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On the other hand, I do want that. I've been at my company a long time. I realize at times I probably could have done better financially job hopping, so under

On the other hand, I do want that. I've been at my company a long time. I realize at times I probably could have done better financially job hopping, so understand that aspect. But with that tenure comes friendships that border on brotherhood, and a lot of respect. I sure wouldn't be fired for lack of production if my wife was dying of brain cancer, like the article floating around earlier today.

lazide 5y ago
A lot of people have thought that over the years. I’ve seen several be severely disappointed. All of the ones I personally knew, unfortunately, died well before their time due to the stress. :(
- silisili 5y ago
  Sorry to hear that. Out of curiosity, could you clarify what 'thought that' was, or what contributed to stress? Job hopping or staying?
  - lazide 5y ago
    They had full insurance through their employer, thought the employer would have their back if something happened, then..... For person 1, their wife got cancer. The wife was covered through their insurance plan, and the HR department saw that it was likely to be very, very expensive to cover them, so they started a program of systematic harassment against person 1 until they resigned. The wife died of cancer shortly afterwards, but not until racking several hundred thousand dollars worth of medical bills. Her death was partially due to lack of coverage and stress resulting in difficulty in effective treatment. Person 1 got a heart attack and died within 2 years of resigning, and roughly a year after his wife died. The employer was a small municipal government in California. For person 2, the employer was attempting to makeup a cash shortfall, and was pressuring a number of employees to accept early retirement (at greatly reduced payout for their plan) or quit, especially older employees. Management in a number of divisions started to go around and pressure employees over 55 (quite obviously) to take the buyout, and for those who wouldn't, they started to apply tougher and tougher (and obviously unfair) work standards to them so they could fire them or push them out, which they did to several people who I did not know successfully. Several friends ended up taking the offer and quitting because they saw the writing on the wall, one of them, who stayed on roughly 6 months past the others quitting, had a stroke on the job due to stress and died. He stayed because he felt he didn't have much choice as he was the bread earner in the family, and they had not hit the point he would get a meaningful payout on his retirement, but was too old to go somewhere else (he was in his late 50's). The second one, my mother was one of the ones who took the early payout, and I'm glad she did. She was having heart arrhythmias due to the stress. Magically they cleared up within a month of leaving, and she hasn't had a problem since. She lost somewhere on the order of 50k from her retirement benefits because of it, however. That said, one of my grandfathers worked for a union and a major shipyard in the 50-70's, and his pension and retirement medical coverage had his back faithfully and with good coverage until he died - at 96. So it isn't all bad. It is a lot of faith to place in an organization however.
mdavis6890 5y ago
It's not about job-hopping at all - I could easily imagine staying with a company a long time if I was happy there. Implicit in the "care for you later" agreement is "by underpaying you now." Whatever a company is setting aside for you later - or just promising you will be there later - could instead just be paid to you now. You might think of it as "AND," but it's really always inherently "OR." Another difference is that there are many strings placed on the future implied promises and care, such as you staying with that organization for a long time. So you can get paid in promises, or you can get paid in money. I want to get paid in money, and if I need security I can invest, buy all types of insurance, etc. No reason my employer needs to do that for me, any more than I need them to buy my groceries.

lazide 5y ago

A lot of people have thought that over the years. I’ve seen several be severely disappointed. All of the ones I personally knew, unfortunately, died well before their time due to the stress. :(

silisili 5y ago
Sorry to hear that. Out of curiosity, could you clarify what 'thought that' was, or what contributed to stress? Job hopping or staying?
- lazide 5y ago
  They had full insurance through their employer, thought the employer would have their back if something happened, then..... For person 1, their wife got cancer. The wife was covered through their insurance plan, and the HR department saw that it was likely to be very, very expensive to cover them, so they started a program of systematic harassment against person 1 until they resigned. The wife died of cancer shortly afterwards, but not until racking several hundred thousand dollars worth of medical bills. Her death was partially due to lack of coverage and stress resulting in difficulty in effective treatment. Person 1 got a heart attack and died within 2 years of resigning, and roughly a year after his wife died. The employer was a small municipal government in California. For person 2, the employer was attempting to makeup a cash shortfall, and was pressuring a number of employees to accept early retirement (at greatly reduced payout for their plan) or quit, especially older employees. Management in a number of divisions started to go around and pressure employees over 55 (quite obviously) to take the buyout, and for those who wouldn't, they started to apply tougher and tougher (and obviously unfair) work standards to them so they could fire them or push them out, which they did to several people who I did not know successfully. Several friends ended up taking the offer and quitting because they saw the writing on the wall, one of them, who stayed on roughly 6 months past the others quitting, had a stroke on the job due to stress and died. He stayed because he felt he didn't have much choice as he was the bread earner in the family, and they had not hit the point he would get a meaningful payout on his retirement, but was too old to go somewhere else (he was in his late 50's). The second one, my mother was one of the ones who took the early payout, and I'm glad she did. She was having heart arrhythmias due to the stress. Magically they cleared up within a month of leaving, and she hasn't had a problem since. She lost somewhere on the order of 50k from her retirement benefits because of it, however. That said, one of my grandfathers worked for a union and a major shipyard in the 50-70's, and his pension and retirement medical coverage had his back faithfully and with good coverage until he died - at 96. So it isn't all bad. It is a lot of faith to place in an organization however.

mdavis6890 5y ago

It's not about job-hopping at all - I could easily imagine staying with a company a long time if I was happy there. Implicit in the "care for you later" agreement is "by underpaying you now." Whatever a company is setting aside for you later - or just promising you will be there later - could instead just be paid to you now. You might think of it as "AND," but it's really always inherently "OR." Another difference is that there are many strings placed on the future implied promises and care, such as you staying with that organization for a long time. So you can get paid in promises, or you can get paid in money. I want to get paid in money, and if I need security I can invest, buy all types of insurance, etc. No reason my employer needs to do that for me, any more than I need them to buy my groceries.