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I don't get it. What do these people would be doing with such data? Ok, they know that a certain Facebook account named John Doe is likely to be a male, between

I don't get it. What do these people would be doing with such data? Ok, they know that a certain Facebook account named John Doe is likely to be a male, between 40 and 50 years old, voted for Trump both in 16 and 20. So what? It's not like you can retarget said account through ads. I fail to see the purpose.

bink 5y ago
In 2016 it was used to target these specific types of people with outrage. Get them riled up against their opponents and make them more likely to vote for your candidate or issues and more likely to spread your propaganda for you. AFAIK you absolutely can target (or could target) groups of people based on very specific criteria.
akersten 5y ago
There is extreme value in knowing who your most-prospective marks are. If you had a population of 1,000 people, and had to sell something (read: convince to vote a certain way) to 400 of them, wouldn't you like to know the subset of those people who are already predisposed to your position and just need a little more nudging with a narrowly-tailored meme , instead of making a dartboard attempt against all 1,000? That was the entire value-add of Cambridge Analytica , whose Facebook-API data-gathering loophole has now been replaced by just engaging suckers via the platform itself and a tiny bit of NLP/sentiment analysis.
- obelos 5y ago
  I suspect there's also value in avoiding showing some forms of persuasive/propagandistic content to those who are unlikely to be amenable to it. This allows the content to circulate with less suppressive feedback from a target's peers.
  - AlexAndScripts 5y ago
    You can also avoid targeting people who already support you. Or, in the case of Cambridge Analytica's brexit manipulation, identify those who have never voted before (using hundreds of indicators) and introduce them to politics... Their first information being propaganda from the leave campaign.
kube-system 5y ago
There's lots of stuff you can do with the data. The most obvious one: with the security question type stuff, you can take over other people's accounts. But collecting data about people is also useful if you're trying to spread an agenda. You can determine what types of messages resonate with an audience. You can group those people and target them separately -- not through ads, but through special interest accounts/groups. You can recruit people to amplify your message. You can even get people to act in real life, i.e. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency#Rallies_and_protests_organized_by_IRA_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency#Ralli... If you can identity, categorize, and influence the loudest voices, you can influence public discussion and opinion.
x0x0 5y ago
You can pull the data off of fb. FB's targeting tools go to some lengths to only allow you to target by dems on fb and associated properties. These questions, plus profile views, allow you to extract the information for external use. Eg selling a list of <fb id, first car, birth year, favorite color, pet name, etc> tuples.
spoonjim 5y ago
The Cambridge Analytica scandal shows exactly what you can do with this data. Targeted advertising lets you run a campaign that never could be run before... one where you appear to be something different to different people. If you were trying to seize control of three different warring groups, you could advertise to A, "We'll kill B and C!" , to B, "We'll kill A and C!" and to C, "We'll kill A and B!" which you couldn't do in a stump speech without people figuring out the ruse. By building a detailed psychological profile of individuals, you can build a model that allows you to tie their responses to these questions with the political messages they're susceptible to. Cambridge Analytica paid a few hundred thousand people to do a quiz where they shared their Facebook likes and answered questions about their personality. CA then used that to build a model that showed "People who live in Slidell, Louisiana and like Dodge Ram trucks will be most receptive to messages about illegal immigration and are generally supportive of state violence". Then they can run that ad to everyone in Slidell who likes Dodge Ram pickups.
- rscoots 5y ago
  Why is targeted political messaging inherently immoral though? It seems the crux of the issue here is that people are being fooled into supplying data about themselves in a non-consentual manner. The former has been happening in politics forever and imo the latter has been every tech companies MO essentially for the last decade.
  - spoonjim 5y ago
    I believe all targeted advertising where you wouldn’t want the ad running on the front page of the New York Times is immoral.
  - Pokepokalypse 5y ago
    It's a tool. Tools are not immoral. Immoral uses of tools are immoral.

bink 5y ago

In 2016 it was used to target these specific types of people with outrage. Get them riled up against their opponents and make them more likely to vote for your candidate or issues and more likely to spread your propaganda for you. AFAIK you absolutely can target (or could target) groups of people based on very specific criteria.

akersten 5y ago

There is extreme value in knowing who your most-prospective marks are. If you had a population of 1,000 people, and had to sell something (read: convince to vote a certain way) to 400 of them, wouldn't you like to know the subset of those people who are already predisposed to your position and just need a little more nudging with a narrowly-tailored meme , instead of making a dartboard attempt against all 1,000? That was the entire value-add of Cambridge Analytica , whose Facebook-API data-gathering loophole has now been replaced by just engaging suckers via the platform itself and a tiny bit of NLP/sentiment analysis.

obelos 5y ago
I suspect there's also value in avoiding showing some forms of persuasive/propagandistic content to those who are unlikely to be amenable to it. This allows the content to circulate with less suppressive feedback from a target's peers.
- AlexAndScripts 5y ago
  You can also avoid targeting people who already support you. Or, in the case of Cambridge Analytica's brexit manipulation, identify those who have never voted before (using hundreds of indicators) and introduce them to politics... Their first information being propaganda from the leave campaign.

kube-system 5y ago

There's lots of stuff you can do with the data. The most obvious one: with the security question type stuff, you can take over other people's accounts. But collecting data about people is also useful if you're trying to spread an agenda. You can determine what types of messages resonate with an audience. You can group those people and target them separately -- not through ads, but through special interest accounts/groups. You can recruit people to amplify your message. You can even get people to act in real life, i.e. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency#Rallies_and_protests_organized_by_IRA_in_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Research_Agency#Ralli... If you can identity, categorize, and influence the loudest voices, you can influence public discussion and opinion.

x0x0 5y ago

You can pull the data off of fb. FB's targeting tools go to some lengths to only allow you to target by dems on fb and associated properties. These questions, plus profile views, allow you to extract the information for external use. Eg selling a list of <fb id, first car, birth year, favorite color, pet name, etc> tuples.

spoonjim 5y ago

The Cambridge Analytica scandal shows exactly what you can do with this data. Targeted advertising lets you run a campaign that never could be run before... one where you appear to be something different to different people. If you were trying to seize control of three different warring groups, you could advertise to A, "We'll kill B and C!" , to B, "We'll kill A and C!" and to C, "We'll kill A and B!" which you couldn't do in a stump speech without people figuring out the ruse. By building a detailed psychological profile of individuals, you can build a model that allows you to tie their responses to these questions with the political messages they're susceptible to. Cambridge Analytica paid a few hundred thousand people to do a quiz where they shared their Facebook likes and answered questions about their personality. CA then used that to build a model that showed "People who live in Slidell, Louisiana and like Dodge Ram trucks will be most receptive to messages about illegal immigration and are generally supportive of state violence". Then they can run that ad to everyone in Slidell who likes Dodge Ram pickups.

rscoots 5y ago
Why is targeted political messaging inherently immoral though? It seems the crux of the issue here is that people are being fooled into supplying data about themselves in a non-consentual manner. The former has been happening in politics forever and imo the latter has been every tech companies MO essentially for the last decade.
- spoonjim 5y ago
  I believe all targeted advertising where you wouldn’t want the ad running on the front page of the New York Times is immoral.
- Pokepokalypse 5y ago
  It's a tool. Tools are not immoral. Immoral uses of tools are immoral.