5 ms·

If you go on the Herman Cain Awards, there's some of that, but there's also a whole lot of people or their family posting anti-vaccine content right before (and

If you go on the Herman Cain Awards, there's some of that, but there's also a whole lot of people or their family posting anti-vaccine content right before (and sometimes after) the patient dies. Pure insanity. Look folks, you can get owned by the libs or you can get owned by the virus. One of them leaves you living to post another day. It's the Trump vaccine, Christ. Remember when the pharma companies delayed announcing the vaccine to not give him the win before the election?

dlivingston 5y ago
I hate that sub with a passion, I really do. Morbid schadenfreude at the deceased under a thin disguise of “awareness of the dangers of being anti-vax.”
- sellyme 5y ago
  When someone's actively trying to get those around them killed, I find it difficult to criticise anyone for not being too distressed by their passing.
  - dlivingston 5y ago
    My issues are with the mocking, the doxxing, and the general atmosphere of “the vermin are extinguishing themselves and the world is better for it.”
    - sellyme 5y ago
      > the mocking It's perfectly reasonable to have a distaste for this, but I am curious as to if you take issue with this because the person in question is deceased, or if you just take issue with mocking someone under all circumstances. > the doxxing I can't say I've seen any of that. Admittedly I only ever see posts from that subreddit when they show up on r/all, so maybe it gets cleaned up on popular posts, but everything I've seen on the subreddit is just directly screenshotted from social media. > and the general atmosphere of “the vermin are extinguishing themselves and the world is better for it.” This one is really just a matter of your opinion on trolley problems. For what it's worth I'm pretty sure just about everyone on that subreddit would prefer the individuals in question have a sudden inspiration of critical thought and save their own lives.
      - dlivingston 5y ago
        We care about vaccination rates because we care about human lives - so what have we gained if we lose our humanity in the process of trying to save it.
        sellyme 5y ago
        The lives of the people who aren't trying to get their peers killed, hopefully. If someone is so hell-bent on dying that they'll ignore every single qualified doctor telling them that they're wrong, we can't really do much about that. But at least it usually stops them from getting other people killed with the same stupidity.
        tacitusarc 5y ago
        But if you treat that situation as gleeful instead of tragic, there is something wrong with you.
        ikr678 5y ago
        I am not American, but watching the way the vaccine has been politicised, I can understand a certain level of schaudenfreude as a reaction to after the years of Trump governing to 'owning the libs'.
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - ziml77 5y ago
        > I'm pretty sure just about everyone on that subreddit would prefer the individuals in question have a sudden inspiration of critical thought and save their own lives. That's backed up by the praise for people who post there saying they've changed their opinion. I'm not going to lie and claim the feeling of schadenfreude isn't a factor, but it's more than that. The other reason that subreddit is happy about anti-vaxxers dying is because it means one less person spreading anti-vax sentiments (actually more since their family may stop too). However, the subreddit isn't calling for anti-vaxxers to be killed. The deaths of anti-vaxxers who die for reasons other than COVID are not celebrated.
- tehjoker 5y ago
  I am not sure what to think about that sub, all I know is that where I live COVID hasn't been too bad, so it gives me a window into what it's like in the rest of the country. It mostly makes me feel bad, like looking at casualty lists from WW1 except someone told them they didn't have to go over the top. It's just so senseless and pointless.
  - dlivingston 5y ago
    The targets of vitriol should be the media and political figures who made vaccine hesitancy mainstream amongst conservatives, not individual people. People are blinded by the public figures and institutions that they trust - and yes, that includes us. They were steered wrong because they trusted the wrong people. You can imagine how fast the sentiment around vaccines would change amongst the professional class if suddenly the NYT, WaPo, HuffPo, Democratic politicians, etc. uniformly expressed that vaccines couldn’t be trusted.
    - tehjoker 5y ago
      > The targets of vitriol should be the media and political figures who made vaccine hesitancy mainstream amongst conservatives, not individual people. Agreed. I never said I submitted anything to the sub or founded it or something. I do find it useful to see what is happening to people. A secondary reason I was there is my parents are anti-vax and comorbid and I was hoping to find something that would break their hypnosis, but it's too deep. That said, as someone that was previous conservative and my parents are conservative, I can say definitively though that conservatism is a suckers game and it should be obvious to anyone that it's a pack of lies by the cruelest and most selfish people in our society with grifters and the super-rich at the top. Liberalism isn't much better (in some ways worse because they have enough credibility with workers to do real damage sometimes without pushback). > You can imagine how fast the sentiment around vaccines would change amongst the professional class if suddenly the NYT, WaPo, HuffPo, Democratic politicians, etc. uniformly expressed that vaccines couldn’t be trusted. That reality almost happened. At the presidential debates Harris said that she wouldn't take the vaccine if Trump told her to (which was about whether it was the FDA or Trump pressuring the FDA). If they really leaned into that, we'd be in a different world right now. Like everything these days, it's psychic whiplash how fast things change.
