4 ms·

GTFO with your conspiracy theory bullshit. "Project Veritas", indeed.

belter 5y ago
I made a statement of fact supported by secretly recorded videos that I invite you to watch. I am happy to engage in discussion with you. However, I would like to mention the attitude implied by your comment, is probably more appropriate for the YouTube-Truth-Defining department...
- packetslave 5y ago
  You made a "statement of fact" supported by a link to a site where the headlines include: "Antifa indoctrination in the classroom" "Covid-19 Vaccine Exposed" "FDA Official: ‘Blow Dart’ African Americans with COVID Vaccine is ‘Where We’re Going" I think I can live without "engaging in discussion" with you.
  - belter 5y ago
    Of course some of those titles and the agendas behind them are nuts. But you are confusing the veracity or not of certain facts, with how pleasant you find the messenger... If I see a video of a US President saying no Generals recommended that US troops should stay in Afghanistan, and days later, I see the top US General saying he did recommended to the president to leave 2500 to 3500 troops on the ground...If you happen to watch it on Fox News, it does not make it untrue... In the case of some of the videos I suggested, they relate to Johnson & Johnson vaccines. Lets review, for example, some of the current Lawsuits, including number of claimants they are currently engaged in... Pending Lawsuits Against J&J as of February 2021 ================================================= DePuy ASR XL Acetabular System and DePuy ASR Hip Resurfacing System Number of Lawsuits - 550 Injuries - dislocation, loosening, metallosis (metal poisoning), revision surgeries Pinnacle Acetabular Cup Number of Lawsuits - 7,056 Injuries - dislocation, loosening, metallosis (metal poisoning), revision surgeries Xarelto Number of Lawsuits - 13,511 Injuries - severe, sometimes deadly bleeding events, blood clots, wound leaks, infection Johnson’s Talcum Powder Number of Lawsuits - 27,168 Injuries - ovarian cancer, mesothelioma cancer "The company is facing smaller, emerging litigations for the interstitial cystitis (IC) drug Elmiron and DePuy’s Attune knee implants. Elmiron litigation is in the beginning stages with a handful of cases filed in state courts, but lawyers expect hundreds more. People who filed lawsuits say Johnson & Johnson’s Janssen Pharmaceuticals unit failed to warn them that the drug could cause vision problems, particularly a condition called pigmentary maculopathy." ================================================= Does it sound like you want to get a vaccine from them? According to the CDC, and most of this thread...you are a nutter and vaccine denier if you dont.
    - alexvoda 5y ago
      Very vell, I will bite since there is no deconstruction of this yet and it will be a good workout for me. You posted a video/article of some people making some claims. What is the argument you want to support by posting that? I want you to state your argument as clear as possible so that we are not strawmannig eachother. Debate me! I will not even go into the value of that article because it immediately raises all kinds of red flags which if you are incapable of seeing, there is no point arguing about the article. Issues related to jurnalistic integrity (revealing your supposed whistleblower), deliberate cutscene use for manipulation, deliberate tangling of source material in order to string a narative , tainted entity (as GP said, which can not be ignored), and many more. These people are clearly shitty hacks. BTW, "A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on." - Winston Churchill And in this case, it did already get translated in several languages and spread everywhere in the span of at most 2 days.
      - belter 5y ago
        I am supporting two arguments: 1) Even some technical employees of Vaccine producers are skeptical of their products, particularly vaccination of children. Watch the videos as they are secret recordings of some of these employees. I am not claiming all at J&J have the same position. But its a position that currently gets you banned on YouTube and downvoted here. 2) My other argument is that this whole thread is full of claims of "vaccines safe", ignoring the error implied by the generalization that comes with it. The examples I posted of the J&J medical lawsuits show the appalling record of this company. But if you refuse a vaccine from them you are apparently somebody you should not even debate. And please dont mention the FDA... "The story of "probably the worst drug approval decision in recent US history" https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/26/politics/alzheimers-drug-aduhelm-fda-approval/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/26/politics/alzheimers-drug-...
