8 ms·

In general, I prefer when people posting on HN post the URL to the original reporting, rather than one of the many summaries different venues write riding their

In general, I prefer when people posting on HN post the URL to the original reporting, rather than one of the many summaries different venues write riding their coat-tails. In this case, the first sentence ends in "internal documents leaked to MIT Technology Review reveal", with a link -- why not just post the MIT Technology Review article in the first place? [Also, just as an aside, don't forget that obviously many Christians are Black people]. [And also, as far as your original question, if you scroll down in the MIT Tech Review article to the charts from which the headline of this re-report come from, you'll see that the troll farms were particularly successful in their "Christian" positioning, with 19 of the top 20 pages. The other groups targetted, they didn't achieve that level of penetration. This is notable, but I agree the other groups they were targetting is also notable!]

dkarl 5y ago
To me, seeing a Christian media outlet cover the story is interesting in itself, so I think this is sufficiently different from the MIT Technology Review article to merit its own post. However, since I don't know what kind of reach Relevant Magazine has among American Christians (and I suspect it's very little) I'm surprised to see it on the front page.
- jtdev 5y ago
  Relevant Magazine is an Antifa/BLM advocate front. The previous editor was ousted by a mob of woke activist employees because he wasn't "committed" enough to their vision/ideology and efforts to use the magazine as a platform of radical leftist racism/anti-racism. Relevant is now literally encouraging their readers to contribute to Antifa/BLM bail funds: https://www.relevantmagazine.com/culture/resources-to-help-you-become-a-better-anti-racist/ https://www.relevantmagazine.com/culture/resources-to-help-y...
  - dkarl 5y ago
    They seem pretty open about their beliefs, so I'm not sure why you call them a "front."
  - balancemayvary 5y ago
    If you oppose the idea that Black Lives Matter, that's a white supremacist talking point. If [anonymous, spontaneously organizing locals counter-protesting white supremacists aka] Anti-fascists oppose you...it's because you're being an asshole.
    - sidlls 5y ago
      What if I disagree with some of the approaches of BLM activists?
      - balancemayvary 5y ago
        You are free to disagree, but that doesn't change the facts of the matter. A youtube channel by Saint Andrewism is a wonderful educational source which covers all the matters at hand in detail. In particular, you may be interested in the history discussed in "The case against the Gu!IIotine", as well as "Nonviolence, a path to freedom?" I'd also suggest Beau of the 5th Column; he has bite-sized five minute "Let's talk about"s which address specific current events as they develop, and add context via a short history lesson. I'd finally point out that the State Monopoly on Violence is inherent. I'd also point out that MLK was white-washed, and that neoliberal white culture curated the parts of his speeches what suited it. I'd love to tell people that violence isn't the answer, but I can't do that unless I'm ready to feed them. This quote, too, also is logical to me: Malatesta: "Violence .. is eminently corrupting." largely paraphrasing this one but it rings true to the authors original sentiment. So, in short, you can feel lucky, because you have the privilege to take whichever side in debate you choose, and you don't have to feel the collective grief and anxiety [which comes with] being targeted for something as arbitrary as the amount of melanin in your epidermis.
        xupybd 5y ago
        I think the argument isn't generally that non violence is always the only option it's that the current situation doesn't warrant violence. I understand this is a subjective point of view as it is in response to police violence. If things are as bad as the media suggests, that racist cops are targeting and killing black men and getting away with it then yes they system needs to be over thrown and the argument to use violence is easy to make. But many don't believe things are that bad. I don't know as I don't live in these neighborhoods. But I think it's valuable to examine why people disagree on the issue.
  - jrochkind1 5y ago
    I encourage people to contribute to all kinds of things I'm not a "front" for. ??? Clearly, they are sympathetic to Black Lives Matter, and don't particularly hide it, it's right there on the page! "Front" to me implies that a) they are operated by the thing, not just sympathetic, and b) they try to hide that fact. Those things don't appear to be true? But sure, you can tell people they are sympathetic to Black Lives Matter movement, if you think this is important context for their facebook reporting re-posts, why not. About half of the USA would currently apparently agree, and half disagree, with that sympathy. (I don't think the half that would agree are all 'fronts'!) I don't know if they are sympathetic to "antifa" or not (which is not the same thing or people as Black Lives Matter, despite right-wing talking points), but... I am, personally.
    - balancemayvary 5y ago
      I'm certainly in favor of contributing to bail funds, which is a pretty basic part of the legal system (like it or not), and which is not even the same thing as legal-defense funding. It's quite milque-toast, yet ignored. Bail was designed to ensure the defendant arrives at the trial by taking a fraction of their wealth as collateral. Instead, we now live in a society where most americans cannot afford a surprise $500 bill. We're really stuck-in-first-gear here if this is what we settle for.
cecilpl2 5y ago
It seems like the original reporting was posted two weeks ago, and generated little to no discussion. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28565121 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28565121
- colpabar 5y ago
  >Troll farms reached 140M Americans a month on FB before 2020 elections I can imagine most of HN sees a headline that boils down to "lots of stuff on facebook is fake" and not care. A headline with a clear subject that people can love/hate is much better clickbait.
SkyMarshal 5y ago
A little late here but just want to add, the original MIT article is paywalled if you’ve read more than your 2 free monthly stories there. The Relevant magazine story is not. Also it is of interest that a Christian culture magazine is reporting on this, as that’s the kind of thing that needs to happen en masse to fix this problem. It needs to become a main topic of discussion in the communities being targeted by troll farms, and not just in tech circles. That this article shows that is happening is newsworthy in and of itself.

