calls to stop, but I got more of them. Now I have people calling me for things that are very far from my specialty. Software is, indeed, eating the world.

somehnacct3757 5y ago

I would throw in that some percentage of 'the great resignation' isn't a new movement at all, but a one-time backlog of people who stayed longer at their jobs in the middle of a pandemic for income security. Now that things have gotten better (YoY, relatively speaking,) 2021 is full of both 2020's and 2021's resignations.

burlesona 5y ago
This x 100. I’m surprised we don’t see this brought up more often. The same effect is happening with many obvious life changes - weddings are way up, and I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a small baby boom in the next year or two as people who waited through 2020 finally felt safe/stable enough to make voluntary life change again in 2021.

zanybear 5y ago

I would throw in also real estate market that makes them cash in on their homes in the city to move to the rural areas (or back home). I think the are way more factors that just this.