        alexvoda 5y ago
        1.1 One of those employees is probably https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandon-schadt-48577053/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandon-schadt-48577053/ , Regional Deliver Operations for New York metropolitan area. I will just eliminate what this one said because his oppinion is irrelevant. His oppinion about the subject (safety, efficacy, importance, target of the vaccine) is irrelevant. It is worth just as much as the opinion of someone in the legal department on whether someone in a backend development team should use Python or C++ for a new company project. 1.2 That person (BS) is the only one actually claiming you don't need to vaccinate kids. He is not even claiming you should not vaccinate kids, just claiming as a personal oppinion that it is not necessary for kids. 1.3 The other one (JD) says to not vaccinate BABIES but to actually vaccinate kids once they are socialized. 1.4 JD in the video is actually pro-vaccine. The only sentence they managed to take out of context ("Don’t get the Johnson & Johnson [COVID vaccine], I didn’t tell you though,"), was in the context that he actually did get vaccinated and he got the Moderna vaccine because he believes that one is better. 1.5 So for the first point, the actual people interviewed do not even support your point. Even if the people editing the video did their best to make you believe that. Maybe you are the one who didn't watch the video. The people who made the video are so obviously selling a narative and so obviously lying through the power of video editing. 1.6 You never even claimed that all of J&J employees shared the same position. Do not get sidetracked. 1.7 You absolutely deserve to get downvoted for posting manipulative misinformation that is not even supported by the people being interviewed. You deserve to be downvoted for posting shit. This is the kind of material that does not belong on HN. And while I am against banning, it is YouTubes right to ban people/content from their platform. 2.1 Yes the claim is that vaccines in general are mostly (but not perfectly) safe. And that vaccines in general are a lot safer than the disease they prevent. And that the COVID vaccines follow the same trend and are mostly safe and definitely safer than the disease. (Note: In countries that managed to actually eliminate the disease through lockdowns, the risk calculation is different for obvious reasons) This, claim is not refuted by the link you posted. This claim has so far proven to be true. 2.2 The record of the company does not change whether the J&J vaccine is safe or not. (Is has so far proven - by third parties - to be mostly safe like the other COVID vaccines, and certainly safer than COVID.) You are however justified to be suspicios of the claims the company makes. 2.3 Even if you don't trust J&J, there is still Pfizer and Moderna. And if you don't trust mRNA technology, there is AstraZeneca. And if you don't trust the US and UK government, there is Sputnik V and some others. Your link, besides not actually supporting your point, is not relevant to all the other options. 3.1 Do not get the discussion sidetracked. The FDA/Alzheimers debate is a separate debate. 3.2 Please respect this structure when countering my arguments P.S.: I need to rant!! While writting this rebuttal was not a waste of time, watching that video definitely was. It was so unbelievably cringe. I do not know who these (your original link) conspiracy peddlers are, but they are with certainty shit. The most shit they can be. They are shit from a human pov, shit from a professional pov, shit from a integrity pov, shit from a communication pov. just shit. shit faced pieces of shit. It is unbelievably frustrating that trolling has actually become a profession. Trolling was many things pre-2010 but it was not this. Posting stuff like this is actually something you should apologize for. You should apologize to @pg, to @dang, to the rest of HN and to me for posting shit on HN. It is the kind of thing that is bound to get someone, who does not immediately dismiss you as a troll, nerd sniped in an (easy but ultimately useless and pointless) attempt to demolish such content.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- AlexandrB 5y ago
  Project Veritas has a history of editing and presenting footage in a misleading way as well as trying to plant fake stories in order to later discredit them[1]. There's an asymmetry here to you presenting information that based on past behaviour was probably published in bad faith and expecting someone to either accept that information as factual or go to the (much greater) effort of trying to debunk it. I think it's fair for anyone in this case to dismiss the information as pure noise, given the source. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Veritas#Failed_attempt_to_sting_The_Washington_Post_(2017) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Veritas#Failed_attempt...
  - belter 5y ago
    As I stated in another point in this thread...if Fox News, Donald Trump or Breitbart claim its 9.00 AM ...And it actually is 9.00 AM ...it does NOT make so that is 10.00 AM just because it come to you via those channels...
    - saalweachter 5y ago
      If a known liar tells you a thing, the correct thing to do is weight that statement with zero confidence, not to believe its opposite. You gain zero information, one way or the other.
      - belter 5y ago
        No. If a know liar tells you one thing, you should discount the fact that he might have an agenda different from yours. That is independent from your own research if those claims are true or not.