dkarl 5y ago

To me, seeing a Christian media outlet cover the story is interesting in itself, so I think this is sufficiently different from the MIT Technology Review article to merit its own post. However, since I don't know what kind of reach Relevant Magazine has among American Christians (and I suspect it's very little) I'm surprised to see it on the front page.

jtdev 5y ago
Relevant Magazine is an Antifa/BLM advocate front. The previous editor was ousted by a mob of woke activist employees because he wasn't "committed" enough to their vision/ideology and efforts to use the magazine as a platform of radical leftist racism/anti-racism. Relevant is now literally encouraging their readers to contribute to Antifa/BLM bail funds: https://www.relevantmagazine.com/culture/resources-to-help-you-become-a-better-anti-racist/ https://www.relevantmagazine.com/culture/resources-to-help-y...
- dkarl 5y ago
  They seem pretty open about their beliefs, so I'm not sure why you call them a "front."
- balancemayvary 5y ago
  If you oppose the idea that Black Lives Matter, that's a white supremacist talking point. If [anonymous, spontaneously organizing locals counter-protesting white supremacists aka] Anti-fascists oppose you...it's because you're being an asshole.
  - sidlls 5y ago
    What if I disagree with some of the approaches of BLM activists?
    - balancemayvary 5y ago
      You are free to disagree, but that doesn't change the facts of the matter. A youtube channel by Saint Andrewism is a wonderful educational source which covers all the matters at hand in detail. In particular, you may be interested in the history discussed in "The case against the Gu!IIotine", as well as "Nonviolence, a path to freedom?" I'd also suggest Beau of the 5th Column; he has bite-sized five minute "Let's talk about"s which address specific current events as they develop, and add context via a short history lesson. I'd finally point out that the State Monopoly on Violence is inherent. I'd also point out that MLK was white-washed, and that neoliberal white culture curated the parts of his speeches what suited it. I'd love to tell people that violence isn't the answer, but I can't do that unless I'm ready to feed them. This quote, too, also is logical to me: Malatesta: "Violence .. is eminently corrupting." largely paraphrasing this one but it rings true to the authors original sentiment. So, in short, you can feel lucky, because you have the privilege to take whichever side in debate you choose, and you don't have to feel the collective grief and anxiety [which comes with] being targeted for something as arbitrary as the amount of melanin in your epidermis.
      - xupybd 5y ago
        I think the argument isn't generally that non violence is always the only option it's that the current situation doesn't warrant violence. I understand this is a subjective point of view as it is in response to police violence. If things are as bad as the media suggests, that racist cops are targeting and killing black men and getting away with it then yes they system needs to be over thrown and the argument to use violence is easy to make. But many don't believe things are that bad. I don't know as I don't live in these neighborhoods. But I think it's valuable to examine why people disagree on the issue.
- jrochkind1 5y ago
  I encourage people to contribute to all kinds of things I'm not a "front" for. ??? Clearly, they are sympathetic to Black Lives Matter, and don't particularly hide it, it's right there on the page! "Front" to me implies that a) they are operated by the thing, not just sympathetic, and b) they try to hide that fact. Those things don't appear to be true? But sure, you can tell people they are sympathetic to Black Lives Matter movement, if you think this is important context for their facebook reporting re-posts, why not. About half of the USA would currently apparently agree, and half disagree, with that sympathy. (I don't think the half that would agree are all 'fronts'!) I don't know if they are sympathetic to "antifa" or not (which is not the same thing or people as Black Lives Matter, despite right-wing talking points), but... I am, personally.
  - balancemayvary 5y ago
    I'm certainly in favor of contributing to bail funds, which is a pretty basic part of the legal system (like it or not), and which is not even the same thing as legal-defense funding. It's quite milque-toast, yet ignored. Bail was designed to ensure the defendant arrives at the trial by taking a fraction of their wealth as collateral. Instead, we now live in a society where most americans cannot afford a surprise $500 bill. We're really stuck-in-first-gear here if this is what we settle for.

cecilpl2 5y ago

It seems like the original reporting was posted two weeks ago, and generated little to no discussion. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28565121 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28565121

colpabar 5y ago
>Troll farms reached 140M Americans a month on FB before 2020 elections I can imagine most of HN sees a headline that boils down to "lots of stuff on facebook is fake" and not care. A headline with a clear subject that people can love/hate is much better clickbait.

SkyMarshal 5y ago

A little late here but just want to add, the original MIT article is paywalled if you’ve read more than your 2 free monthly stories there. The Relevant magazine story is not. Also it is of interest that a Christian culture magazine is reporting on this, as that’s the kind of thing that needs to happen en masse to fix this problem. It needs to become a main topic of discussion in the communities being targeted by troll farms, and not just in tech circles. That this article shows that is happening is newsworthy in and of itself.