Right, that's true. I just figured I'd offer a perspective that I haven't seen yet in the thread. Crappy programs are, in my view, a sham, but in my field they'

Right, that's true. I just figured I'd offer a perspective that I haven't seen yet in the thread. Crappy programs are, in my view, a sham, but in my field they're still a pathway to stable work. There are plenty of schools that won't hire PhDs from top schools because they know they won't stay. Second- and third-tier PhDs fill those positions. The pay is abysmal, but most of the people choose to stick it out make their peace -- and live very cheap places. But maybe I should be using the past tense. There has been no job market at any tier since the pandemic started, and I'm told universities are seizing the opportunity to make that permanent.