- ufo 5y ago
  I feel like that sub is the new r/fatpeoplehate. "You see, we're just helping people to be healthier by pointing out that obesity is harmful".
Kretinsky 5y ago
I've had the covid twice in 2 years, with nothing more than having to stay in bed, feeling a bit dizzy and play Skyrim for a day before I was able to work again (wfm). Second time was much milder. I'm pretty confident I can handle a third infection without dying nor getting vaccinated. Please stop fearmongering people, if you're under 50 and have no comorbidity, you're not at risk. On the opposite side, the waiter from the coffee shop where I use to sit and read my newspaper on sunday has got a
- tehjoker 5y ago
  I'm glad you're doing okay, but long COVID is real. Also, for real, how many people do you know that have zero commodities??? Nearly everyone has one. America is fat, diabetic, and has no universal healthcare. EDIT: We should absolutely be taking care of people that got sick, but America has no social solidarity whatsoever. It's disgusting.
  - CryptoPunk 5y ago
    Long-COVID sounds like pseudo-science to me. They poll a bunch of people who have had COVID, and then attribute the reported symptoms to COVID, when there are a host of confounding factors. For example, anxiety - the most commonly reported long-COVID symptom - can easily be explained by the extreme fear surrounding COVID, or the two weeks of total isolation that all people diagnosed with COVID are prescribed. The negative impact of fear is being completely dismissed by a large cross-section of the population. Reposting what I posted above: https://twitter.com/PandaTribune/status/1440192783260655618?s=20 https://twitter.com/PandaTribune/status/1440192783260655618?... >>Great clip of Bill Maher citing a survey in which 41% of Democrats said that if you catch COVID, the chances of going to the hospital are >50%... (the correct answer is between 1% - 5%) Maher says the "liberal media needs to take responsibility for scaring the sh*t out of people"
    - tehjoker 5y ago
      Some of the symptoms could be seen as psychological, but I've read several studies that identified brain damage in imaging, lung damage, heart damage, and kidney damage. It's real. I'm writing an article on this, but the research has required so much reading and interpretation it's taking me a long time. Some long COVID symptoms are loss of the ability to regulate heart rate reliably. This causes difficulty even standing up because you need to rebalance your blood pressure! It's not every single person that gets these problems, but the population burden is and is going to be enormous. One cardiac study I read found that the closer they looked, the more heart damage they found, much of it subclinical. That subclinical damage is going to be important as you age even if you don't notice it right away. Puntmann, V.O., Carerj, M.L., Wieters, I., Fahim, M., Arendt, C., Hoffmann, J., Shchendrygina, A., Escher, F., Vasa-Nicotera, M., Zeiher, A.M., Vehreschild, M., Nagel, E., 2020. Outcomes of Cardiovascular Magnetic Resonance Imaging in Patients Recently Recovered From Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19). JAMA Cardiol 5, 1265. https://doi.org/10.1001/jamacardio.2020.3557 https://doi.org/10.1001/jamacardio.2020.3557 "To our knowledge, this is the first prospective report on a cohort of unselected patients with a recent COVID-19 infec- tion identified from a local testing center who voluntarily un- derwent evaluation for cardiac involvement with CMR. The results of our study provide important insights into the preva- lence of cardiovascular involvement in the early convales- cent stage. Our findings demonstrate that participants with a relative paucity of preexisting cardiovascular condition and with mostly home-based recovery had frequent cardiac in- flammatory involvement, which was similar to the hospital- ized subgroup with regards to severity and extent. Our obser- vations are concordant with early case reports in hospitalized patients showing a frequent presence of LGE,3,25 diffuse in- flammatory involvement,10,26 and significant rise of tropo- nin T levels.4 Unlike these previous studies, our findings re- veal that significant cardiac involvement occurs independently of the severity of original presentation and persists beyond the period of acute presentation, with no significant trend to- ward reduction of imaging or serological findings during the recovery period. Our findings may provide an indication of po- tentially considerable burden of inflammatory disease in large and growing parts of the population and urgently require con- firmation in a larger cohort. "
Kretinsky 5y ago
I've had the covid twice in 2 years, with nothing more than having to stay in bed, feeling a bit dizzy and play Skyrim for a day before I was able to work again (wfm). Second time was much milder. I'm pretty confident I can handle a third infection without dying nor getting vaccinated. Please stop fearmongering people, if you're under 50 and have no comorbidity, you're not at risk. On the opposite side, the waiter from the coffee shop where I use to sit and read my newspaper on sunday has got a sight impairment since he got vaccinated: he now sees double. His doctor refuses to believe him. Unfortunately, the pro-vax people won't help him get a new job, nor compensate for his financial loss. Deal with it, plebs.
ziml77 5y ago
The worst post I've seen on that subreddit yet was one where the wife of the person who passed away made a post that claimed god had cured her husband... by killing him. Cured through death. My head nearly exploded at that one.

