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3129 kg is incredibly heavy, I wonder how well the batteries cope in cold climates (say 10 to -15 degrees c) - that's been a big limiting factor for utility EVs

3129 kg is incredibly heavy, I wonder how well the batteries cope in cold climates (say 10 to -15 degrees c) - that's been a big limiting factor for utility EVs in New Zealand and I'm sure other countries.

newacct583 5y ago
Heat pumps have largely solved the battery capacity problems with cold batteries (though not the fast charging rate). I don't have numbers for Rivian, but heater-equipped EVs from other manufacturers now routinely post numbers in frigid temperatures that are under 20% range degradation. You're basically just paying for the extra energy to run the heater.
- smcleod 5y ago
  Ah that's good to know thank you!
- redisman 5y ago
  From what I’ve seen only a few models have a heat pump if you were to buy today so buyer beware. It might be technically solved but it’s still an issue if you want to buy an EV in the next few years.
jillesvangurp 5y ago
Apparently, Rivian did some low temperature testing earlier this year: https://electrek.co/2021/02/27/rivian-tests-r1t-electric-pickup-in-sub-zero-temperatures/ https://electrek.co/2021/02/27/rivian-tests-r1t-electric-pic.... They tested with -40 degrees, which oddly is the same in Celsius and Fahrenheit. It keeps the batteries at 14 degrees fahrenheit, which is still -10 Celsius for optimum battery performance. So, -10 Celsius and above should be fine. It will obviously use a bit extra energy for that heating below that. Norway is actually banning fuel car sales in a few years (2025) and already has more than 50% market share for EVs thanks to their policies and incentives. So, while there are some challenges, it's not a show stopper for a country that regularly sees such temperatures give a large part of it is north of the polar circle (66.6 degrees). Temperature management is an issue of course but a lot of EVs actively manage the temperature of their batteries now (except some of the cheaper ones). Also, lots of ICE cars have issues with extreme temperatures. Good luck starting a Diesel with -40. The viscosity of the fuel becomes an issue. Norway works around this by having a lot of infrastructure to keep car engines heated (even petrol cars) while they park. This now doubles as charging infrastructure and of course their grid is 100% renewable (hydro). Also they use fuel additives to keep the fuel viscosity a bit lower. So, remote areas in New Zealand might be a bit lacking on the infrastructure side but as long as you can plug it in where you park, it should be fine.
- atombender 5y ago
  > Norway is actually banning fuel car sales in a few years (2025) There is no ban. This is a misconception that has been widely repeated in the media. There are only talks of a ban. https://roadmapsforenergy.eu/norway-fossilfuel-car-ban/ https://roadmapsforenergy.eu/norway-fossilfuel-car-ban/ https://energiogklima.no/nyhet/bilparken-bare-nullutslippsbiler-fra-2025/ https://energiogklima.no/nyhet/bilparken-bare-nullutslippsbi...
  - jillesvangurp 5y ago
    It seems you are right. However, they did just have elections and the left wing opposition that ran on a pro climate agenda won by quite large margin. That and the current reality of most sales already being EVs makes a 2025 cut off quite possible for ICE vehicle sales. I'd say that talk just got a bit more serious.

newacct583 5y ago

Heat pumps have largely solved the battery capacity problems with cold batteries (though not the fast charging rate). I don't have numbers for Rivian, but heater-equipped EVs from other manufacturers now routinely post numbers in frigid temperatures that are under 20% range degradation. You're basically just paying for the extra energy to run the heater.

smcleod 5y ago
Ah that's good to know thank you!
redisman 5y ago
From what I’ve seen only a few models have a heat pump if you were to buy today so buyer beware. It might be technically solved but it’s still an issue if you want to buy an EV in the next few years.

jillesvangurp 5y ago

Apparently, Rivian did some low temperature testing earlier this year: https://electrek.co/2021/02/27/rivian-tests-r1t-electric-pickup-in-sub-zero-temperatures/ https://electrek.co/2021/02/27/rivian-tests-r1t-electric-pic.... They tested with -40 degrees, which oddly is the same in Celsius and Fahrenheit. It keeps the batteries at 14 degrees fahrenheit, which is still -10 Celsius for optimum battery performance. So, -10 Celsius and above should be fine. It will obviously use a bit extra energy for that heating below that. Norway is actually banning fuel car sales in a few years (2025) and already has more than 50% market share for EVs thanks to their policies and incentives. So, while there are some challenges, it's not a show stopper for a country that regularly sees such temperatures give a large part of it is north of the polar circle (66.6 degrees). Temperature management is an issue of course but a lot of EVs actively manage the temperature of their batteries now (except some of the cheaper ones). Also, lots of ICE cars have issues with extreme temperatures. Good luck starting a Diesel with -40. The viscosity of the fuel becomes an issue. Norway works around this by having a lot of infrastructure to keep car engines heated (even petrol cars) while they park. This now doubles as charging infrastructure and of course their grid is 100% renewable (hydro). Also they use fuel additives to keep the fuel viscosity a bit lower. So, remote areas in New Zealand might be a bit lacking on the infrastructure side but as long as you can plug it in where you park, it should be fine.

atombender 5y ago
> Norway is actually banning fuel car sales in a few years (2025) There is no ban. This is a misconception that has been widely repeated in the media. There are only talks of a ban. https://roadmapsforenergy.eu/norway-fossilfuel-car-ban/ https://roadmapsforenergy.eu/norway-fossilfuel-car-ban/ https://energiogklima.no/nyhet/bilparken-bare-nullutslippsbiler-fra-2025/ https://energiogklima.no/nyhet/bilparken-bare-nullutslippsbi...
- jillesvangurp 5y ago
  It seems you are right. However, they did just have elections and the left wing opposition that ran on a pro climate agenda won by quite large margin. That and the current reality of most sales already being EVs makes a 2025 cut off quite possible for ICE vehicle sales. I'd say that talk just got a bit more serious.