6 ms·

I don't know but for some reason this article feels like one of those things - which is what will be see in a show 20 years from now about where/how it all star

I don't know but for some reason this article feels like one of those things - which is what will be see in a show 20 years from now about where/how it all started. Like the guys from 1980s talking about video games in the recent Netflix documentary 'high score', where some people started spending 8+ hours a day playing games with really primitive graphics because it was just enough to be enjoyable. VR now seems like something that is almost finally ready to explode and like the atari or iphone is going to change all our lives forever.

titzer 5y ago
I can tell you what, that much screen time right on your face is going to fucking ruin millions of eyes.
- ianlevesque 5y ago
  The actual focal distance on a Quest 2 is about six feet, that's further away than I keep my desk monitors.
  - titzer 5y ago
    The issue isn't (only) the focal distance. The difference is that your desk monitors don't encapsulate your entire eye cavities and cause pupil dilation, pumping blue light directly onto your retinas, which has been suspected to accelerate macular degeneration, night-blindness, and dry eye, as well as cause poor sleep. https://www.webmd.com/eye-health/blue-light-health https://www.webmd.com/eye-health/blue-light-health
    - Loocid 5y ago
      Can't you use blue light filters in VR like you can with regular monitors (eg Flux or Windows Night light)?
      - dougmwne 5y ago
        Yes, that is a system level software option in the Oculus menu, along with brightness control.
- westoncb 5y ago
  Is there some basis for thinking that? AFAICT your eyes/brain seem to overlook the physical location of the screen and are tricked into variably focusing based on simulated depth.
  - titzer 5y ago
    It's not just focal distance, but also accommodation and general eye coordination. (Today's) VR screws up your visual neurological systems and studies show this: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0003687019301085 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S00036...
    - Kiro 5y ago
      Worth it.
    - frankenst1 5y ago
      Are "focal distance" and "accomodation" separate issues? Isn't accomodation focusing on an object at a certain distance?
      - titzer 5y ago
        Sorry, I meant to also mention convergence, which is the movement of the two eyes together to focus on near objects because of line-of-sight. This is perhaps the bigger problem.
  - ux-app 5y ago
    >are tricked into variably focusing based on simulated depth No, the focal distance in a headset is fixed. The light hitting your eye is always coming in at the same angle.
paul7986 5y ago
Yes VR a technology that's been around since the 90s is finally going to take off ... maybe ...can anyone name another technology that started decades before and later became a product that changed the world like the iPhone? Why would I want to wear a headset strapped to my face for hours to interact with memojis of my co-workers? I've definitely tried out VR games in the past few years ... cool, but novel fun and the headset strapped to my face annoyed me.
- dcx 5y ago
  Yes, lots of technologies work like that. Solar panels. Deep learning in pretty much its modern form was invented decades ago, but had to wait for the hardware to get good enough to show results. Personal computing took decades to take off. Heavier than air travel spent centuries as a curiosity. Tipping points are fundamental to the nature of reality. Technology improves through decades of little tweaks and incremental improvements, which can sometimes bring a technology to a point where it's optimal and suddenly dominates the landscape.
  - paul7986 5y ago
    Sure I agree with you but the cellphone brief case of the 90s looks way different our iPhones. The form factor basic idea of VR hasn't changed since the 90s which is still strap a bulky headset to your face. Prescription or sunglasses aren't bulky ..what humans have worn for possibly centuries. Maybe it will finally change how we play video games but working virtually with my coworkers emojis for 8 hours or long periods of time with a headset strapped to my face is lol
- Sohcahtoa82 5y ago
  Do not confuse the existence of a technology with its viability as a consumer product. VR may have been invented in the 90s, but it likely wasn't until a few years ago that we could do it well enough and cheaply enough to make it worthwhile for consumer-level gamers. VR in the 90s was incredibly low resolution and and had low framerates, not to mention thousands of dollars and with shitty latency. It was ugly and nauseating. To make VR useable for consumers, it had to be semi-affordable and attractive. It wasn't until the last 10 years as small high-DPI LCD screens dropped in price and PCs could render at the 90+ fps needed to keep latency low (And really, since it's 90+ fps PER EYE, it's really rendering at 180 fps) that VR became viable.

