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They used natural gas as a political lever with Ukraine on a constant basis. The same would be the case with Belarussia if they weren't forcefully aligned as po

They used natural gas as a political lever with Ukraine on a constant basis. The same would be the case with Belarussia if they weren't forcefully aligned as political allies (an attempt at which is one of the main reasons of the Ukrainian invasion).

the-dude 5y ago
Do you have sources Russia used this lever even though all terms of the deal were met? ( basically, the bills were paid ).
- datameta 5y ago
  The gas bills had a strange ability to grow of their own accord, almost seemingly to the whims of the natural gas supplier. On several occasions Russia cut off supply during winter after disputes, which affected not only Ukraine but Europe. This was a two pronged maneuver which was meant to sour Europe-Ukraine relations and keep Ukraine dependent on Russia. Ukraine's attempted aligment with Europe is perhaps the main driver of the 2014 invasion of Ukraine by Russia.
  - the-dude 5y ago
    So you have no sources I presume? And the bills were not paid.
    - nameme274728 5y ago
      (the) dude, relax please, we know you're either a likely Russian state-paid actor hired to sow doubt or severely misinformed
  - anticodon 5y ago
    the main driver of the 2014 invasion of Ukraine by Russia There was no Russian invasion. There was a coup and installation of Nazi government in Ukraine in 2014. Big percent of population in Ukraine is Russian. They do not want to live under Nazi regime that praises Hitler and forbids to speak Russian language. Also, Ukraine has plans to build concentration camps for Russian population. So they decided to leave Ukraine and join Russia.
    - throwaway894345 5y ago
      This is counterfactual, overt propaganda. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Ukrainian_War#2014_annexation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Ukrainian_War#2014_annex...
      - anticodon 5y ago
        Since when Wikipedia has become a source of truth? Well, mate, do you read Russian or Ukrainian? How can you tell me that it is a lie? It is forbidden to speak Russian in Ukraine, because it's an actual Ukrainian law. The law, you know, that was made by Ukrainian government and it is effective and people are fined by the police. Also, Ukraine forbids Russian websites, Russian TV and even burns books in Russian. Please, you know it all (as all westerners): prove that use of Russian is not forbidden in Ukraine. Please, prove that Hitler and nazism is not honored in Ukraine on the government level. There's a yearly parade of SS veterans in Kiev. Every year in the open - everyone can see it!
LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
Some bitch wanted to get rich. Played with the mafia, been a puppet for another player. Abused her position. Vendor of warez blocked even more corruption. Bitch shrieked in frustration. Another player saw his chance. Vendor of warez had enough of the pranks. Disruption... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yulia_Tymoshenko https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yulia_Tymoshenko also see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otpor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otpor
Mikeb85 5y ago
Let's not pretend there was no fuckery on the Ukrainian side. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia%E2%80%93Ukraine_gas_disputes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia%E2%80%93Ukraine_gas_dis...
- throwaway894345 5y ago
  That’s not really the point—the point is that Russia has been observed using its natural gas as political leverage.
anticodon 5y ago
Russia is not obliged to pay Ukrainian bills. They're unreliable partners (both for EU and Russia), they have a history of blackmailing EU with threats to stop gas transit (Ukraine, not Russia threatened EU!), they're stealing transit gas all the time. Besides, they're used as an enemy, as cannon fodder against Russia. Why would Russia feed them using our natural resources? What's our obligation? It's not their gas, it's not their pipeline (it was built by "soviet occupants").

the-dude 5y ago

Do you have sources Russia used this lever even though all terms of the deal were met? ( basically, the bills were paid ).

datameta 5y ago
The gas bills had a strange ability to grow of their own accord, almost seemingly to the whims of the natural gas supplier. On several occasions Russia cut off supply during winter after disputes, which affected not only Ukraine but Europe. This was a two pronged maneuver which was meant to sour Europe-Ukraine relations and keep Ukraine dependent on Russia. Ukraine's attempted aligment with Europe is perhaps the main driver of the 2014 invasion of Ukraine by Russia.
- the-dude 5y ago
  So you have no sources I presume? And the bills were not paid.
  - nameme274728 5y ago
    (the) dude, relax please, we know you're either a likely Russian state-paid actor hired to sow doubt or severely misinformed
- anticodon 5y ago
  the main driver of the 2014 invasion of Ukraine by Russia There was no Russian invasion. There was a coup and installation of Nazi government in Ukraine in 2014. Big percent of population in Ukraine is Russian. They do not want to live under Nazi regime that praises Hitler and forbids to speak Russian language. Also, Ukraine has plans to build concentration camps for Russian population. So they decided to leave Ukraine and join Russia.
  - throwaway894345 5y ago
    This is counterfactual, overt propaganda. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Ukrainian_War#2014_annexation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Ukrainian_War#2014_annex...
    - anticodon 5y ago
      Since when Wikipedia has become a source of truth? Well, mate, do you read Russian or Ukrainian? How can you tell me that it is a lie? It is forbidden to speak Russian in Ukraine, because it's an actual Ukrainian law. The law, you know, that was made by Ukrainian government and it is effective and people are fined by the police. Also, Ukraine forbids Russian websites, Russian TV and even burns books in Russian. Please, you know it all (as all westerners): prove that use of Russian is not forbidden in Ukraine. Please, prove that Hitler and nazism is not honored in Ukraine on the government level. There's a yearly parade of SS veterans in Kiev. Every year in the open - everyone can see it!

LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago

Some bitch wanted to get rich. Played with the mafia, been a puppet for another player. Abused her position. Vendor of warez blocked even more corruption. Bitch shrieked in frustration. Another player saw his chance. Vendor of warez had enough of the pranks. Disruption... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yulia_Tymoshenko https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yulia_Tymoshenko also see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otpor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otpor

Mikeb85 5y ago

Let's not pretend there was no fuckery on the Ukrainian side. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia%E2%80%93Ukraine_gas_disputes https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia%E2%80%93Ukraine_gas_dis...

throwaway894345 5y ago
That’s not really the point—the point is that Russia has been observed using its natural gas as political leverage.

anticodon 5y ago

Russia is not obliged to pay Ukrainian bills. They're unreliable partners (both for EU and Russia), they have a history of blackmailing EU with threats to stop gas transit (Ukraine, not Russia threatened EU!), they're stealing transit gas all the time. Besides, they're used as an enemy, as cannon fodder against Russia. Why would Russia feed them using our natural resources? What's our obligation? It's not their gas, it's not their pipeline (it was built by "soviet occupants").