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So one business / structure will use 1/200th of all water? That does sound like a lot.

bottled_poe 5y ago
That’s one metric for impact. Perhaps you can think of some other metrics to compare it to before influencing the reader’s opinion?
baron_harkonnen 5y ago
Not to mention that industry itself only accounts for 6% of Arizona's water usage [0] so we're talking about one single structure increasing the industrial usage by ~10%. [0]
- PragmaticPulp 5y ago
  Industry is a surprisingly small portion of water consumption in many places. In many states, household water use (including lawns) can handily exceed the water used by industry. Using this water for domestic chip making is arguably a very reasonable use of water. If we’re going to start cutting water usage, let’s start with things like golf courses in the desert instead of critical chip-making infrastructure.
  - throwaway894345 5y ago
    I feel a bit of tension. I'm not a big fan of people using water to grow grass in the desert, but I'm also not a big fan of making tens or hundreds of thousands of people sacrifice so that one large corporation can profit. Yeah, I know that chip manufacturing helps everyone by improving our economic independence, and that's not a small thing, but we're already writing Intel a big check and they obviously benefit from the profits of the chips they will manufacture (assuming they manage it correctly and it doesn't just get left behind for cheaper foreign manufacturing the moment the market economics change). Maybe chip manufacture really benefits from being somewhere arid, and that's probably just pretty incompatible with water conservation?
    - selectodude 5y ago
      Chip manufacturing benefits from somewhere that has very predictable weather and low/no seismic activity.
    - NikolaeVarius 5y ago
      Its fucking lawn grass. Its one of the most worthless things in the world and a complete waste of resources. At least chips do something other than sit there wasting water.
      - throwaway894345 5y ago
        I agree. But the idea of asking tens or hundreds of thousands to give up their frivolities so a single corporation can profit strikes a nerve in me, however irrational it may be. I'm not reflexively anti-corporation--corporations are economically necessary--but I guess I'm touchy about the question of whether people exist for corporations or corporations for people.
        ryan93 5y ago
        They can keep their lawn. She’s should just have to pay more money since the water has more valuable uses elsewhere
        8note 5y ago
        Itel can also move somewhere else. It's bad coming into a community and telling everyone their water costs more now because you want a lot of it. If anything, Intel should pay them to get rid of their lawn
        ryan93 5y ago
        The article didnt say water prices are increasing. They get most of their water from recycling what they use. Regardless filling a pot of water for pasta would go from a fraction of a penny to a fraction of a penny even if intel increased their water use ten fold
kspacewalk2 5y ago
Definitely sounds like a lot. Perhaps conservation efforts are in order, to reduce water waste by ~1% to allow for this strategically important, high value added industry to develop further. Thankfully, water waste is so rife in Arizona that it shouldn't be all that difficult to do so.
- Nbox9 5y ago
  Maybe, if there are important reasons why this factory should be in a desert state. I think everyone agrees that chips are vitally important now, but chip shortages aren’t nearly as bad as a water shortage is.
apocalyptic0n3 5y ago
Not exactly. Fabs use a lot of water to run, but it's mostly self-contained with very little loss. I can't remember the exact number, but the fabs Intel already have in Phoenix only lose around 4-5% of the water. The rest is reclaimed and recirculated. I believe the two breaking ground today will be even more efficient, possibly even net producers once rain water and other sources are taken into account. It's been a few months since I read into it, though, so I may be misremembering
- mistrial9 5y ago
  net producers of water? check this please

That’s one metric for impact. Perhaps you can think of some other metrics to compare it to before influencing the reader’s opinion?

baron_harkonnen 5y ago

Not to mention that industry itself only accounts for 6% of Arizona's water usage [0] so we're talking about one single structure increasing the industrial usage by ~10%. [0]

PragmaticPulp 5y ago
Industry is a surprisingly small portion of water consumption in many places. In many states, household water use (including lawns) can handily exceed the water used by industry. Using this water for domestic chip making is arguably a very reasonable use of water. If we’re going to start cutting water usage, let’s start with things like golf courses in the desert instead of critical chip-making infrastructure.
- throwaway894345 5y ago
  I feel a bit of tension. I'm not a big fan of people using water to grow grass in the desert, but I'm also not a big fan of making tens or hundreds of thousands of people sacrifice so that one large corporation can profit. Yeah, I know that chip manufacturing helps everyone by improving our economic independence, and that's not a small thing, but we're already writing Intel a big check and they obviously benefit from the profits of the chips they will manufacture (assuming they manage it correctly and it doesn't just get left behind for cheaper foreign manufacturing the moment the market economics change). Maybe chip manufacture really benefits from being somewhere arid, and that's probably just pretty incompatible with water conservation?
  - selectodude 5y ago
    Chip manufacturing benefits from somewhere that has very predictable weather and low/no seismic activity.
  - NikolaeVarius 5y ago
    Its fucking lawn grass. Its one of the most worthless things in the world and a complete waste of resources. At least chips do something other than sit there wasting water.
    - throwaway894345 5y ago
      I agree. But the idea of asking tens or hundreds of thousands to give up their frivolities so a single corporation can profit strikes a nerve in me, however irrational it may be. I'm not reflexively anti-corporation--corporations are economically necessary--but I guess I'm touchy about the question of whether people exist for corporations or corporations for people.
      - ryan93 5y ago
        They can keep their lawn. She’s should just have to pay more money since the water has more valuable uses elsewhere
        8note 5y ago
        Itel can also move somewhere else. It's bad coming into a community and telling everyone their water costs more now because you want a lot of it. If anything, Intel should pay them to get rid of their lawn
        ryan93 5y ago
        The article didnt say water prices are increasing. They get most of their water from recycling what they use. Regardless filling a pot of water for pasta would go from a fraction of a penny to a fraction of a penny even if intel increased their water use ten fold

kspacewalk2 5y ago

Definitely sounds like a lot. Perhaps conservation efforts are in order, to reduce water waste by ~1% to allow for this strategically important, high value added industry to develop further. Thankfully, water waste is so rife in Arizona that it shouldn't be all that difficult to do so.

Nbox9 5y ago
Maybe, if there are important reasons why this factory should be in a desert state. I think everyone agrees that chips are vitally important now, but chip shortages aren’t nearly as bad as a water shortage is.

apocalyptic0n3 5y ago

Not exactly. Fabs use a lot of water to run, but it's mostly self-contained with very little loss. I can't remember the exact number, but the fabs Intel already have in Phoenix only lose around 4-5% of the water. The rest is reclaimed and recirculated. I believe the two breaking ground today will be even more efficient, possibly even net producers once rain water and other sources are taken into account. It's been a few months since I read into it, though, so I may be misremembering

mistrial9 5y ago
net producers of water? check this please