dlivingston 5y ago

I hate that sub with a passion, I really do. Morbid schadenfreude at the deceased under a thin disguise of “awareness of the dangers of being anti-vax.”

sellyme 5y ago
When someone's actively trying to get those around them killed, I find it difficult to criticise anyone for not being too distressed by their passing.
- dlivingston 5y ago
  My issues are with the mocking, the doxxing, and the general atmosphere of “the vermin are extinguishing themselves and the world is better for it.”
  - sellyme 5y ago
    > the mocking It's perfectly reasonable to have a distaste for this, but I am curious as to if you take issue with this because the person in question is deceased, or if you just take issue with mocking someone under all circumstances. > the doxxing I can't say I've seen any of that. Admittedly I only ever see posts from that subreddit when they show up on r/all, so maybe it gets cleaned up on popular posts, but everything I've seen on the subreddit is just directly screenshotted from social media. > and the general atmosphere of “the vermin are extinguishing themselves and the world is better for it.” This one is really just a matter of your opinion on trolley problems. For what it's worth I'm pretty sure just about everyone on that subreddit would prefer the individuals in question have a sudden inspiration of critical thought and save their own lives.
    - dlivingston 5y ago
      We care about vaccination rates because we care about human lives - so what have we gained if we lose our humanity in the process of trying to save it.
      - sellyme 5y ago
        The lives of the people who aren't trying to get their peers killed, hopefully. If someone is so hell-bent on dying that they'll ignore every single qualified doctor telling them that they're wrong, we can't really do much about that. But at least it usually stops them from getting other people killed with the same stupidity.
        tacitusarc 5y ago
        But if you treat that situation as gleeful instead of tragic, there is something wrong with you.
        ikr678 5y ago
        I am not American, but watching the way the vaccine has been politicised, I can understand a certain level of schaudenfreude as a reaction to after the years of Trump governing to 'owning the libs'.
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
    - ziml77 5y ago
      > I'm pretty sure just about everyone on that subreddit would prefer the individuals in question have a sudden inspiration of critical thought and save their own lives. That's backed up by the praise for people who post there saying they've changed their opinion. I'm not going to lie and claim the feeling of schadenfreude isn't a factor, but it's more than that. The other reason that subreddit is happy about anti-vaxxers dying is because it means one less person spreading anti-vax sentiments (actually more since their family may stop too). However, the subreddit isn't calling for anti-vaxxers to be killed. The deaths of anti-vaxxers who die for reasons other than COVID are not celebrated.
tehjoker 5y ago
I am not sure what to think about that sub, all I know is that where I live COVID hasn't been too bad, so it gives me a window into what it's like in the rest of the country. It mostly makes me feel bad, like looking at casualty lists from WW1 except someone told them they didn't have to go over the top. It's just so senseless and pointless.
- dlivingston 5y ago
  The targets of vitriol should be the media and political figures who made vaccine hesitancy mainstream amongst conservatives, not individual people. People are blinded by the public figures and institutions that they trust - and yes, that includes us. They were steered wrong because they trusted the wrong people. You can imagine how fast the sentiment around vaccines would change amongst the professional class if suddenly the NYT, WaPo, HuffPo, Democratic politicians, etc. uniformly expressed that vaccines couldn’t be trusted.
  - tehjoker 5y ago
    > The targets of vitriol should be the media and political figures who made vaccine hesitancy mainstream amongst conservatives, not individual people. Agreed. I never said I submitted anything to the sub or founded it or something. I do find it useful to see what is happening to people. A secondary reason I was there is my parents are anti-vax and comorbid and I was hoping to find something that would break their hypnosis, but it's too deep. That said, as someone that was previous conservative and my parents are conservative, I can say definitively though that conservatism is a suckers game and it should be obvious to anyone that it's a pack of lies by the cruelest and most selfish people in our society with grifters and the super-rich at the top. Liberalism isn't much better (in some ways worse because they have enough credibility with workers to do real damage sometimes without pushback). > You can imagine how fast the sentiment around vaccines would change amongst the professional class if suddenly the NYT, WaPo, HuffPo, Democratic politicians, etc. uniformly expressed that vaccines couldn’t be trusted. That reality almost happened. At the presidential debates Harris said that she wouldn't take the vaccine if Trump told her to (which was about whether it was the FDA or Trump pressuring the FDA). If they really leaned into that, we'd be in a different world right now. Like everything these days, it's psychic whiplash how fast things change.
ufo 5y ago
I feel like that sub is the new r/fatpeoplehate. "You see, we're just helping people to be healthier by pointing out that obesity is harmful".