I made a statement of fact supported by secretly recorded videos that I invite you to watch. I am happy to engage in discussion with you. However, I would like to mention the attitude implied by your comment, is probably more appropriate for the YouTube-Truth-Defining department...

packetslave 5y ago
You made a "statement of fact" supported by a link to a site where the headlines include: "Antifa indoctrination in the classroom" "Covid-19 Vaccine Exposed" "FDA Official: ‘Blow Dart’ African Americans with COVID Vaccine is ‘Where We’re Going" I think I can live without "engaging in discussion" with you.
- belter 5y ago
  Of course some of those titles and the agendas behind them are nuts. But you are confusing the veracity or not of certain facts, with how pleasant you find the messenger... If I see a video of a US President saying no Generals recommended that US troops should stay in Afghanistan, and days later, I see the top US General saying he did recommended to the president to leave 2500 to 3500 troops on the ground...If you happen to watch it on Fox News, it does not make it untrue... In the case of some of the videos I suggested, they relate to Johnson & Johnson vaccines. Lets review, for example, some of the current Lawsuits, including number of claimants they are currently engaged in... Pending Lawsuits Against J&J as of February 2021 ================================================= DePuy ASR XL Acetabular System and DePuy ASR Hip Resurfacing System Number of Lawsuits - 550 Injuries - dislocation, loosening, metallosis (metal poisoning), revision surgeries Pinnacle Acetabular Cup Number of Lawsuits - 7,056 Injuries - dislocation, loosening, metallosis (metal poisoning), revision surgeries Xarelto Number of Lawsuits - 13,511 Injuries - severe, sometimes deadly bleeding events, blood clots, wound leaks, infection Johnson’s Talcum Powder Number of Lawsuits - 27,168 Injuries - ovarian cancer, mesothelioma cancer "The company is facing smaller, emerging litigations for the interstitial cystitis (IC) drug Elmiron and DePuy’s Attune knee implants. Elmiron litigation is in the beginning stages with a handful of cases filed in state courts, but lawyers expect hundreds more. People who filed lawsuits say Johnson & Johnson’s Janssen Pharmaceuticals unit failed to warn them that the drug could cause vision problems, particularly a condition called pigmentary maculopathy." ================================================= Does it sound like you want to get a vaccine from them? According to the CDC, and most of this thread...you are a nutter and vaccine denier if you dont.
  - alexvoda 5y ago
    Very vell, I will bite since there is no deconstruction of this yet and it will be a good workout for me. You posted a video/article of some people making some claims. What is the argument you want to support by posting that? I want you to state your argument as clear as possible so that we are not strawmannig eachother. Debate me! I will not even go into the value of that article because it immediately raises all kinds of red flags which if you are incapable of seeing, there is no point arguing about the article. Issues related to jurnalistic integrity (revealing your supposed whistleblower), deliberate cutscene use for manipulation, deliberate tangling of source material in order to string a narative , tainted entity (as GP said, which can not be ignored), and many more. These people are clearly shitty hacks. BTW, "A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on." - Winston Churchill And in this case, it did already get translated in several languages and spread everywhere in the span of at most 2 days.
    - belter 5y ago
      I am supporting two arguments: 1) Even some technical employees of Vaccine producers are skeptical of their products, particularly vaccination of children. Watch the videos as they are secret recordings of some of these employees. I am not claiming all at J&J have the same position. But its a position that currently gets you banned on YouTube and downvoted here. 2) My other argument is that this whole thread is full of claims of "vaccines safe", ignoring the error implied by the generalization that comes with it. The examples I posted of the J&J medical lawsuits show the appalling record of this company. But if you refuse a vaccine from them you are apparently somebody you should not even debate. And please dont mention the FDA... "The story of "probably the worst drug approval decision in recent US history" https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/26/politics/alzheimers-drug-aduhelm-fda-approval/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2021/09/26/politics/alzheimers-drug-...