titzer 5y ago

I can tell you what, that much screen time right on your face is going to fucking ruin millions of eyes.

ianlevesque 5y ago
The actual focal distance on a Quest 2 is about six feet, that's further away than I keep my desk monitors.
- titzer 5y ago
  The issue isn't (only) the focal distance. The difference is that your desk monitors don't encapsulate your entire eye cavities and cause pupil dilation, pumping blue light directly onto your retinas, which has been suspected to accelerate macular degeneration, night-blindness, and dry eye, as well as cause poor sleep. https://www.webmd.com/eye-health/blue-light-health https://www.webmd.com/eye-health/blue-light-health
  - Loocid 5y ago
    Can't you use blue light filters in VR like you can with regular monitors (eg Flux or Windows Night light)?
    - dougmwne 5y ago
      Yes, that is a system level software option in the Oculus menu, along with brightness control.
westoncb 5y ago
Is there some basis for thinking that? AFAICT your eyes/brain seem to overlook the physical location of the screen and are tricked into variably focusing based on simulated depth.
- titzer 5y ago
  It's not just focal distance, but also accommodation and general eye coordination. (Today's) VR screws up your visual neurological systems and studies show this: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0003687019301085 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S00036...
  - Kiro 5y ago
    Worth it.
  - frankenst1 5y ago
    Are "focal distance" and "accomodation" separate issues? Isn't accomodation focusing on an object at a certain distance?
    - titzer 5y ago
      Sorry, I meant to also mention convergence, which is the movement of the two eyes together to focus on near objects because of line-of-sight. This is perhaps the bigger problem.
- ux-app 5y ago
  >are tricked into variably focusing based on simulated depth No, the focal distance in a headset is fixed. The light hitting your eye is always coming in at the same angle.

paul7986 5y ago

Yes VR a technology that's been around since the 90s is finally going to take off ... maybe ...can anyone name another technology that started decades before and later became a product that changed the world like the iPhone? Why would I want to wear a headset strapped to my face for hours to interact with memojis of my co-workers? I've definitely tried out VR games in the past few years ... cool, but novel fun and the headset strapped to my face annoyed me.

dcx 5y ago
Yes, lots of technologies work like that. Solar panels. Deep learning in pretty much its modern form was invented decades ago, but had to wait for the hardware to get good enough to show results. Personal computing took decades to take off. Heavier than air travel spent centuries as a curiosity. Tipping points are fundamental to the nature of reality. Technology improves through decades of little tweaks and incremental improvements, which can sometimes bring a technology to a point where it's optimal and suddenly dominates the landscape.
- paul7986 5y ago
  Sure I agree with you but the cellphone brief case of the 90s looks way different our iPhones. The form factor basic idea of VR hasn't changed since the 90s which is still strap a bulky headset to your face. Prescription or sunglasses aren't bulky ..what humans have worn for possibly centuries. Maybe it will finally change how we play video games but working virtually with my coworkers emojis for 8 hours or long periods of time with a headset strapped to my face is lol
Sohcahtoa82 5y ago
Do not confuse the existence of a technology with its viability as a consumer product. VR may have been invented in the 90s, but it likely wasn't until a few years ago that we could do it well enough and cheaply enough to make it worthwhile for consumer-level gamers. VR in the 90s was incredibly low resolution and and had low framerates, not to mention thousands of dollars and with shitty latency. It was ugly and nauseating. To make VR useable for consumers, it had to be semi-affordable and attractive. It wasn't until the last 10 years as small high-DPI LCD screens dropped in price and PCs could render at the 90+ fps needed to keep latency low (And really, since it's 90+ fps PER EYE, it's really rendering at 180 fps) that VR became viable.