Kretinsky 5y ago

tehjoker 5y ago
I'm glad you're doing okay, but long COVID is real. Also, for real, how many people do you know that have zero commodities??? Nearly everyone has one. America is fat, diabetic, and has no universal healthcare. EDIT: We should absolutely be taking care of people that got sick, but America has no social solidarity whatsoever. It's disgusting.
- CryptoPunk 5y ago
  Long-COVID sounds like pseudo-science to me. They poll a bunch of people who have had COVID, and then attribute the reported symptoms to COVID, when there are a host of confounding factors. For example, anxiety - the most commonly reported long-COVID symptom - can easily be explained by the extreme fear surrounding COVID, or the two weeks of total isolation that all people diagnosed with COVID are prescribed. The negative impact of fear is being completely dismissed by a large cross-section of the population. Reposting what I posted above: https://twitter.com/PandaTribune/status/1440192783260655618?s=20 https://twitter.com/PandaTribune/status/1440192783260655618?... >>Great clip of Bill Maher citing a survey in which 41% of Democrats said that if you catch COVID, the chances of going to the hospital are >50%... (the correct answer is between 1% - 5%) Maher says the "liberal media needs to take responsibility for scaring the sh*t out of people"
  - tehjoker 5y ago
    Some of the symptoms could be seen as psychological, but I've read several studies that identified brain damage in imaging, lung damage, heart damage, and kidney damage. It's real. I'm writing an article on this, but the research has required so much reading and interpretation it's taking me a long time. Some long COVID symptoms are loss of the ability to regulate heart rate reliably. This causes difficulty even standing up because you need to rebalance your blood pressure! It's not every single person that gets these problems, but the population burden is and is going to be enormous. One cardiac study I read found that the closer they looked, the more heart damage they found, much of it subclinical. That subclinical damage is going to be important as you age even if you don't notice it right away. Puntmann, V.O., Carerj, M.L., Wieters, I., Fahim, M., Arendt, C., Hoffmann, J., Shchendrygina, A., Escher, F., Vasa-Nicotera, M., Zeiher, A.M., Vehreschild, M., Nagel, E., 2020. Outcomes of Cardiovascular Magnetic Resonance Imaging in Patients Recently Recovered From Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19). JAMA Cardiol 5, 1265. https://doi.org/10.1001/jamacardio.2020.3557 https://doi.org/10.1001/jamacardio.2020.3557 "To our knowledge, this is the first prospective report on a cohort of unselected patients with a recent COVID-19 infec- tion identified from a local testing center who voluntarily un- derwent evaluation for cardiac involvement with CMR. The results of our study provide important insights into the preva- lence of cardiovascular involvement in the early convales- cent stage. Our findings demonstrate that participants with a relative paucity of preexisting cardiovascular condition and with mostly home-based recovery had frequent cardiac in- flammatory involvement, which was similar to the hospital- ized subgroup with regards to severity and extent. Our obser- vations are concordant with early case reports in hospitalized patients showing a frequent presence of LGE,3,25 diffuse in- flammatory involvement,10,26 and significant rise of tropo- nin T levels.4 Unlike these previous studies, our findings re- veal that significant cardiac involvement occurs independently of the severity of original presentation and persists beyond the period of acute presentation, with no significant trend to- ward reduction of imaging or serological findings during the recovery period. Our findings may provide an indication of po- tentially considerable burden of inflammatory disease in large and growing parts of the population and urgently require con- firmation in a larger cohort. "

Kretinsky 5y ago

I've had the covid twice in 2 years, with nothing more than having to stay in bed, feeling a bit dizzy and play Skyrim for a day before I was able to work again (wfm). Second time was much milder. I'm pretty confident I can handle a third infection without dying nor getting vaccinated. Please stop fearmongering people, if you're under 50 and have no comorbidity, you're not at risk. On the opposite side, the waiter from the coffee shop where I use to sit and read my newspaper on sunday has got a sight impairment since he got vaccinated: he now sees double. His doctor refuses to believe him. Unfortunately, the pro-vax people won't help him get a new job, nor compensate for his financial loss. Deal with it, plebs.

ziml77 5y ago

The worst post I've seen on that subreddit yet was one where the wife of the person who passed away made a post that claimed god had cured her husband... by killing him. Cured through death. My head nearly exploded at that one.