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Not GP. There are serious objections to masks: they make people more anonymous (which is hard on everyone, but especially kids), they increase carbon dioxide i

Not GP. There are serious objections to masks: they make people more anonymous (which is hard on everyone, but especially kids), they increase carbon dioxide intake, and the ones people generally use may not be effective against something as small as the COVID virus.

bena 5y ago
The COVID virus is 20 nanometers in diameter at its smallest. Carbon Dioxide is one carbon atom and two oxygen atoms. Its diameter is 0.33 nanometers. If a mask increases carbon dioxide intake, then it can stop the COVID virus. If masks are not effective against something as small as the COVID virus, then it wouldn't increase carbon dioxide intake.
- Fellshard 5y ago
  The latter premise is false, as there is still some impedance to exhalation - air is not allowed through completely freely. That is not to say the impedance is great, but it must still be acknowledged that it exists and has an effect on the air breathed, however negligible. The matter, then, is one of 'to what degree', more than 'does or doesn't'.
  - bena 5y ago
    If there is impedance to carbon dioxide, then there must be impedance to COVID. That's what you and the other have missed. Or ignored. You can't argue that it both impedes carbon dioxide, but not COVID. And even if some gets through, it's got to be better than all. I thought we weren't supposed to let perfect be the enemy of good.
    - ghoward 5y ago
      Just because COVID is impeded does not mean the mask is effective. The mask might impede COVID by 1% and carbon dioxide by 0.5%. That means the mask is 99% not effective against COVID, but a model I created [1] shows that even the 0.5% impedance will eventually lead to the mask keeping in half oxygen and half carbon dioxide, leading to higher carbon dioxide inhalation. [1]: https://gavinhoward.com/2020/08/masks-and-carbon-dioxide/ https://gavinhoward.com/2020/08/masks-and-carbon-dioxide/
      - bena 5y ago
        https://www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org/hometown-health/speaking-of-health/debunked-myths-about-face-masks https://www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org/hometown-health/speak... Mayo Clinic disagrees with your program. So of the two options: the Mayo Clinic being wrong, or your assumptions being wrong. I'm going to go with your assumptions being the one that's wrong.
        ghoward 5y ago
        https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/04/data-do-not-back-cloth-masks-limit-covid-19-experts-say https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/04/data-do-...
        bena 5y ago
        How does that refute the fact that the Mayo Clinic says that wearing a mask won't give you hypoxia? Also, what's the date on that article? Because it looks like April 2020. There's been several studies since then, along with just the raw statistical data, that shows masks do help. https://www.npr.org/sections/back-to-school-live-updates/2021/09/10/1035954587/yes-gov-desantis-studies-do-show-masks-curb-covid-19-in-schools https://www.npr.org/sections/back-to-school-live-updates/202...
    - redis_mlc 5y ago
      Your virtue signalling is nothing but repugnant. Any mask under a dollar doesn't work.
- ghoward 5y ago
  To add to the sibling comment, which is correct, I actually created a model [1] that showed that any impedance leads to the air behind a mask eventually stabilizing at half oxygen and half carbon dioxide. This means that any mask will eventually lead to about the same carbon dioxide intake, even if they let air through quite freely. [1]: https://gavinhoward.com/2020/08/masks-and-carbon-dioxide/ https://gavinhoward.com/2020/08/masks-and-carbon-dioxide/
- hirako2000 5y ago
  Best thing when argumenting is to do it for the sake of truth seeking. Not to reinforce whatever beliefs you may have. The difference between filtering out a virus, vs filtering out volumes of a particular substance: all it takes in a tiny amount of the former slipping through the cracks to render the filtering in effective, for the latter, reducing the deserved volume of the necessary substance is enough to make the filtering system have undesirable effects. With the mask we get the worse of both world. Reduced breath, and no stopping infection.
spookthesunset 5y ago
Don’t forget folks who can’t hear have a hell of time functioning. But thanks to covid myopia these problems get gaslight away. Only covid matters to some people… almost literally. Sadly they are the ones in control.

bena 5y ago

The COVID virus is 20 nanometers in diameter at its smallest. Carbon Dioxide is one carbon atom and two oxygen atoms. Its diameter is 0.33 nanometers. If a mask increases carbon dioxide intake, then it can stop the COVID virus. If masks are not effective against something as small as the COVID virus, then it wouldn't increase carbon dioxide intake.

Fellshard 5y ago
The latter premise is false, as there is still some impedance to exhalation - air is not allowed through completely freely. That is not to say the impedance is great, but it must still be acknowledged that it exists and has an effect on the air breathed, however negligible. The matter, then, is one of 'to what degree', more than 'does or doesn't'.
- bena 5y ago
  If there is impedance to carbon dioxide, then there must be impedance to COVID. That's what you and the other have missed. Or ignored. You can't argue that it both impedes carbon dioxide, but not COVID. And even if some gets through, it's got to be better than all. I thought we weren't supposed to let perfect be the enemy of good.
  - ghoward 5y ago
    Just because COVID is impeded does not mean the mask is effective. The mask might impede COVID by 1% and carbon dioxide by 0.5%. That means the mask is 99% not effective against COVID, but a model I created [1] shows that even the 0.5% impedance will eventually lead to the mask keeping in half oxygen and half carbon dioxide, leading to higher carbon dioxide inhalation. [1]: https://gavinhoward.com/2020/08/masks-and-carbon-dioxide/ https://gavinhoward.com/2020/08/masks-and-carbon-dioxide/
    - bena 5y ago
      https://www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org/hometown-health/speaking-of-health/debunked-myths-about-face-masks https://www.mayoclinichealthsystem.org/hometown-health/speak... Mayo Clinic disagrees with your program. So of the two options: the Mayo Clinic being wrong, or your assumptions being wrong. I'm going to go with your assumptions being the one that's wrong.
      - ghoward 5y ago
        https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/04/data-do-not-back-cloth-masks-limit-covid-19-experts-say https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/04/data-do-...
        bena 5y ago
        How does that refute the fact that the Mayo Clinic says that wearing a mask won't give you hypoxia? Also, what's the date on that article? Because it looks like April 2020. There's been several studies since then, along with just the raw statistical data, that shows masks do help. https://www.npr.org/sections/back-to-school-live-updates/2021/09/10/1035954587/yes-gov-desantis-studies-do-show-masks-curb-covid-19-in-schools https://www.npr.org/sections/back-to-school-live-updates/202...
  - redis_mlc 5y ago
    Your virtue signalling is nothing but repugnant. Any mask under a dollar doesn't work.
ghoward 5y ago
To add to the sibling comment, which is correct, I actually created a model [1] that showed that any impedance leads to the air behind a mask eventually stabilizing at half oxygen and half carbon dioxide. This means that any mask will eventually lead to about the same carbon dioxide intake, even if they let air through quite freely. [1]: https://gavinhoward.com/2020/08/masks-and-carbon-dioxide/ https://gavinhoward.com/2020/08/masks-and-carbon-dioxide/
hirako2000 5y ago
Best thing when argumenting is to do it for the sake of truth seeking. Not to reinforce whatever beliefs you may have. The difference between filtering out a virus, vs filtering out volumes of a particular substance: all it takes in a tiny amount of the former slipping through the cracks to render the filtering in effective, for the latter, reducing the deserved volume of the necessary substance is enough to make the filtering system have undesirable effects. With the mask we get the worse of both world. Reduced breath, and no stopping infection.

spookthesunset 5y ago

Don’t forget folks who can’t hear have a hell of time functioning. But thanks to covid myopia these problems get gaslight away. Only covid matters to some people… almost literally. Sadly they are the ones in control.