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There were North American tribes that used proscribed burning as a way of land management. There were also Native American tribes that cultivated what are now c

by hosh 5y ago

There were North American tribes that used proscribed burning as a way of land management. There were also Native American tribes that cultivated what are now called perennial food forests. There were examples of such food forests in Oregon that are still producing foragable food, even left untended. My understanding was that the forests from the East Coast to the Mississipi were almost park-like, unlike the dank, dark, scary forests the colonials were used to. Someone was tending them. There are evidence of such food forests in the Amazonian jungle. Those had to be cultivated with _terra preta_ (what is now called biochar). Without that, the constant rain would wash away the nutrients. Yet with that, there were also long-lasting perennial food forests supporting a fairly advanced civilization. Cultivation of the land does not have to be at odds with the land. People have been in "harmony with the land" while still purposefully practicing agriculture. It just wasn't agriculture that colonials were used to seeing: cleared fields, tilling, monocropping, maximizing yields for cash crops. I think the permaculture ethical principles of "care for land", "care for people", "fair share" would find alignment in many indigenous cultures, and you can do all of that while practicing agriculture.

rsj_hn 5y ago
> My understanding was that the forests from the East Coast to the Mississipi were almost park-like, unlike the dank, dark, scary forests the colonials were used to. Someone was tending them. This is the kind of odd B.S. I often hear from people who don't know history, particularly European history, yet they feel so confident making stuff up. Forests in Europe were tended since the middle ages. It was a profession. The same for England. Where do you think the timber came for to support the cathedral building boom of the 1000s? It came from well managed forests, not dark, dank places that no one tended. They were used for food/hunting grounds, for picking mushrooms and berries, hunting birds, and the forests were controlled, expanded or trimmed by royal decree that balanced the need for hunting grounds and food provision with the needs for wood. They were well mapped out, with hereditary positions of people who lived in the forests and keep them clean and well-ordered. This was the case for hundreds of years before any colonists set sail for the Americas, and was carried over by the colonists who had even more need for food and wood than their ancestors in Europe.
ncmncm 5y ago
"Prescribed" burning. As I understood it, the Pacific Northwest orchards that still maintain balance after centuries untended are in B.C., Canada, not Oregon. Amazonians were breeding trees for desired traits all of 10,000 years ago; the whole Amazon jungle is a mixed orchard left untended. Their long sophistication is all that can account for the intricate methods necessary to prepare curare, ayahuasca, and manioc. They must have had hundreds of other equally impressive recipes, now lost forever.

by hosh 5y ago

rsj_hn 5y ago

> My understanding was that the forests from the East Coast to the Mississipi were almost park-like, unlike the dank, dark, scary forests the colonials were used to. Someone was tending them. This is the kind of odd B.S. I often hear from people who don't know history, particularly European history, yet they feel so confident making stuff up. Forests in Europe were tended since the middle ages. It was a profession. The same for England. Where do you think the timber came for to support the cathedral building boom of the 1000s? It came from well managed forests, not dark, dank places that no one tended. They were used for food/hunting grounds, for picking mushrooms and berries, hunting birds, and the forests were controlled, expanded or trimmed by royal decree that balanced the need for hunting grounds and food provision with the needs for wood. They were well mapped out, with hereditary positions of people who lived in the forests and keep them clean and well-ordered. This was the case for hundreds of years before any colonists set sail for the Americas, and was carried over by the colonists who had even more need for food and wood than their ancestors in Europe.

ncmncm 5y ago

"Prescribed" burning. As I understood it, the Pacific Northwest orchards that still maintain balance after centuries untended are in B.C., Canada, not Oregon. Amazonians were breeding trees for desired traits all of 10,000 years ago; the whole Amazon jungle is a mixed orchard left untended. Their long sophistication is all that can account for the intricate methods necessary to prepare curare, ayahuasca, and manioc. They must have had hundreds of other equally impressive recipes, now lost forever.