      - alexvoda 5y ago
        1.1 One of those employees is probably https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandon-schadt-48577053/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/brandon-schadt-48577053/ , Regional Deliver Operations for New York metropolitan area. I will just eliminate what this one said because his oppinion is irrelevant. His oppinion about the subject (safety, efficacy, importance, target of the vaccine) is irrelevant. It is worth just as much as the opinion of someone in the legal department on whether someone in a backend development team should use Python or C++ for a new company project. 1.2 That person (BS) is the only one actually claiming you don't need to vaccinate kids. He is not even claiming you should not vaccinate kids, just claiming as a personal oppinion that it is not necessary for kids. 1.3 The other one (JD) says to not vaccinate BABIES but to actually vaccinate kids once they are socialized. 1.4 JD in the video is actually pro-vaccine. The only sentence they managed to take out of context ("Don’t get the Johnson & Johnson [COVID vaccine], I didn’t tell you though,"), was in the context that he actually did get vaccinated and he got the Moderna vaccine because he believes that one is better. 1.5 So for the first point, the actual people interviewed do not even support your point. Even if the people editing the video did their best to make you believe that. Maybe you are the one who didn't watch the video. The people who made the video are so obviously selling a narative and so obviously lying through the power of video editing. 1.6 You never even claimed that all of J&J employees shared the same position. Do not get sidetracked. 1.7 You absolutely deserve to get downvoted for posting manipulative misinformation that is not even supported by the people being interviewed. You deserve to be downvoted for posting shit. This is the kind of material that does not belong on HN. And while I am against banning, it is YouTubes right to ban people/content from their platform. 2.1 Yes the claim is that vaccines in general are mostly (but not perfectly) safe. And that vaccines in general are a lot safer than the disease they prevent. And that the COVID vaccines follow the same trend and are mostly safe and definitely safer than the disease. (Note: In countries that managed to actually eliminate the disease through lockdowns, the risk calculation is different for obvious reasons) This, claim is not refuted by the link you posted. This claim has so far proven to be true. 2.2 The record of the company does not change whether the J&J vaccine is safe or not. (Is has so far proven - by third parties - to be mostly safe like the other COVID vaccines, and certainly safer than COVID.) You are however justified to be suspicios of the claims the company makes. 2.3 Even if you don't trust J&J, there is still Pfizer and Moderna. And if you don't trust mRNA technology, there is AstraZeneca. And if you don't trust the US and UK government, there is Sputnik V and some others. Your link, besides not actually supporting your point, is not relevant to all the other options. 3.1 Do not get the discussion sidetracked. The FDA/Alzheimers debate is a separate debate. 3.2 Please respect this structure when countering my arguments P.S.: I need to rant!! While writting this rebuttal was not a waste of time, watching that video definitely was. It was so unbelievably cringe. I do not know who these (your original link) conspiracy peddlers are, but they are with certainty shit. The most shit they can be. They are shit from a human pov, shit from a professional pov, shit from a integrity pov, shit from a communication pov. just shit. shit faced pieces of shit. It is unbelievably frustrating that trolling has actually become a profession. Trolling was many things pre-2010 but it was not this. Posting stuff like this is actually something you should apologize for. You should apologize to @pg, to @dang, to the rest of HN and to me for posting shit on HN. It is the kind of thing that is bound to get someone, who does not immediately dismiss you as a troll, nerd sniped in an (easy but ultimately useless and pointless) attempt to demolish such content.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
AlexandrB 5y ago
Project Veritas has a history of editing and presenting footage in a misleading way as well as trying to plant fake stories in order to later discredit them[1]. There's an asymmetry here to you presenting information that based on past behaviour was probably published in bad faith and expecting someone to either accept that information as factual or go to the (much greater) effort of trying to debunk it. I think it's fair for anyone in this case to dismiss the information as pure noise, given the source. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Veritas#Failed_attempt_to_sting_The_Washington_Post_(2017) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Veritas#Failed_attempt...
- belter 5y ago
  As I stated in another point in this thread...if Fox News, Donald Trump or Breitbart claim its 9.00 AM ...And it actually is 9.00 AM ...it does NOT make so that is 10.00 AM just because it come to you via those channels...
  - saalweachter 5y ago
    If a known liar tells you a thing, the correct thing to do is weight that statement with zero confidence, not to believe its opposite. You gain zero information, one way or the other.
    - belter 5y ago
      No. If a know liar tells you one thing, you should discount the fact that he might have an agenda different from yours. That is independent from your own research if those claims are true or not.