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Most managers are bad because most managers core skills are not management. Many engineers complain about non technical background managers but many people will

Most managers are bad because most managers core skills are not management. Many engineers complain about non technical background managers but many people will note that even managers with technical backgrounds skills soon become irrelevant. It's the ability to actually manager people, and further projects, that actually makes a manager good or bad. Unfortunately you rarely get to evaluate your manager properly before starting a new job and there is no guarantee that they will be there for any length of time once you do start. Having a good manager feels like winning the lottery.

halfmatthalfcat 5y ago
I feel the opposite, most (engineering) managers/directors are bad because they've either lost their edge and having coded in years (or decades) and cannot appropriately respond to team issues or they were never technical to begin with. Easiest way to lose a locker room is having a manager/director who is technically inept.
- libertine 5y ago
  Now I'm confused: is the manager supposed to solve technical problems? >Easiest way to lose a locker room is having a manager/director who is technically inept. For example, there are plenty of excellent soccer coaches that have never played soccer. This type of thread shows up every couple of months here, and people use their anecdotal experience to define a whole role (which is different within itself and between organizations), which just feeds prejudice about a particular type of people, non-dev managers. When in reality you have great managers from both technical and non-technical background.
  - halfmatthalfcat 5y ago
    Depends more on the team than the person tbh. Sure you can have a great manager in either lane but if they don't gel with the team, it's ultimately going to fail. Most of the teams I've worked on don't want people managers in the chain of command, obviously anecdotal.
- slantyyz 5y ago
  > Easiest way to lose a locker room is having a manager/director who is technically inept. I think a better way to look at a manager is to compare it to the HR department. Managers aren't hired by the people they will be managing, they're hired by the company. In the same way that HR always represents the company's interests more than the employees, a manager is the exact same thing. It's not in the interest of most company executives to hire a manager with the backbone to say "no" to management, or be on the side of the team being managed. I think it's very rare when a manager is hired to actually manage properly. Most companies seem to value the very qualities that most people hate about bad managers.
- Taylor_OD 5y ago
  But... most Coaches, continuing the locker room analogy, are not good athletes. It's incredibly rare for them to be as skilled as the folks they are coaching and its very likely they were never as skilled as the people they are coaching. Yet they are good coaches. Managers !== Coaches but I think you understand what I'm saying. Yes there are managers who are so technically incompetent that they are not good managers but most technical managers last management skills rather than technical skills and in most cases the technicals are not as important as the management skills. Any CTO/VP/Director of a mid/large sized company is a good example of this. They are no longer hands on. Their effectiveness comes from their ability to manage others.

halfmatthalfcat 5y ago

I feel the opposite, most (engineering) managers/directors are bad because they've either lost their edge and having coded in years (or decades) and cannot appropriately respond to team issues or they were never technical to begin with. Easiest way to lose a locker room is having a manager/director who is technically inept.

libertine 5y ago
Now I'm confused: is the manager supposed to solve technical problems? >Easiest way to lose a locker room is having a manager/director who is technically inept. For example, there are plenty of excellent soccer coaches that have never played soccer. This type of thread shows up every couple of months here, and people use their anecdotal experience to define a whole role (which is different within itself and between organizations), which just feeds prejudice about a particular type of people, non-dev managers. When in reality you have great managers from both technical and non-technical background.
- halfmatthalfcat 5y ago
  Depends more on the team than the person tbh. Sure you can have a great manager in either lane but if they don't gel with the team, it's ultimately going to fail. Most of the teams I've worked on don't want people managers in the chain of command, obviously anecdotal.
slantyyz 5y ago
> Easiest way to lose a locker room is having a manager/director who is technically inept. I think a better way to look at a manager is to compare it to the HR department. Managers aren't hired by the people they will be managing, they're hired by the company. In the same way that HR always represents the company's interests more than the employees, a manager is the exact same thing. It's not in the interest of most company executives to hire a manager with the backbone to say "no" to management, or be on the side of the team being managed. I think it's very rare when a manager is hired to actually manage properly. Most companies seem to value the very qualities that most people hate about bad managers.
Taylor_OD 5y ago
But... most Coaches, continuing the locker room analogy, are not good athletes. It's incredibly rare for them to be as skilled as the folks they are coaching and its very likely they were never as skilled as the people they are coaching. Yet they are good coaches. Managers !== Coaches but I think you understand what I'm saying. Yes there are managers who are so technically incompetent that they are not good managers but most technical managers last management skills rather than technical skills and in most cases the technicals are not as important as the management skills. Any CTO/VP/Director of a mid/large sized company is a good example of this. They are no longer hands on. Their effectiveness comes from their ability to manage others.