5 ms·

Wow, I was unaware of this and was really confused why the sourcer got fired. DOJ helped software engineer salaries tremendously

shadowgovt 5y ago
Not in any way that shows up in the actual statistics.
- MisterPea 5y ago
  Oh really? That's surprising as well, I would've expected top talent to be paid more by jumping around.
  - whoisburbansky 5y ago
    Can't really get raises by jumping around if all the best options collude to keep wages own
barry-cotter 5y ago
> DOJ helped software engineer salaries tremendously No, Facebook did, by just refusing to take part in the cartel. You only need one company to start bidding up salaries for the category of employee they want to move the market if they have a big enough budget. The DOJ didn't even push for a reasonable fine, one measured in years of revenue, or reasonable punishment, like jailtime for executives and HR staff who were in on the conspiracy.
- sillysaurusx 5y ago
  Source on Facebook refusing to participate? It's one of the few bits of info that makes me like Facebook as a company.
  - the_watcher 5y ago
    Found this from 2014: https://techcrunch.com/2014/03/24/sheryl-sandberg-facebook-refused-no-poaching-agreement-with-google/ https://techcrunch.com/2014/03/24/sheryl-sandberg-facebook-r...
  - dilyevsky 5y ago
    It is well known and was in the same pile of court discovery leaks
  - lupire 5y ago
    FB has always been good to employees. Much like Microsoft (comparatively).
    - fullshark 5y ago
      Well the employees they deem worthy at least
    - speed_spread 5y ago
      The number of amoral geniuses purely driven by technical challenge is limited. Businesses making money on the edge of ethics have to treat their employees well to keep them. When there is no "big lofty goal", you need to get people motivated someway. Adtech, fintech, crypto...
  - _dark_matter_ 5y ago
    Why is this being downvoted? I didn't know it either, and it also improves my perception of FB as a company.
    - oautholaf 5y ago
      They had to refuse. They needed to grow their talent pool. The others were focused on defending against msft.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- lupire 5y ago
  That only works if you get a job offer from FB though.
  - loeg 5y ago
    The effect is systemic.
- ehsankia 5y ago
  I'm not sure if I follow. How does "not trying to hire each others employees" lead to wage cartel? Wouldn't they instead have to agree to fix their wages for that to happen?
  - bhntr3 5y ago
    This was part of the lawsuit. They communicated with each other about offers made to each other's employees and agreed not to counter-offer above the initial offer.
  - Tostino 5y ago
    It's a negative pressure on wages if you manage to get hired at one of the top companies in the country, but are unable to jump to one of the other large companies. It effectively removes the most stable companies from that employees prospects, only allowing growth if that employee moves to a smaller company.
    - ehsankia 5y ago
      Just to be sure, did they completely refuse to hire each other's employee, or did they just agree to not send emails poaching them?
  - peanutz454 5y ago
    Apple pays employee x, Google offers x*1.2, Apple could retain by offering x*1.2 (or more). Apple instead decides to collude with Google to not poach from each other. Now all companies everywhere decide to do this. Wages get fixed.
  - sangnoir 5y ago
    Empirically, within a few months after publication of Facebook refusal of a "truce" with Google, Google implemented a 10% raise across the board, and a $1,000 bonus.
AlbertCory 5y ago
A lot of those recruiters were contract employees. Maybe most of them, if they were doing cold calling like that.

shadowgovt 5y ago

Not in any way that shows up in the actual statistics.

MisterPea 5y ago
Oh really? That's surprising as well, I would've expected top talent to be paid more by jumping around.
- whoisburbansky 5y ago
  Can't really get raises by jumping around if all the best options collude to keep wages own

barry-cotter 5y ago

> DOJ helped software engineer salaries tremendously No, Facebook did, by just refusing to take part in the cartel. You only need one company to start bidding up salaries for the category of employee they want to move the market if they have a big enough budget. The DOJ didn't even push for a reasonable fine, one measured in years of revenue, or reasonable punishment, like jailtime for executives and HR staff who were in on the conspiracy.

sillysaurusx 5y ago
Source on Facebook refusing to participate? It's one of the few bits of info that makes me like Facebook as a company.
- the_watcher 5y ago
  Found this from 2014: https://techcrunch.com/2014/03/24/sheryl-sandberg-facebook-refused-no-poaching-agreement-with-google/ https://techcrunch.com/2014/03/24/sheryl-sandberg-facebook-r...
- dilyevsky 5y ago
  It is well known and was in the same pile of court discovery leaks
- lupire 5y ago
  FB has always been good to employees. Much like Microsoft (comparatively).
  - fullshark 5y ago
    Well the employees they deem worthy at least
  - speed_spread 5y ago
    The number of amoral geniuses purely driven by technical challenge is limited. Businesses making money on the edge of ethics have to treat their employees well to keep them. When there is no "big lofty goal", you need to get people motivated someway. Adtech, fintech, crypto...
- _dark_matter_ 5y ago
  Why is this being downvoted? I didn't know it either, and it also improves my perception of FB as a company.
  - oautholaf 5y ago
    They had to refuse. They needed to grow their talent pool. The others were focused on defending against msft.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
lupire 5y ago
That only works if you get a job offer from FB though.
- loeg 5y ago
  The effect is systemic.
ehsankia 5y ago
I'm not sure if I follow. How does "not trying to hire each others employees" lead to wage cartel? Wouldn't they instead have to agree to fix their wages for that to happen?
- bhntr3 5y ago
  This was part of the lawsuit. They communicated with each other about offers made to each other's employees and agreed not to counter-offer above the initial offer.
- Tostino 5y ago
  It's a negative pressure on wages if you manage to get hired at one of the top companies in the country, but are unable to jump to one of the other large companies. It effectively removes the most stable companies from that employees prospects, only allowing growth if that employee moves to a smaller company.
  - ehsankia 5y ago
    Just to be sure, did they completely refuse to hire each other's employee, or did they just agree to not send emails poaching them?
- peanutz454 5y ago
  Apple pays employee x, Google offers x*1.2, Apple could retain by offering x*1.2 (or more). Apple instead decides to collude with Google to not poach from each other. Now all companies everywhere decide to do this. Wages get fixed.
- sangnoir 5y ago
  Empirically, within a few months after publication of Facebook refusal of a "truce" with Google, Google implemented a 10% raise across the board, and a $1,000 bonus.

AlbertCory 5y ago

A lot of those recruiters were contract employees. Maybe most of them, if they were doing cold calling like that.